Leviathan Wakes (WARNING: Spoilers)

bilki
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Joined: March 19th, 2008, 3:46 pm

January 13th, 2016, 4:34 am #1

Let's just give the series its own thread. We could start each post with a page numbers included, or spoiler them. Whichever you all think is easier.

I read Julie's prologue chapter, then skipped to Chapter 15: Holden (page 152) because I needed to know what was going to happen after episode 4 of the show.

Should I go back and read what I skipped over, KMI? :P
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KMInfinity
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Joined: March 17th, 2008, 1:09 am

January 13th, 2016, 11:05 pm #2

I'm up to p. 320. I am actually surprised by how engaged I am given I just recently watched a lot of the plot unfold in the show. I'll add some details/differences with show/questions after dinner.

:-)
“You want weapons? We’re in a library! Books! The best weapons in the world!” — The Doctor, S2E2
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tgir
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Joined: March 16th, 2008, 3:36 am

January 14th, 2016, 2:41 am #3

My copy is supposed to arrive tomorrow, so I'll catch up in a couple of days. I've watched 3 episodes...
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KMInfinity
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Joined: March 17th, 2008, 1:09 am

January 14th, 2016, 2:54 am #4

bilki wrote:Let's just give the series its own thread. We could start each post with a page numbers included, or spoiler them. Whichever you all think is easier.

I read Julie's prologue chapter, then skipped to Chapter 15: Holden (page 152) because I needed to know what was going to happen after episode 4 of the show.

Should I go back and read what I skipped over, KMI? :P
Did you read forward from p. 152, or just that chapter? If you read forward, you should just keep going...


So, in general I think the book is terrific in its own way, better than the show in character development, but though the descriptive world building is excellent, the show's visuals are awesome given syfy's usual.

One big BIG difference for me is in Miller's character. IMO I think he's much more nuanced and sympathetic in the book. His motives and thinking are complex yet understandable. The "twist" when he realizes his self delusions are poignant.

One "show wins" is in how well they flashed back to the Anderson Station. This was pretty cut-and-dried in the books, background/complexity for Fred Johnson. The show made me care about those rebels and their kids, and pretty quickly captured a whole range of emotions when it was clear their fates were doomed. Another is in the portrayal of the Donnager crew and ship, especially Adm. Yao

Some smaller criticisms and differences:

--I didn't realize for a few chapters that we would be limited in viewpoint to only Holden and Miller. Not sure that I like that style of storytelling. I know it's "easy" and I guess writers look down on it? but I like omniscient 3rd person multiple POV.

--So much more detail explaining the social and political dynamics. The worldbuilding is truly impressive.

--The book makes it clear Holden and his crew are ordered by their employers to cooperate with the Martian navy. It wasn't some random connection. That makes the show feel more coincidental and manipulated, imo. But I guess that also increased suspense. Yet, I think the show lost something by emphasizing the hostility and fear Holden and crew face when on the Donneger, instead of the rapidly developing camaraderie between them as the Martian team sacrifices their lives to get Holden out safely wso he can exonerate the MCRN..

--The book almost immediately gives positive background for Fred Johnson. How he ended the Pallas Colony miner revolt peacefully. And later, spins his relationship with Holden differently. The book develops trust and respect between them whereas the show has them essentially coercing each other to gain their ends. Holden GIVES fred the data cube, in the show Fred sneaks it off the El Tee's corpse.

*********************to Ch.11.

Have you reached Eros yet, Bilki? That should be E7 or E8. The show feels rushed, getting from Tycho and Fred to Eros. I'd be lost and thinking the show was back to being confusing if I hadn't read... But I think folks are right who say the first season will not cover the entire 1st book.



Good review of the book: http://kellyjensenwrites.com/2013/08/28 ... han-wakes/ "James S.A. Corey is the combined pseudonym of Daniel Abraham (Long Price Quartet) and Ty Franck (serial collaborator). One is responsible for Miller, the other for Holden." Well!
“You want weapons? We’re in a library! Books! The best weapons in the world!” — The Doctor, S2E2
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bilki
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Joined: March 19th, 2008, 3:46 pm

January 14th, 2016, 4:51 am #5

wrote:Did you read forward from p. 152, or just that chapter?
I'm finished. Probably the fastest I've ever read a book that size. It was hard for me to put it down when it was time for bed, lol.
wrote:One big BIG difference for me is in Miller's character. IMO I think he's much more nuanced and sympathetic in the book. His motives and thinking are complex yet understandable. The "twist" when he realizes his self delusions are poignant.
Agreed! Even with skipping the first 150 pages, I liked Miller as soon as I started reading. That hadn't happened with the show. And when I realized he had fallen in love with Julie, it endeared me to him even more. I suppose the show thinks it needs to make things more dramatic but I like how his love for Julie was recognized by the bartender (right?) in the book. No big announcements by Anderson Dawes. Miller played his cards closer to his vest in book, I thought.
wrote:The book develops trust and respect between them whereas the show has them essentially coercing each other to gain their ends. Holden GIVES fred the data cube, in the show Fred sneaks it off the El Tee's corpse.
I was disappointed how the show made it more antagonistic between them because I enjoyed how it played out in the book.

