Weaponology Waffen-ss

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Weaponology Waffen-ss

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Major
Joined: 18 Jan 2007, 13:04

02 Apr 2008, 12:22 #1

Direct to part 1. Simply follow the leads from there.

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"Don't you know about sergeants?"
"Well . . . I'm learning."
"They don't have mothers. Just ask any trained private. They reproduce by fission . . . like all bacteria."
-Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers

If we are going to teach 'creation science' as an alternative to evolution, then we should also teach the stork theory as an alternative to biological reproduction. -Judith Hayes
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Makoto
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Makoto
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Joined: 12 Jan 2005, 17:44

02 Apr 2008, 14:56 #2

Interesting, if skipping on details (logical due to time-constraints) material.

Worth noting is that quite a lot of weapons shown weren't in fact weapons issued to line squads on regular basis, but instead were only limited number and nearly unknown for the troops (like the StG, FG or MP40 (in part 4, 4:10 "a few" should've been used instead of "many") or just seldom sighted (like MG 42 or PzKfw VI, the latter nearly never encountered outside eastern front), some of them (like MP 18 or both infantry and tank night-vision systems) merely experimental series produced in single digits numbers.
SS troops were usually issued only a XIX century Kar 98 rifle and bayonet, just like every other formation in the Reich.

Also (part 3, 3:30) unlike what's being said, there was no assault on Leningrad. OKH knew there are no forces available for it, so no attempts of actually attacking the city itself were ever made during the entire famous siege.

On a funny note: entrenching tool in part 3, 9:00 and later in part 4 is the russian model, just as popular among germans as the Luger was among Allied troops.
The correct answer is: Because that is our job

I sometimes question my sanity. Occasionally it replies.
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Joined: 20 Aug 2007, 15:01

02 Apr 2008, 16:14 #3

You can always count on Makoto to dispel Nazi myth...
However, I would have said that the Cossacks were the most feared military organisation in history. Or possibly the Huns. Actually, definitely the Huns.
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Sigma
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Sigma
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Joined: 26 Jul 2005, 06:45

02 Apr 2008, 16:35 #4

I would think the Golden Horde was the scariest. But that has nothing to do with this topic. Nice find though. I'm looking forward to the Foreign Legion one.
Mothegreat wrote: And Sigma kicks our asses in one paragraph. The End.
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Ogiwan
Major
Joined: 04 Sep 2004, 19:13

02 Apr 2008, 17:03 #5

Yeah, definitely a good find. I watched the Waffen and the Marine Corps ones.

Oh, but like Mak said, there were a few bad facts. The one that rankled me was the impression that the SS boys ran in to like Poland with MP-44s. Oh, and that the MP-44 was the father of the AK. First true assault rifle, sure. The proginator of every assault rifle since, not so much.

The Marine one, well, they didn't mention the LHDs and whatnot at all, nor did they mention the Harriers.
"I went into a hobby-shop to play m'self a game,
The 'ouse Guru 'e up an' sez "The Guard is weak and lame!"
The Chaos gits around the shelves they laughed and snickered in my face,
I outs into the street again an' grabbed my figure-case."
Oh it's "Angels this" an' "Space-wolves that", and "Guardsmen, go away!";
But it's "Thank you for the ordnance" when the Guard begins to play,
O it's "LOOK AT ALL THE ORDNANCE!" when the Guard begins to play.."
-Cadian XXIX (edited for length)
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Makoto
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Makoto
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Joined: 12 Jan 2005, 17:44

02 Apr 2008, 17:48 #6

Major of the 58th @ Apr 2 2008, 04:14 PM wrote:You can always count on Makoto to dispel Nazi myth...
Not entirely disspell...
Despite what Weaponology team is trying to convince vievers, SS (nor rest of the Heeres) wasn't equipped with modern weaponry. There are few excellent footages of those Waffen units on parades (actuall shots, not all those short pre-set flashes quite similar to that American vs German automatics flick), proudly presenting best equipment Fatherland could give them: rank after rank after rank carries the Mauser 1898 model bolt-action rifle, a weapon that was old during WW1. Few of those men have Lugers in holsters. Not a single one holds an automatic weapon. There probably was an odd MG-34 or two further back the parade, but not much else. All of those men are on foot. Not a single vehicle among them... as was normal in Heeres.
We also know they faced enemies who not only outnumbered them, but also outclassed with weaponry they could only dream about. Or haven't even thought such arms are achievable.
And yet, despite it all, they did manage to become one of the most respected forces in WW2. Ideology aside, it does take brass balls to achieve it, when circumstances are against one in such a way.
The correct answer is: Because that is our job

I sometimes question my sanity. Occasionally it replies.
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David Dark
Sergeant
Joined: 15 Sep 2007, 19:29

02 Apr 2008, 18:50 #7

I have to agree with Makoto, it's just a program that says thats nazi ss were the best so u will watch with ecstasy that u didn't know that SS were the best equipped, best trained toops out there and everyone of those guys was a f*cking badass. They never retreated, didn't have to eat or go to toilet, they could wage war 24/7 and allies troops s***ted down their pants every time they heard about them.

Good advice for today:
Start reading books.
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Forlorn Hope
Colonel
Joined: 04 Feb 2005, 13:38

02 Apr 2008, 21:21 #8

They ... didn't have to eat or go to toilet
This is what separates a good soldier from a true ubermensch.
I mean, Russian soldiers were known for being able to live on minuscule supplies, but even they had to poo from time to time.

