David Bowie 1968

Joined: February 19th, 2010, 8:17 pm

April 9th, 2018, 12:56 am #1

i wish to see a new compilation with 1968 recorded songs and maybe...there's a little chance in a near future
https://www.davidbowie.com/blog/2018/4/ ... in-shindig
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Joined: July 11th, 2004, 4:56 pm

April 9th, 2018, 8:23 am #2

MGOSCH wrote: i wish to see a new compilation with 1968 recorded songs and maybe...there's a little chance in a near future
https://www.davidbowie.com/blog/2018/4/ ... in-shindig
Interesting stuff!

I've long hankered over more unearthing of pictures, material and focus generally on the 1968-1971 period myself (and a couple of fan made books covering that period are a great help as well as the bootlegs and biographies that cover some of that period too, for example John Hutchinson's and Mary Finnigan's books). So this is encouraging as it will lift the lid on that pre-stardom phase more.

Well done to Shindig, I'll be getting this :)
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: June 24th, 2015, 3:33 pm

April 12th, 2018, 2:38 am #3

From Facebook..


Occasional Dreaming

1968 was the year of revolution, where the unbridled happy partying of 1967 morphed into a sour and angry hangover. For Bowie, 1968 was when his interest in theatrical stage performance solidified, with Lindsay Kemp's 'Pierrot in Turquoise', solo mime performances, a minor role in a TV drama, an attempt at cabaret and a multi-media trio - Turquoise/Feathers - featuring an early muse Hermione Farthingale.

Any second album with Deram would surely have reflected all this - and not for the first time, and with the lack of a hit single under his belt, DB would’ve turned to songs by others, songs that fitted snuggly into his cannon, songs that he could make his own. In 1968 Deram issued a concept album in a whacky gatefold sleeve by Lionel Bart 'Isn’t This Where We Came In?' - which is full of angularity, humour and English whimsy. At the same time Tony Visconti was working with The Move in 1968 adding orchestral wit to their narrative pop nuggets. It’s not beyond the realms of possibility to imagine a second DB Deram album to be Bart meets The Move - all with the wry, dystopian, yearning Bowie singing about unattainable love with Brechtian detachment….

Occasional Dreaming - album scheduled for November 1968 release (briefly listed in the September 1968 'Forthcoming Releases from Decca' dealer sheets) Produced by Tony Visconti. Deram SML 1027 (stereo). DML 1027 (mono).

Side One
01 ~ Let Me Sleep Beside You - (a 'test mix' by Visconti from late 1967 is totally acoustic/orchestral - and not at all 'rock' and a great seductive album opener)
02 ~ A Social Kind of Girl (68 rewrite of 1967’s Summer Kind Of Girl - demos exist for both versions)
03 ~ The Gospel According To Tony Day Blues (the song was originally registered with this title) The 1967 studio session for this track contains several variants of the 'character role call' and it has a sardonic Brel/theatrical feel to it. Given that DB returned to songs frequently at this time, honing and improving them (Silly Boy Blue/Love You Till Tuesday/In The Heat of the Morning et al) - it’s not beyond the realms of possibility that this song would be revisited...
04 ~ Life’s a Circus (Bunn/Mackie) performed by DB in his cabaret act and by Feathers in 1968
05 ~ When I’m Five - written in 1968, performed by DB as late as 1969
06 ~ C’est La Vie - DB original that he demoed many times - the last demo probably from 1968
07 ~ Next (Brel). performed by Feathers in 1968

Side Two:
08 ~ London Bye Ta Ta - Decca 1968 version 
09 ~ Angel Angel Grubby Face - 1968 demo 
10 ~ Pussy Cat (Marnay, Popp, Stellman) - VERY European theatre/Lindsay Kemp type number - English lyrics to 'Manchester et Liverpool'
11 ~ Going Down (1967 demo - "Goin' down, I’m high up above you so pull me down…."
12 ~ Occasional Dreaming - (the hand written title on the tape box for 'An Occasional Dream' demo) 
13 ~ In The Heat Of The Morning - Decca 1968 version 
14 ~ Lover To The Dawn - written and probably performed by DB/Feathers in late 1968
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Joined: March 4th, 2009, 1:08 am

