Glastonbury 1971 tape?

Joined: 2:26 PM - Dec 02, 2013

1:30 AM - Jun 12, 2014 #1

I was conversing with a fellow trader recently and we got talking about the 1971 Glastonbury set that somehow never managed to see the light of day.

My understanding is that when asked to submit a live track to the Revelation album, Bowie didn't like the fact that it was just him and his guitar up on stage, instead recording a new version of The Supermen for the compilation.

The tapes whereabouts of the show is no longer known. Does this mean Bowie has managed to get the copy or did it end up with Defries? Has it ever been leaked into the collectors circle?

A Rykodisc rep mentioned it in an interview from 1989, along with the "hundreds of hours worth of studio and live material stored in David's New Jersey warehouse." which lead me to assume that Bowie does have a copy. I wonder if, when going through his archives for the Bowie Is.... exhibit did the people granted permission to garner the material come into contact with the master tapes and so forth? Wouldn't it be fantastic if Bowie issued this long lost concert set with his own liner notes?

Surely the time has come for Bowie to allow the long serving and loyal fans an opportunity to hear some of this material before too long?
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Joined: 12:53 AM - Apr 09, 2005

9:30 AM - Jun 12, 2014 #2

The tape of this show DOES exist and it's owned by a guy called Jake Riviera, who started Stiff Records way back in the mid 70s. There was talk of it fairly recently, I'll see if I can remember where, but it hasn't been circulated as yet.

Mist.
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Joined: 2:26 PM - Dec 02, 2013

6:40 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #3

Makes you wonder what point it serves by this guy keeping it in his private collection? I just don't understand these people who sit on rare recordings for decades whilst they wank themselves off every 12 months or so when they pull the recording out for a listen.

Say this guy dies and the tape gets lost forever? What is he waiting for anyway? Someone to pay him a shed load of money?
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Joined: 2:58 AM - Oct 07, 2010

7:16 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #4

Fuck all the private collectors. We'll never hear this tape, or the cyclops demo.
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Joined: 8:44 AM - Jul 25, 2012

7:29 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #5

Makes you wonder what point it serves by this guy keeping it in his private collection? I just don't understand these people who sit on rare recordings for decades whilst they wank themselves off every 12 months or so when they pull the recording out for a listen.

Say this guy dies and the tape gets lost forever? What is he waiting for anyway? Someone to pay him a shed load of money?
The album Revelations - A Musical Anthology for Glastonbury Fayre contained the following in the sleevenotes - "the live tapes recorded at the festival will remain in the vaults until the revolution".
It was Charles Shaar Murray and Roy Carr, in their 1980 book The Illustrated David Bowie, who jokily attribute the sleevenotes to Jake Riviera (later the boss of Stiff records).
I think that over the years it's been assumed that Shaar Murray and Carr's throwaway comment means that Riviera actually has the tapes, when, as far as I can tell, there is nothing definite to prove this.
I wonder where the tapes actually are these days? What had you heard Mist?
Last edited by rja1967 on 7:34 PM - Jun 12, 2014, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: 8:06 PM - Sep 14, 2007

7:49 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #6

There is a snippet of Bombers from the tape doing the rounds.
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Joined: 3:18 PM - Jul 11, 2004

8:09 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #7

The last edition of Nick Pegg's The Complete David Bowie book has a description of this recording - see the entry in the 'Live' section of the book, as well as the individual song entries.
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Joined: 12:53 AM - Apr 09, 2005

8:16 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #8

The album Revelations - A Musical Anthology for Glastonbury Fayre contained the following in the sleevenotes - "the live tapes recorded at the festival will remain in the vaults until the revolution".
It was Charles Shaar Murray and Roy Carr, in their 1980 book The Illustrated David Bowie, who jokily attribute the sleevenotes to Jake Riviera (later the boss of Stiff records).
I think that over the years it's been assumed that Shaar Murray and Carr's throwaway comment means that Riviera actually has the tapes, when, as far as I can tell, there is nothing definite to prove this.
I wonder where the tapes actually are these days? What had you heard Mist?
Right, this is a distant, unclear memory just now, but I'll sort it eventually. It was something I saw fairly recently on TV, maybe a year ago featuring something about Stiff Records and Jake Riviera was being interviewed and specifically mentioned that he had the recording. I vaguely remember him giving a reason why it wasn't released. Like I say, I can't recall when, or the TV programme or channel I was watching but it was definitely in English which means it was likely I saw it on British TV last year. Maybe a documentary about Stiff Records? That's ringing a bell somewhere.