"Every turn starts with Tim going 'where's my tape measure?'"
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Ogiwan
Major
Joined: 04 Sep 2004, 19:13

02 Apr 2008, 23:33 #9

Forlorn Hope @ Apr 2 2008, 09:21 PM wrote: I mean, Russian soldiers were known for being able to live on minuscule supplies, but even they had to poo from time to time.
:bravo:
"I went into a hobby-shop to play m'self a game,
The 'ouse Guru 'e up an' sez "The Guard is weak and lame!"
The Chaos gits around the shelves they laughed and snickered in my face,
I outs into the street again an' grabbed my figure-case."
Oh it's "Angels this" an' "Space-wolves that", and "Guardsmen, go away!";
But it's "Thank you for the ordnance" when the Guard begins to play,
O it's "LOOK AT ALL THE ORDNANCE!" when the Guard begins to play.."
-Cadian XXIX (edited for length)
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chillin_mickey
Captain
Joined: 20 Sep 2004, 04:56

03 Apr 2008, 00:28 #10

Ogiwan @ Apr 2 2008, 05:03 PM wrote: ...the MP-44 was the father of the AK.
Just No.
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Wodon, the War god
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Wodon, the War god
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Joined: 15 Nov 2006, 16:19

03 Apr 2008, 01:11 #11

Well I happen to know for a fact that parades and demonstration teams almost always bear obsolete weapons rather than the latest and the greatest.

For example the US Marine Corps Silent Drill team. The Marine Corps has had the M16 as standard since the 60s. It was the M14 before that. The M1 Garand went out of use after the Korean war, but the Silent Drill team takes to the field in 2008 with a weapon that is obsolete for 50 years!

Why? the drill for the weapo is well established. The weapon appears to be what the public expects a weapon to be. Old vets can relate to the Drill team's maneuvers. The old wood and gunmetal can be polished in a way that black plastic and anodized finish can't. And they are available in significant numbers, cheaply, and won't be pressed into service for battle.

That said, the entire of the German Military organization had to contend with weapons that were relatively poor in quality, as in up to date. Even their latest and greatest were not always the best. For example the MG 34 was a precision weapon, crafted to the tighest engineering tolerances. Its rate of fire was often triple that of similarly classed Allied weapons. Problem with that is it goes through triple the ammunition for a nation that has shallow resources. And the tight tolerances meant that any contamination, dirt, carbon build up, or even brass shavings, would cause the weapon to misfire or jam. Not exactly well trusted. The MG 42 solved the tolerances issue by being looser in construction, like a lot of Russian designs, but it was an even worse bullet hog. Of course that is an over-generalization, as I am sure that there are several exceptional weapons in the allied arsenal. But the Bren, Besa, 30 cal, and 50 cal firing sound like a washing machine chugging while the fire of an MG 42 sounds more like ripping paper or a chainsaw.
Imperial Navy - Because Close Air Support and Friendly Fire should be easier to tell apart.
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doom_diver
Major
Joined: 07 Sep 2007, 03:33

03 Apr 2008, 03:10 #12

I never talk in Military stuff since I barely know about the topic. But C'mon Mongolians. China needed to build a bloody wall to stop those guys. and they just went around it and burned down Bejing. They were the masters of their time. Could've captured a whole lot more if the Mongol Emperor didn't die.
CHEESY POOFS





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Avatar
Major
Joined: 18 Jan 2007, 13:04

03 Apr 2008, 06:26 #13

Makoto @ Apr 2 2008, 02:56 PM wrote: Interesting, if skipping on details (logical due to time-constraints) material.

Worth noting is that quite a lot of weapons shown weren't in fact weapons issued to line squads on regular basis, but instead were only limited number and nearly unknown for the troops (like the StG, FG or MP40 (in part 4, 4:10 "a few" should've been used instead of "many") or just seldom sighted (like MG 42 or PzKfw VI, the latter nearly never encountered outside eastern front), some of them (like MP 18 or both infantry and tank night-vision systems) merely experimental series produced in single digits numbers.
SS troops were usually issued only a XIX century Kar 98 rifle and bayonet, just like every other formation in the Reich.

Also (part 3, 3:30) unlike what's being said, there was no assault on Leningrad. OKH knew there are no forces available for it, so no attempts of actually attacking the city itself were ever made during the entire famous siege.

On a funny note: entrenching tool in part 3, 9:00 and later in part 4 is the russian model, just as popular among germans as the Luger was among Allied troops.
For once I concur. I almost cried when they presented the Stg44 as the Waffen-SS main weapon.
"Don't you know about sergeants?"
"Well . . . I'm learning."
"They don't have mothers. Just ask any trained private. They reproduce by fission . . . like all bacteria."
-Robert A. Heinlein, Starship Troopers

If we are going to teach 'creation science' as an alternative to evolution, then we should also teach the stork theory as an alternative to biological reproduction. -Judith Hayes
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Ogiwan
Major
Joined: 04 Sep 2004, 19:13

03 Apr 2008, 13:28 #14

Avatar @ Apr 3 2008, 06:26 AM wrote: For once I concur. I almost cried when they presented the Stg44 as the Waffen-SS main weapon.
Yeah, actually, that's what I should have said. Not only the for once agreeing with Mak, but getting all twitchy over the MP-44 thing.
"I went into a hobby-shop to play m'self a game,
The 'ouse Guru 'e up an' sez "The Guard is weak and lame!"
The Chaos gits around the shelves they laughed and snickered in my face,
I outs into the street again an' grabbed my figure-case."
Oh it's "Angels this" an' "Space-wolves that", and "Guardsmen, go away!";
But it's "Thank you for the ordnance" when the Guard begins to play,
O it's "LOOK AT ALL THE ORDNANCE!" when the Guard begins to play.."
-Cadian XXIX (edited for length)
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Severus
Captain
Severus
Captain
Joined: 22 Feb 2007, 11:47

04 Apr 2008, 00:34 #15

i havent got a clue as to what you guys are talkin about :lol:
DO YOU a a way to solve my problem OR Are you too purple Fr**k heed
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