April 12th, 2018, 6:29 am #4

Listening to Conrad’s Pussy Cat on Spotify... did this mutate into Miss Peculiar?
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Joined: July 11th, 2004, 4:56 pm

April 12th, 2018, 10:42 am #5

Reading this sort of thing reminds me how much I'd love a box set of outtakes and live stuff pre 1972. Post that time would be brilliant too, but the pre-fame period (and I include the Space Oddity and afterwards of course, as Space Oddity was wonderful but made him a one hit wonder for some time, rather than famous).
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
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Joined: February 19th, 2010, 8:17 pm

April 12th, 2018, 4:01 pm #6

i hope that this post on Bowienet will be more than a tease
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Joined: August 27th, 2012, 4:16 pm

April 12th, 2018, 6:33 pm #7

Thylacine8 wrote: Listening to Conrad’s Pussy Cat on Spotify... did this mutate into Miss Peculiar?
I wonder if the reference to Jess Conrad's 'Pussy Cat' is a mistake? This clearly isn't the same melody as 'Manchester et Liverpool', nor is it credited to the original composers of 'Manchester et Liverpool' as a new version with English lyrics would be. Jess Conrad's track is credited solely to 'Blackwell', whereas 'Manchester et Liverpool' was written by 'Marnay/Popp'.
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Joined: March 4th, 2009, 1:08 am

April 12th, 2018, 7:48 pm #8

LuisKantor wrote:
Thylacine8 wrote: Listening to Conrad’s Pussy Cat on Spotify... did this mutate into Miss Peculiar?
I wonder if the reference to Jess Conrad's 'Pussy Cat' is a mistake? This clearly isn't the same melody as 'Manchester et Liverpool', nor is it credited to the original composers of 'Manchester et Liverpool' as a new version with English lyrics would be. Jess Conrad's track is credited solely to 'Blackwell', whereas 'Manchester et Liverpool' was written by 'Marnay/Popp'.
Oddly, there seem to be two versions by Conrad. Here is the link to the one borrowing from 'Manchester.'


The bar-room piano vibe definitely shares something with 'Peculiar,' along with (possibly) the lyric content. "I've been following" by Conrad vs Bowie's "you follow, three steps behind."
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Joined: March 4th, 2009, 1:08 am

April 12th, 2018, 7:50 pm #9

Here's a youtube link to Conrad's Pussy Cat:
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Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

April 13th, 2018, 2:07 pm #10

Don't get confused with the February 1964 release by Jess Conrad on Columbia (DB 7223) with the song credited to Charles Blackwell.

Conrad later did another song entitled: 'Pussycat' released on President (PT 292) in 1970 (B-side of Crystal Ball Dream) which is a different song to the one that appeared in 1964.

Again, more confusion as this was incorrectly credited to Kal Mann / Dave Appell which was yet another song entitled Pussy Cat released by Chubby Checker.

The song that Bowie recorded in 1968 was written by (Music: Eddy Marnay and André Popp: English lyrics: Marcel Stellman), released by Conrad in 1970 and recorded by Bowie two years earlier (probably 8th March 1967)
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Joined: March 4th, 2009, 1:08 am

April 13th, 2018, 3:08 pm #11

Thanks for the info Paul! Did I post links to the appropriate 1970 version? I’ll take them down if they’re wrong.
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Joined: May 1st, 2017, 10:28 am

April 13th, 2018, 3:25 pm #12

I would LOVE for the gaps in this period to be better represented than it is or has been in the past - but as has been discussed before, I can't see who is going to allow it, sadly. 

DB had an opportunity to sanction much of the "unheard by the vast majority" material mentioned above when Deram were re-releasing the first LP under the title Deram Anthology 1966-68. The compiler, Dorian Wathen (who was not a Bowie fan) went through the Deram tapes in the style of Jeff Rougvie and asked for several tracks to be sanctioned. 

DB said no and unlike Jeff Rougvie at Ryko, he accepted the block and did not fight for a yes. If Rougvie hadn't been so passionate and fought with good reason, I doubt we would ever have heard Sweet Head and several others made available by Ryko.