Mist.
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Joined: 8:21 PM - Oct 11, 2003

8:17 PM - Jun 12, 2014 #9

The last edition of Nick Pegg's The Complete David Bowie book has a description of this recording - see the entry in the 'Live' section of the book, as well as the individual song entries.
...just beat me to it!

I was also going to say... the tape absolutely DOES exist, as Nick Pegg has heard it!

I think it was also mentioned around the time of the "Glastonbury" movie that came out a few years ago... like... someone wanted to use a part of the recording....?
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

9:42 PM - Jul 09, 2017 #10

Right, this is a distant, unclear memory just now, but I'll sort it eventually. It was something I saw fairly recently on TV, maybe a year ago featuring something about Stiff Records and Jake Riviera was being interviewed and specifically mentioned that he had the recording. I vaguely remember him giving a reason why it wasn't released. Like I say, I can't recall when, or the TV programme or channel I was watching but it was definitely in English which means it was likely I saw it on British TV last year. Maybe a documentary about Stiff Records? That's ringing a bell somewhere.

Mist.
Barry Everitt was one of a group called Revelation Records who recorded the festival and put out the original triple vinyl package, beautifully packaged by the late legendary Barney Bubbles. In recent years he has been working with colleagues to try and reissue not only the original albums but also other material that has never seen the light of day before. Much of that material is mastered and rights have been obtained.

Barry has the only known copy of the audio of Bowie's performance. He has already spent years trying to get permission from Bowie's people to release the tracks. This would be the key to getting the whole package funded and out on the streets.

Back in the day Bowie's record company or management did not want the tracks released because they were getting ready to promote Ziggy Stardust. They let Revelation use 'Supermen' on the album instead.

The album notes include the following comment after David's track listing: 'The live tape recording at Glastonbury will remain in our vaults until the revolution.'
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Joined: 11:50 AM - Sep 10, 2006

1:16 AM - Jul 10, 2017 #11

Maybe he should just release it as a bootleg? My concern is that if Bowie's people get hold of the tape then they will shove it away in the never to be heard pile.

I just don't trust Bowie's people at all.
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

1:58 AM - Jul 10, 2017 #12

you are right.the only rare material that i got i received from fans, official releases are shit like the Gouster album
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Joined: 12:26 AM - Aug 20, 2005

1:02 AM - Mar 19, 2018 #13

A bit more info here:

BOWIE AT GLASTONBURY 1971

http://hqinfo.blogspot.co.uk/2016/01/bo ... -1971.html
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Joined: 9:49 AM - Apr 20, 2012

11:27 AM - Mar 19, 2018 #14

Can anyone clear up once and for all whether Bowie performed on his own or as a duo with Mick Ronson?
I've heard both claims many times.
Given the acoustic gigs that Bowie and Ronson played as a duo in 1971, it would make sense - but there's so many conflicting claims.  
Ronson was definitely there (many years later he said 'I hated Glastonbury'!), but it doesn't mean he was on stage -
Dana Gillespie was also there and she definitely didn't appear with Bowie, so...? 
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

9:42 PM - Jul 27, 2018 #15

Good story about Glastonbury 1971 here, including Bowie's appearance, and even his journey there! 😀

https://www-telegraph-co-uk.cdn.ampproj ... nd-mich%2F
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

10:20 PM - Jul 27, 2018 #16

I've heard that some fans got this in bad quality, but It Will remain unreleased forever, because got 2 unreleased songs
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Joined: 8:13 AM - Jul 22, 2018

2:27 AM - Jul 28, 2018 #17

I wonder how many are still around who were actually there at that dawn performance.

Everyone goes on about the Ziggys last stand farewell gig, but I reckon actually being at the dawn Glastonbury performance is way cooler.
SHHWEEET! IS....A self confessed, radicalised David Bowie knob ha! ha! I’m in good company. Let’s all celebrate together.
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Joined: 4:18 PM - Oct 20, 2004

12:26 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #18

A Bowie @ Glastonbury set containing both gigs would have been something to have. Record Store Day......
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

1:19 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #19

Some information on Glastonbury 1971.

The full line-up -

Date Tuesday, June 22, 1971 - Saturday, June 26, 1971
  • Worthy Farm, Pilton, England
  • Tuesday, June 22, 1971
    Fairport Convention
    John Martyn
    Melanie
    Quintessence
    Skin Alley
    Traffic

    Wednesday, June 23, 1971
    David Bowie
    Hawkwind

    Thursday, June 24, 1971
    Arthur Brown's Kingdom Come
    Edgar Broughton Band
    Gilberto Gil
    Henry Cow
    Linda Lewis
    Pink Fairies
    Third Ear Band

    Friday, June 25, 1971
    Brinsley Schwarz
    Mighty Baby
https://www.setlist.fm/festival/1971/gl ... 6bf1b.html

There is always the possibility that fans of any of these bands might have photos, recollections, or recordings of the event. A slim chance, of course, but it's possible.

