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Hollis .450 Snider

Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 2nd, 2006, 9:42 am #1

Guys, I now have three Sniders - a 2 band mkIII, a .380 rook - and today I got a .450 Hollis carbine!
I think it is chambered in .450 rifle No.1. it has a good bore and action (mk III type), but the stock has been broken at the wrist & repaired with three brass strips. It should make a good shooter. I will try to post a photo in next few days.

Any hints on making cases would be appreciated! I am told you can cut down .45-70.

cheers,

Steve
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Bulletproof
Sergeant Major
Bulletproof
Sergeant Major
Joined: December 6th, 2002, 9:26 am

April 2nd, 2006, 6:01 pm #2

I have not clueon cases but I thought that the 450 #1 musket? had a 500 base diameter so 45/70 cases would not work.

Hope you get some pics up soon. It sound like you found a great rifle.

Brett
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Ian
Veteran of the Regiment
Ian
Veteran of the Regiment
Joined: March 18th, 2002, 1:27 am

April 2nd, 2006, 6:21 pm #3

Crusty , depending on which chambering .43 Spanish brass might be the closest. and a .43Mauser bullet if it's not too long for the twist. pictures for us and a chamber cast . cheers Ian.It's not so much the size of the hole but where it is
It's not so much the size of the hole but where it is
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Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Joined: April 17th, 2002, 7:29 am

April 2nd, 2006, 11:10 pm #4

According to Howell, the W.R. .450 #1 Carbine, Musket and Express use the 0.576" or 0.577" base, as does the #2 Musket.
Looks like a 24 ga parent.
Only the chamber cast knows.
Cheers from Rainy California,
Ross
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JTCoyote
Sergeant
JTCoyote
Sergeant
Joined: December 22nd, 2005, 7:41 am

April 2nd, 2006, 11:32 pm #5

Ross,

Actually, it is 32 guage... it is one of the miriad 500/450 cartridges that the Brits were so fond of... -- Just The Coyot
-- Just The Coyoté
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Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Joined: April 17th, 2002, 7:29 am

April 3rd, 2006, 12:34 am #6

Coyot,
You are right, of course. My 32's here measure close to 0.568".
Unfortunately .348's are still smaller.
Best regards from Darkest California,
Ross
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Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 3rd, 2006, 3:17 am #7

I got hold of one original round, I will try & post a photo of rifle & cartridge tonight with measurements of cartridge. The guy who sold me the rifle said he has used 45-70.

I will also try to slug the bore.

I paid $NZ 470, about US $285. not sure if it was a good deal, but every time I walked past the table it called my name.
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Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 3rd, 2006, 9:32 am #8

Hi,

here are the three Snider cartridges,

.380 (or maybe .360 No.5), .450 No.1, .577



Cartridge dimensions are:

Rim .575 + .050 thick
Base .525
Length 1.5
Neck .478
Bullet dia about .45

Regards,

Steve
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MichaelNH
Veteran of the Regiment
MichaelNH
Veteran of the Regiment
Joined: March 16th, 2002, 2:59 am

April 3rd, 2006, 10:03 am #9

Steve,

You need to crop the image. There's a lot of white space around the picture. I can crop if for you to repost if you need me to.

Very nice little rifle. Now I have to add another caliber to the Hollis Sniders on my "wish list".

Cheers,

Michael
Nitakupa ng'ombe watatu kwa mke wako.

Inachukua kijiji kumpiga mtoto.
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Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 3rd, 2006, 9:33 pm #10

Hollis Snider



Top view

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JTCoyote
Sergeant
JTCoyote
Sergeant
Joined: December 22nd, 2005, 7:41 am

April 11th, 2006, 6:52 am #11

Crusty ,

This is a unique .45 cartridge to be sure... It is not a 500/450 #1 Carbine that is a fact... given the numbers you quote, the closest thing I can find in my books is a 45/50 Peabody sporting...

Yours..........500/450 #1 carb.......45/50 Peabody sporting

Rim .575............ .657....................... .634
Base .525.......... .571........................ .516
Length 1.5........ 1.53....................... 1.53
Neck .478.......... .478....................... .478
Bullet dia .45..... .454 (380gr.)........... .454 (290 & 380gr.)

I would say that you have a round that is very close to the 45/50 Peabody except for its slightly larger base diameter... the bullets are all paper patched 2 wrap... the lead diameter is .443" diameter for the Peabody, and .450" to .453" for the #1 Carbine... both are loaded with 50 to 55 grains of black powder.

-- Just The Coyot
-- Just The Coyoté
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Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 11th, 2006, 9:24 pm #12

Thanks Coyote.

The only reference I can find on the web is at municion.org, but there is only photos, no data.

I will try cutting down 45-70 brass, as this is the nearest I can find. This weekend I will try to check the twist & slug the bore.

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Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Ross95966
Sergeant Major
Joined: April 17th, 2002, 7:29 am

April 11th, 2006, 10:39 pm #13

Mack: Cartridge Case Measurements, (Unpaginated, in the By Head Size chapter)
.450 Kangaroo Rifle
Rim .576" - 14.63mm
Head .525" - 13.33mm
Neck .479" - 12.16mm
Length 1.500 - 14.91mm
Bullet .456" - 11.58mm

The case rather resembles the longer Spanish Remington Carbine. Reformado cases might serve as donor parents, though rim thickness would have to be addressed.
Cheers from Darkest California,
Ross
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JTCoyote
Sergeant
JTCoyote
Sergeant
Joined: December 22nd, 2005, 7:41 am

April 11th, 2006, 11:10 pm #14

Ross,

You nailed it!...

Now finding Spanish Reformado Basic cases... sounds like a job for Rocky Mountain Cartridge Co. to me... or you could turn the base of 348 Winchester cases down .028" and the rim down about .034" and use them... Have made Reformado cartridges this way in the past...-- Just The Coyot
-- Just The Coyoté
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Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Crusty
Colour Sergeant
Joined: November 1st, 2002, 8:18 am

April 12th, 2006, 12:40 am #15

Amazing stuff!

Now getting .348 Winchester cases in New Zealand might be interesting! I have just called my local company "Reloaders Supplies Ltd", they don't stock them. Getting brass out of the U.S. is difficult due to export restrictions.

I will try Bertram in Australia - does anyone know if they have a website?

Thanks, Steve
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tomd461
O/R
Joined: July 26th, 2017, 12:03 am

July 26th, 2017, 12:03 am #16

I have one masde by Cowles of London called "Colonial Gun".  Good to shoot. (Serial numbeer 371) .45 calibre  Use a .44 magnum case cut to size and the rim filed down so the case will load , primer to suit, cannot remember which primer I used.  fIll with  FFF and a .45 lead ball.. 

 
Last edited by tomd461 on July 26th, 2017, 12:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
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