So I believe that DB's wishes in the 90's relating to his 66-68 catalogue will be carried on by Bill Zysblat (the seemingly soledecision maker on Bowie's material in the vaults). I really hope I am wrong.
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Joined: July 24th, 2008, 8:22 pm

April 14th, 2018, 7:54 am #13

BZ is I believe it was reported a trustee or executor meaning he is legally bound to respect DB’s wishes as to his estate, and so has no choice in the matter. 
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Joined: January 23rd, 2014, 10:41 pm

April 14th, 2018, 7:35 pm #14

I've definitely spent too much time on this today, but here's a detailed PDF I've compiled detailing this supposed Occasional Dreaming album, with further information cited from Pegg and Illustrated-db-Discography. Just please disregard my mistake as listing the Jess Conrad version of "Pussy Cat" as being from 1964 and not from 1970. Enjoy! 
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Joined: March 4th, 2009, 1:08 am

April 14th, 2018, 9:34 pm #15

Great work! Thanks Libertine!
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Joined: February 19th, 2010, 8:17 pm

April 15th, 2018, 12:32 am #16

I Wonder the name of the "private collector".Any suggestions?
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Joined: July 11th, 2004, 4:56 pm

April 15th, 2018, 8:50 am #17

An excellent piece of work, libertine90, I'm reading through it now.

The bit about Life is a Circus reminded me that the demo of An Occasional Dream was used on Space Oddity. I see from scrolling throught that you've mentioned this. It was actually discussed on here before - I didn't believe it at first until I checked, but someone pointed out that the version on Space Oddity is the same as the version on Beckenham Oddity, albeit slowed down and heavily remixed (with overdubs that are either contemporaneous or added later).

This all, slightly frustratingly - because we have not heard them - suggests that all the Beckenham Oddity material is stored in the highest quality. And as I've mentioned a few times, Bowie recordings could exist on the Arts lab recordings that were made available through a lending library.

"The Arts Lab at the Three Tuns Public House, Beckenham was originally called the Folk Club with the title 'Growth'. Organised by David and Mary Finnigan, the Folk Club was in reality a room at the back of the Three Tuns public house on Beckenham High Street. After the 4th week, so many people attended that the club had to expand into the conservatory and the garden.

Some of David's performances at the Arts Lab do exist on tape. Chas Lippeatt who handled the Arts Lab PA system and film unit used to tape record the evenings music for a free lending library sponsored by the Arts Lab."

http://www.bowiewonderworld.com/tours/tour58.htm



Ok all slightly after 1968, but it links into your piece, and it's been an interest for a while for me :)

Anyway I'll read on in your pdf, great stuff :)
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: July 11th, 2004, 4:56 pm

April 15th, 2018, 9:20 am #18

Read it all now, good work - I so wish we could get a box set dedicated to all the odds and ends from 1968-1971, or 1967-1971, it's a fascinating time.
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: January 23rd, 2014, 10:41 pm

April 15th, 2018, 2:56 pm #19

Stranger-In-A-Strange-Land wrote: Read it all now, good work - I so wish we could get a box set dedicated to all the odds and ends from 1968-1971, or 1967-1971, it's a fascinating time.
Well I had wondered that myself, re: "Occasional Dream" demo. Pegg seemed to suggest in his section on it that they were indeed two different versions, but I guess the reason the "bootleg" version was still faster and longer than the official SO40 release is probably because of some Bowie and Hutch banter at the end I didn't bother to check? 
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Joined: August 27th, 2012, 4:16 pm

April 15th, 2018, 8:27 pm #20

libertine90 wrote:
Stranger-In-A-Strange-Land wrote: Read it all now, good work - I so wish we could get a box set dedicated to all the odds and ends from 1968-1971, or 1967-1971, it's a fascinating time.
Well I had wondered that myself, re: "Occasional Dream" demo. Pegg seemed to suggest in his section on it that they were indeed two different versions, but I guess the reason the "bootleg" version was still faster and longer than the official SO40 release is probably because of some Bowie and Hutch banter at the end I didn't bother to check? 
Kudos to Tyler - excellent work drawing all the threads together. Personally I don't think there's any way on earth that a fledgling songwriter would be including THREE cover versions on only his second album - and surely Ken Pitt would have been advising him not to use other people's songs (and therefore having to split royalties) . I reckon that the second album would have contained only original Bowie compositions. Although he recorded some cover versions, it was not until ZS that one made it onto the final cut of an album. Just my two cents.
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Joined: August 27th, 2012, 4:16 pm