Bowie's set.

David Bowie . 6-23-71
Solo performance :vocals, guitar, keyboards.
  • Oh! You Pretty Things
  • Kooks
  • Changes
  • Amsterdam
  • The Supermen
  • Memory Of A Free Festival
  • Song For Bob Dylan .
[sic - as we know, Bombers was also performed, + there's rumours It's going to rain again was performed, but this is unconfirmed]

    Bowie was originally scheduled to go onstage on the 22nd, but as usual , the timeline was shot to hell and Bowie eventually performed this brief set on the 23rd at dawn. Although he was supposed to play solo, he was joined on harmonies briefly by a tripped out scandanavian lady who felt like joining in (much to Bowie's amusement ).
    Mysteriously, he is completely left out of the film,( perhaps he did not give permission for his performnace to be used ) but there is a still an outside chance that his set is mouldering somewhere in a vault waiting to be discovered .

Julain Temple throws light on why Bowie wasn't in the film

“Yeah, he is wonderful, David Bowie. The Holy Grail would have been footage of him at the first one, because I saw that. When he performed in ’71 it was very early in the morning. I was asleep and this big bloke shook me awake, saying, ‘Wake up, you got to see this guy’, and the whole festival, which was much smaller then, was waking each other up saying, ‘You’ve got to see this guy.’ So it was the moment, or a moment, when everyone was turned on to what Bowie really was. He’d had Space Oddity a few years before as a one-off, freak, novelty type hit, but he wasn’t a star at all. And there he was in a dress, long hair, and just a guitar, sun coming up . . . it was magical. So if there had been footage of that . . . There is sound of it, actually. I don’t know why we couldn’t use it.”

http://www.ukrockfestivals.com/glas71-bowie.html

Comment re Bombers being performed -

"Greetings,
Deepinder, Mighty Baby fan here after a long hiatus.
Bowie performed 'Bombers' during that solo performance in 1971. I know this as Geronimo had a Show Reel on their website several years ago in which a snippet of Bowie can be heard. I had not heard the lyric before and it emeraged that the song which was not released on Hunky Dory was performed at gigs in 1971, the BBC concert which gets an airing occasionally has this song in the set,
If you need futher clarification I'm sure Chris Bent at Geronimo website will confirm all details."

http://www.ukrockfestivals.com/glasto-7 ... tions.html

"Whilst you can't find a poster to the 1971 edition of the festival, you may know that David Bowie was amongst the stars performing that year. This was also the year that the Pyramid Stage made its first appearance at the festival.

Read more at https://www.nme.com/festivals/glastonbu ... Zp1zmLZ.99"

The road (or rail) to Glastonbury...

"Bowie and his wife Angie, who had evidently found someone to park their three-week-old son on, made their way to Glastonbury by train, alighting at a remote country station and then attempting to walk to the festival site. This was made more difficult by the costume he had decided upon for the day, which was Oxford bags, unsuitable shoes and a Three Musketeers hat.
David Bowie with wife Angie and one month old son Zowie on the 29th June 1971, a week after he played at Glastonbury  Credit: Ron Burton /Mirrorpix
Bowie was supposed to go on in the early evening of Tuesday the 22nd but delays and Kerr’s fear of the neighbours complaining about noise meant that he didn’t appear until dawn the following day. He performed as a duet with Ronson, unveiling most of the songs from Hunky Dory for the first time. He had already started recording this at Trident Studios in Soho. He played the song that was a hit for Peter Noone, 'Kooks’, the song inspired by the birth of the child Zowie they had left behind, 'Changes’ and 'Song For Bob Dylan’. Arabella Churchill remembers his performance of 'Memory Of A Free Festival’, which unfolded as the sun came over the hill to warm those who had endured a night on the cold hard ground, as a particularly magical moment. The song had been inspired by a far less grand occasion which had taken place a couple of years earlier on a recreation ground in Croydon.
David Bowie at Glastonbury in 1971 Credit: Gabi Pape
That Sunday evening as Bowie was travelling back by train, his platforms no doubt hurting as the feather in his hat was doubtless drooping, Radio One broadcast the In Concert show he had recorded the week before. It felt to Bowie and his retinue, which included Dana Gillespie, his manager Tony Defries and his publisher Bob Grace, as though things might be finally falling into place."

https://www-telegraph-co-uk.cdn.ampproj ... nd-mich%2F

We need to add more to this.

