Fuller Watch

Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 03:07

23 Jan 2018, 22:55 #821

The LDS Consulting Group had a chart showing studios, one and two BR for both 200 market rate and also a different number of studios, one and two BR - if they were affordable.
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

23 Jan 2018, 23:24 #822

Thanks, Leland - I missed that because I skipped the charts, lol.

That makes the report the first I've heard of studio units.  All along the talk was about 1/3 one-bedroom and 2/3 two-bedroom.  I don't know what difference it makes in the big picture anyhow - maybe fewer people in the development or fewer cars?  I think offering some studio units is probably a good thing.
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Joined: 10 Jan 2008, 01:26

24 Jan 2018, 14:56 #823

Has a price been set on what the rents will be for the units?
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Joined: 02 Apr 2011, 03:07

24 Jan 2018, 16:32 #824

Tyu12 - the LDS Report showed preliminary rental rates for market rate and “affordable.”  They’re based on Boston income.

Cathy - I think Dolben should speak up, after all they are most affected by the no/yes affordable units. The construction manager might be effected by the mix/number of studio, 1BR and 2BR BUT it’s a small dollar value lost in the noise,

I found there was no set price for certain developments in Boston. A 3BR could cost 3000/mo and also $1800/mo. In the same building a studio rented for $500. It wasn’t easy finding actual rents.
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Joined: 10 Jan 2008, 01:26

24 Jan 2018, 18:21 #825

Leland33 wrote: Tyu12 - the LDS Report showed preliminary rental rates for market rate and “affordable.”  They’re based on Boston income.

Cathy - I think Dolben should speak up, after all they are most affected by the no/yes affordable units. The construction manager might be effected by the mix/number of studio, 1BR and 2BR BUT it’s a small dollar value lost in the noise,

I found there was no set price for certain developments in Boston.  A 3BR could cost 3000/mo and also $1800/mo.  In the same building a studio rented for $500.  It wasn’t easy finding actual rents.
Maybe it should be brought up at one of the meetings so we know what we are getting into. I would also like to know what they are going to do when they can't fill them.
  I would still like to see the city say no to this and put the 2 schools they want to force on us to go there and be done with the school situation.
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

26 Jan 2018, 19:59 #826





"At the May 7, 2015 City Council Meeting, representatives of the City shared that the 10.67 acres of land at the Fuller Site was valued at $1.65M and the building was valued at approximately $11M."

Those numbers are the City's assessment, available online to the public in the tax records, and do not reflect market value.  The City had a market appraisal done before the RFP was issued, which they have not made public.
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

26 Jan 2018, 20:01 #827



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Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 02:12

26 Jan 2018, 20:04 #828

Just finished reading that letter about 30 seconds ago!  
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

26 Jan 2018, 20:27 #829

Gloucester Housing Authority - 12/13/17 meeting minutes:

http://www.ghama.com/default.aspx?action=open&id=400

Lengthy  discussion about the Fuller project starts on Page 5.

("He" in the discussion is David Houlden, Executive Director of the Housing Authority)

ghadecember.jpg
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

26 Jan 2018, 20:45 #830

ghadecember2.jpg
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

27 Jan 2018, 15:31 #831

"Fuller payment would boost city housing fund sixfold"

http://www.gloucestertimes.com/news/loc ... fbcc3.html


Skewed headline much?

"A $1.5 million payment to Gloucester’s Affordable Housing Trust, in lieu of adhering strictly to the city’s affordable housing mandate on the Fuller School project, would boost the trust’s coffers by more than six times, city figures show.

Yet, members of the board for the city’s affordable housing agency are non-committal in either backing the in-lieu-of payment or calling for 30 affordable units to be built into the 200-unit market-rate rental housing project planned for the Fuller site."

I might argue that the Housing Trust Fund is not "the city’s affordable housing agency."  The Trust members meet a few times a year, as needed, to review projects that they may fund and manage the funds in the Trust.

The Times might also have included a reporting of the Housing Authority's stance.
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Joined: 25 Jun 2007, 22:00

27 Jan 2018, 15:41 #832

When we had a Coalition for Housing and the Homeless, it was:
The Housing Authority
Action
Wellspring
A couple of developers (eg Kirk Noyes)
Banking representatives (eg Bob Gillis)
Religious leaders
and some low income housing and homeless residents
who were active in raising funds and coordinating projects.
I would turn first to the Housing Authority for guidance on this subject, although
I am no longer involved.
It is true that the Housing Authority is more a state than a city agency but that is
not an excuse to imply that the Housing Trust is the agency in charge of low
income and affordable housing in Gloucester. It is the Housing Authority, period.
Don't you see that the whole aim of Newspeak is to narrow the range of thought?...   ..........
 George Orwell , 1984
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Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 02:12

27 Jan 2018, 15:51 #833

It wouldn't be hard to boost the fund considering how small our affordable housing trust is to begin with!  The decision the AHT gets to make is whether to release the funds to a specific project.  The City Council will be the ones determining whether or not the 30 units are required.  I tried to attend the last housing trust meeting but it had been canceled at the last minute.  I have no idea why they meet so seldom compared to other boards...maybe because there isn't enough money in the trust to do anything much.