April 15th, 2018, 8:34 pm #21

I hope we'll see an official release of Toy mixed and produced by Visconti rather than Plati. Maybe some of the demos or acetates listed above could appear as bonus tracks..?
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Joined: July 11th, 2004, 4:56 pm

April 15th, 2018, 9:33 pm #22

LuisKantor wrote:
libertine90 wrote:
Stranger-In-A-Strange-Land wrote: Read it all now, good work - I so wish we could get a box set dedicated to all the odds and ends from 1968-1971, or 1967-1971, it's a fascinating time.
Well I had wondered that myself, re: "Occasional Dream" demo. Pegg seemed to suggest in his section on it that they were indeed two different versions, but I guess the reason the "bootleg" version was still faster and longer than the official SO40 release is probably because of some Bowie and Hutch banter at the end I didn't bother to check? 
Kudos to Tyler - excellent work drawing all the threads together. Personally I don't think there's any way on earth that a fledgling songwriter would be including THREE cover versions on only his second album - and surely Ken Pitt would have been advising him not to use other people's songs (and therefore having to split royalties) . I reckon that the second album would have contained only original Bowie compositions. Although he recorded some cover versions, it was not until ZS that one made it onto the final cut of an album. Just my two cents.
Yes, he wrote Fill Your Heart, but generously credited it to Biff Rose.
We need -
Cracked Actor on DVD!
Arts Lab recordings!
The FULL 1970 Paris Cinema Studios show - forget the mistakes, enjoy the vibe!
1971 Paris Cinema Studios in STEREO - it was on a BBC radio LP.
Glasto 71 too!
Release the archives, set them free...
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: August 27th, 2012, 4:16 pm

April 15th, 2018, 9:38 pm #23

Stranger-In-A-Strange-Land wrote: LuisKantor:


Kudos to Tyler - excellent work drawing all the threads together. Personally I don't think there's any way on earth that a fledgling songwriter would be including THREE cover versions on only his second album - and surely Ken Pitt would have been advising him not to use other people's songs (and therefore having to split royalties) . I reckon that the second album would have contained only original Bowie compositions. Although he recorded some cover versions, it was not until ZS that one made it onto the final cut of an album. Just my two cents.


Yes, he wrote Fill Your Heart, but generously credited it to Biff Rose.
Haha, very good point! 👍   I still maintain that in 1968 Ken Pitt and db himself would have been keen to be earning royalties on three more original songs rather than giving them away to others.

In fact, I think it’s possible to guess the songs that the second Deram album would have contained by eliminating the least likely.

As I’ve already said stated, I don’t believe there would be any cover versions (primarily for financial reasons);

I think it’s unlikely London Bye Ta-Ta would be included, having already been rejected by Deram for a single release;

I think it’s unlikely Going Down would be included, having been rejected by Manfred Mann, and described by Nick Pegg as a reversion to db’s pre-Deram sound;

I think it’s unlikely Lover To The Dawn would be included since Nick Pegg refers to bitter, anti-Hermione sentiment which would sit rather awkwardly alongside the sublime Occasional Dreaming/An Occasional Dream;

C’est La Vie is the tricky one: it’s been rejected by Chris Montez and db has recorded it many times (a sure sign that the artist isn’t yet happy with it). If the second Deram album had gone ahead and db had been sufficiently focused and inspired to develop it into Shadow Man, then it would have been included for sure (perhaps in place of Ching-A-Ling). But I don’t think it would have been included as C’est La Vie.

Which leaves us with the following fourteen tracks:

Let Me Sleep Beside You / Social Kind of Girl / Gospel According To Tony Day Blues / Rev Raymond Brown / Angel Angel Grubby Face / Mother Grey / When I’m Five / Silver Tree Top School For Boys / Karma Man / Everything Is You / Ching-A-Ling / April’s Tooth of Gold / Occasional Dreaming / In The Heat Of The Morning
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Joined: August 20th, 2002, 8:53 am

April 16th, 2018, 2:25 am #24

Fascinating & also intriguing, thanks
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