Perhaps one of the Bowie fans who runs a blog and likes doing that sort of thing (i.e. more than I do firing off random posts like this) fancies adding a Bowie at Glastonbury page :)
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

1:56 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #20

Fantastic research Stranger !according Nicholas Pegg ,he heard this performance , It's Gonna Rain and I'd like a big Girl with a couple of melons was played too.
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

3:03 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #21

re research, I just checked one of the links from earlier in the thread. It reminded me how I once read that an audience recording of the Beckenham Festival 1969 Bowie performance was made, and left in a flat owned by Guy Stevens' mum when the guy who made it moved. Long shot barely covers this thought, but it got me thinking what if Ian Hunter had a copy of that tape (Guy Stevens was Mott's producer in the early 70's), but then a tape left in a flat his mum owned, long shot barely covers that possibility... :(
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

4:26 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #22

I can understand some fans keep Studio outtakes in his archives, without share with us, but this concert could be shared.
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

10:16 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #23

Set list compiled from the surviving and uncirculated tapes:
David Bowie at Glastonbury, dawn 23 June 1971 recorded in stereo. John & Frank of Geronimo Starship, as mentioned in the Glastonbury Fayre booklet, already had authorised recording equipment set up under the stage.
First song/songs unknown David finally appeared on stage at dawn. John races down the hill to operate the recording equipment. One, maybe two songs (or perhaps none) were missed... titles unknown.
The Supermen First few bars missing
Quicksand announcement recorded for Quicksand but sadly not on tape
Changes solo organ accompaniment. At the end David cannot believe 'how cold I am... plonking away at everything in sight whether it be white or black''.
I'd like a big girl with a couple of melons The original lyrics to a song which eventually morphed into 'Pretty Things'. Unintentional (and unwanted, but treated with great respect) accompaniment from a spaced out Scandinavian lady.
Oh! You Pretty Things at this time the 'big hit' song had only been recorded by Peter Noone (Herman's Hermits)
Kooks First bars only then tape reel ends... We do however hear a lengthy intro referring to the recent baby...
It's Gonna Rain Again New tape reel, first few bars may be missing. Possibly the only known recording of this song?
Memory Of A Free Festival 'I just want to say that you've given me more pleasure than I've had in a good few months of working, and I don't do gigs any more because I got so pissed off with working and dying a death every time I worked and it's really nice to have somebody appreciate me for a change'
Amsterdam .'..for my own liking, one of the best social observers of his climate and the particular area that he lived in and he was doing stuff like this 15, 20 years ago, and it still stands up now, and this is one of those songs... and it was called The Port Of Amsterdam'
Song For Bob Dylan 'this is where I pile audacity upon audacity' and 'you're really making me drag through all me things that have been stored in cupboards for months and yonks, all me skeletons'
Bombers 'OK Bombers then'... 
mid song, a short fault in the recording - somebody accidentally leans against a moving tape spool/reel?
'Thank you very much and goodbye'. 
Andy Dunkley (compere) then appears and mistakenly refers to David's latest album as The Man Who Ruled The World. The audience correct him.
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

11:32 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #24

Very interesting. Where is that from?
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

11:40 PM - Jul 29, 2018 #25

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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

5:42 AM - Jul 30, 2018 #26

Ah, I'd looked on the Geronimo site before, but missed that, - thanks.
That table should get circulated more so that there is more expectation that this recording should be released...😀
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Like
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Joined: 9:49 AM - Apr 20, 2012

1:03 PM - Jul 30, 2018 #27

'I'd Like A Big Girl With a Couple of Melons...'
Well, Dana Gillespie was there, too, so he didn't have to look far!
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Joined: 6:29 PM - Jan 17, 2009

11:25 PM - Jul 31, 2018 #28

I might be a little more interested in the Glastonbury 2000 set.
"Schtum!"
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

6:01 PM - Aug 01, 2018 #29

As has been suggested, there indeed is a case to be made for an LP box set of the two Glastonbury shows, with a book.
It's a shame about the lack of known photos of Bowie at Glastonbury in 1971, however contemporaneous photos of Bowie, and general photos from the festival that year, and biographical details about the performance would help pad that out.
If this was to happen they would have to have the LPs pressed at a plant that had ironed out all issues regarding faulty pressings, for such an important new release.
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Like
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Joined: 2:53 PM - Mar 22, 2013

9:10 AM - Aug 02, 2018 #30

Suggestion for title: Before and After, he was any good. ;-)
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Joined: 8:17 PM - Feb 19, 2010

12:48 PM - Aug 02, 2018 #31

so many funny commentaries and so few details and info
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Joined: 8:04 PM - Sep 18, 2014