The Rocinante crew feels more like a cohesive unit in the book. I think the show would benefit from a greater sense of comradery between them.

The Eros incident is what made me go :eek:

I loved how Naomi handled Holden's confession after he woke up from their escape from Eros.

It's funny how the show sucked me into this world but now I see it as inferior after reading the book. But I'm so bad at visualizing that it's cool to see things like Tycho Station and the ships. I'm looking forward to see how the Eros incident will look on screen, especially the scene in the bathtub.

Curious to hear what you think of how things play out at Thoth station, KMI. And looking forward to tgir joining the conversation!

Didn't someone else get a copy of the book?
Last edited by bilki on January 14th, 2016, 5:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Krystal
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Joined: June 26th, 2009, 4:32 am

January 14th, 2016, 4:24 pm #6

The book is on my Kindle and I will start it as soon as I finish my current book. I am reading John Grisham's Rogue Lawyer and it is a real page turner. I usually read on the stepper at the gym and before I go to bed, however there's been a lot of noise and distraction at the gym and I've been putting my headphones on and watching whatever crap is on television if its too noisy because I don't like to read a good book and be distracted.
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KMInfinity
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Joined: March 17th, 2008, 1:09 am

January 15th, 2016, 1:53 am #7

wrote:The Rocinante crew feels more like a cohesive unit in the book. I think the show would benefit from a greater sense of comradery between them.
Yes! They are still suspicious of each other on the show. In the book, it's clearly stated and shown how they've bonded, and how much they respect Holden, and how much Holden puts them first, sees his mission as making sure this last part of the cant's crew survives.
wrote:The Eros incident is what made me go :eek:
Me too! In a good way. Very tight action writing, lots of character moments.

I laughed out loud when Holden and Miller meet, and then hide out in the tunnel, making plans, and Naomi says, "You too are going to be very bad for each other..." LOLOL
wrote:I loved how Naomi handled Holden's confession after he woke up from their escape from Eros.
I liked that she clearly loves him and is clearly keeping her distance.

There's a lot of chatter from booksters on TWOP 's Book VS Show thread about Ade, who I've already forgotten, and how the relationship between Holden and naomi isn't holding up well in the show. Implied are long LONG term spoilers.
wrote:It's funny how the show sucked me into this world but now I see it as inferior after reading the book. But I'm so bad at visualizing that it's cool to see things like Tycho Station and the ships.
I am going to try very hard to honor the show, but yeah the book is dynamite. I do like the visuals so that will help.
wrote: I'm looking forward to see how the Eros incident will look on screen, especially the scene in the bathtub.
Gulp. Though I suspected pretty early from the Julie prologue what the score was. The show kept Julie's scene more ambiguous.
wrote:Curious to hear what you think of how things play out at Thoth station, KMI. And looking forward to tgir joining the conversation!
I'll finish this weekend. Book two on order. :-)


Last edited by KMInfinity on January 15th, 2016, 1:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
“You want weapons? We’re in a library! Books! The best weapons in the world!” — The Doctor, S2E2
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KMInfinity
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Joined: March 17th, 2008, 1:09 am

January 15th, 2016, 2:10 am #8

Also...

do you think the show will end before the book? Maybe a season cliffhanger in that bathtub? E6 seemed rushed at Tycho and I can't decide. I'd rather they explore the book(s) leisurely, and develop the characters. Let those big plot moments breathe.
“You want weapons? We’re in a library! Books! The best weapons in the world!” — The Doctor, S2E2
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bilki
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Joined: March 19th, 2008, 3:46 pm

January 15th, 2016, 4:00 am #9

With 4 episodes left...
[+] Spoiler
I could see the show ending the season with them escaping Eros, then next season would open with Miller and Holden recuperating in the sick bay. But with the way the show changed it to Holden taking the Roci to some coordinates, and not directly to Eros, maybe they will stretch it to finding Julie in the bathtub? That would be a good cliffhanger, I think.
wrote:There's a lot of chatter from booksters on TWOP 's Book VS Show thread about Ade, who I've already forgotten, and how the relationship between Holden and naomi isn't holding up well in the show.
Yes, I saw them talking about how Ade wasn't Caucasian in the book.


It amused me how I started seeing the show actors who play Naomi and Amos as I was reading the book but didn't do the same with Miller and Holden. Sometimes I would see Steven Strait when they would reference Holden's good looks but I didn't see Miller as Thomas Jane. I would read Fred Johnson's lines in the accent that Jared Harris uses for Dawes, which I never figured out.
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tgir
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Joined: March 16th, 2008, 3:36 am

January 15th, 2016, 5:39 am #10

My copy arrived! Hope to be caught up by the end of the weekend.
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