And yes...the Gloucester Housing Authority (with David Houlden as director) should have very serious consideration of their input.  

I think the AHT comments in the article are appropriate...their job is to be sure the trust money goes to affordable housing. So they would come into play if the 30 units aren't built and Harborlight/YMCA want to use the in lieu of payment toward that.  That would be AHT's decision.
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Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 02:12

27 Jan 2018, 16:00 #834

Here are the notes from the October AHT meeting...they discussed this project (and the Harborlight/YMCA proposal) at length.

https://gloucester-ma.gov/ArchiveCenter ... /Item/8108
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Joined: 25 Jun 2007, 22:00

27 Jan 2018, 16:13 #835

Personal opinion based on personal experience:
A city committee can meet once a month if they have professional
staff actually doing the work. Then it is perhaps enough just to give
periodic guidance.
However if it is a committee of citizens and representatives of city
agencies and anything is to get done, it needs to meet once a week.
Then progress is reported and new tasks assigned. Minutes must
be taken and published immediately so everyone knows what they
are supposed to be doing
If you notice an agency like this trust that only meets once in a while
they are not very serious about getting a job done. If they have not
published an agenda or minutes in years like the Capital Improvements
Advisory Board, they can be assumed to exist in name only.
Don't you see that the whole aim of Newspeak is to narrow the range of thought?...   ..........
 George Orwell , 1984
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

27 Jan 2018, 16:46 #836

The Housing Trust does post agendas and meeting minutes.

They generally meet when there is an application for Housing Trust funding to consider and to review projects they have funded.

As Karly wrote, the function of the Housing Trust is to oversee and disperse Housing Trust Funds to eligible projects.

I'm not sure why the Times would look to the Trust for their position on the Fuller issue but not the Housing Authority.  </sarcasm> 
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Joined: 03 Sep 2017, 12:41

27 Jan 2018, 21:25 #837

Just wondering why developers not taking a look at the property that just went up for sale next door,the old junkyard parcel, around 9 acres direct access to Rt. 128 and no building to take down  price around 1.6 Mil.
I still can't imagine what the area is going to be like if all this stuff gets built.The traffic around the rotary now and worst in the summer will  be unbelievable.I live in Riverdale and in the summer I travel through town to get to East Gloucester or Rockport especially on a beach day.
I remember a number of years ago when builder Jack Cahill wanted to build single-family houses on the Gloucester Crossing parcel and was turned down,the uproar and all the problems presented with traffic and all kinds of other excuses that finally defeated his project,Mr. Cahill ended  up selling to Sam Parks and got out look what we are going to have now.
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Joined: 25 Jun 2007, 22:00

27 Jan 2018, 22:51 #838

I assume there are cleanup problems on the old Linsky junkyard property. However it turns out that the Fuller property is also an environmental problem so I am not sure which is worse. You may well have a good point.
I had pretty much forgotten about the Cahill upscale housing proposal. It looks modest now :)
Don't you see that the whole aim of Newspeak is to narrow the range of thought?...   ..........
 George Orwell , 1984
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Joined: 13 Aug 2005, 09:30

29 Jan 2018, 21:33 #839

Cathy (Admin) wrote: There is an ordinance:


"(2) Cash Contribution: With authorization by the City Council or Planning Board as described above, developers may make a cash payment in lieu of affordable units to the Gloucester Affordable Housing Trust Fund as outlined below:


For rental units, the financial contribution for each affordable unit shall be equal to the difference between the average market rental price for the market-rate units in the subject development and the rent affordable to an income-eligible household as defined by this ordinance and HUD, calculated over a term of ten (10) years."


This is all making me tired, lol.  I get the argument about the greater good - jobs and property tax revenue on a currently stagnant property.

What annoys me is the spin, contradictions and irony.

The Y will not be paying property taxes on their piece.  Jobs - construction jobs, sure.  Any guarantee that it will be local folks?  No.

I'm a huge fan of the Y and their programs and anyone who chooses a career path as a Y employee gets a high five from me.  Can those employees afford to live here?  I don't think so.  How many jobs will the residential and retail create that will attract people who can afford to live here?

And then back to "there is an ordinance" and who gets a pass.  I feel like the residential guys are using the passionate community support for the Y to cut themselves a slick deal.
May 3, 2017
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Joined: 20 Feb 2010, 02:12

30 Jan 2018, 01:07 #840

I went to the P & D meeting.  In addition to the hardship reviewer and developer, Jim Destino spoke and offered that the city would be willing to re-open discussions with the developer on linking the Middle Street units officially with the project.  Paul Lundberg also asked if the developer would like to consider the Middle St option as offsite units in lieu of (one of the two hardship options).  There was not a vote on hardship.  The P & D subcommittee referred it to the full council to vote on sending it back to the city for further negotiations which seemed OK with the developer as well.  Jason was there so maybe he can add more.
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