3:14 PM - Aug 02, 2018 #32

Would love to hear the Glasto 1971 tape.  It feels criminal that a few people have heard it but it's not been made available for the public.  Glasto 2000 is widely bootlegged after it was on BBC Radio in full.  Frankly, it's a bit of a bland run-through of the hits, not anything to get excited about.
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Joined: 6:51 PM - Jan 18, 2016

1:13 PM - Aug 03, 2018 #33

mcnabadam wrote: Would love to hear the Glasto 1971 tape.  It feels criminal that a few people have heard it but it's not been made available for the public.  Glasto 2000 is widely bootlegged after it was on BBC Radio in full.  Frankly, it's a bit of a bland run-through of the hits, not anything to get excited about.
These BBC technical people for sure know how to suck the life out of a recording. I recorded that complete performance version on BBC 6 Music broadcast on 16-1-16, onto DVD-A and it was compressed down to the minimum. I've heard better mp3's and that's saying something. For some strange reason their two previous broadcasts, one with 13 songs all out of original sequence and the second with ten songs in sequence, were all of a higher sound quality.
the future ain't what it used to be
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Joined: 4:56 PM - Jul 11, 2004

8:57 AM - Aug 05, 2018 #34

XenonCodex59 wrote:
mcnabadam wrote: Would love to hear the Glasto 1971 tape.  It feels criminal that a few people have heard it but it's not been made available for the public.  Glasto 2000 is widely bootlegged after it was on BBC Radio in full.  Frankly, it's a bit of a bland run-through of the hits, not anything to get excited about.
These BBC technical people for sure know how to suck the life out of a recording. I recorded that complete performance version on BBC 6 Music broadcast on 16-1-16, onto DVD-A and it was compressed down to the minimum. I've heard better mp3's and that's saying something. For some strange reason their two previous broadcasts, one with 13 songs all out of original sequence and the second with ten songs in sequence, were all of a higher sound quality.
Yes I concur with the latter. I listened through the full show BBC6 version just now, in bits, and I could understand the 'bland run through the hits' assessment. But, it did sound a lot better in the early TV broadcasts, which I just checked.
I think an LP release of both Glastonbury sets, with sympathetic mixing, would make a good release - something for everyone.
The original Glastonbury set is almost mythical, it would be great for the world - or those in the world who would like to hear it (which may would, I'm sure) - to hear it.
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Like
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Joined: 4:37 PM - Jul 23, 2004

4:56 PM - Aug 06, 2018 #35

I am going to play Devil's Advocate here and just as the following question:
Why should anyone who might have something special and/or uncirculated give it away to people who never give anything back themselves but only ever go on and on about "secret collectors" and "inner circles" which probably don't exist as if they have some gods given right to be given whatever they want just because they asked for it whilst moaning about the very people they want to get this material off of?

I will admit there have been times when I have put stuff out there that was a bit special but I will never, ever do it again simply because all that I ever got in return were various spiteful comments and a shitload of negative stuff about why did I not do it sooner, and the final straw was when someone stated outright that something was a "fake, and an obvious one because it was too good to be real".

Fuck em all.
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Joined: 8:13 AM - Jul 22, 2018

6:23 PM - Aug 06, 2018 #36

That’s people all over unfortunately. Do people a favour of any kind and you often get crapped on in return.

Still we can’t just stop doing each other a good turns, because if we do the world will get to be an even worse place than it often currently is.

I was always taught it’s much better to rise above these people and show them your actually the better person rather than lower yourself down to their level.

Idealistic maybe, but the alternative is a pretty bleak future for everyone.
SHHWEEET! IS....A self confessed, radicalised David Bowie knob ha! ha! I’m in good company. Let’s all celebrate together.
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Joined: 6:51 PM - Jan 18, 2016

5:02 PM - Aug 07, 2018 #37

neilwilkes wrote: I am going to play Devil's Advocate here and just as the following question:
Why should anyone who might have something special and/or uncirculated give it away to people who never give anything back themselves but only ever go on and on about "secret collectors" and "inner circles" which probably don't exist as if they have some gods given right to be given whatever they want just because they asked for it whilst moaning about the very people they want to get this material off of?

I will admit there have been times when I have put stuff out there that was a bit special but I will never, ever do it again simply because all that I ever got in return were various spiteful comments and a shitload of negative stuff about why did I not do it sooner, and the final straw was when someone stated outright that something was a "fake, and an obvious one because it was too good to be real".

Fuck em all.
Before you do do that Neil, can you at least tell what it was you'd allegedly faked?
the future ain't what it used to be
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