Archive - Yahoo forum posts, 2010 February

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March 23rd, 2016, 5:38 pm #1

BASEBALLGAMES FORUM 2010 February, Messages 5732 - 5857
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Message #5732 Mon Feb 1, 2010 7:49 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: What is your favorite table-top baseball game to play?

me to

--- "wintopps78" wrote:
> Strat O Matic Fanatic!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5733 Mon Feb 1, 2010 7:52 am
"Tim L" <trlewisatc(at)yahoo.com>
Ball Park Baseball League/ Best Baseball Game

Hello:
I would like to tell all about A terrific baseball CARD AND DICE GAME
The name is BALL PARK BASEBALL.
I am starting a draft league for 2009 season.
If after reading about the game and you want to join the league e mail me at: TRLEWISATC(at)YAHOO.COM

The link for the game is here: http://www.bpbaseballgame.com/descriptionofgame.php
The fan site is here: http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/
Testimonials are here: http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/ ... onials.htm

I was skeptical when I first heard about this game. ALL the reviews were "outstanding", "best game","
"incredible detail" "complete game", "real baseball strategy". I have played baseball board games for 35 years.
The game is an absolute masterpiece. To use anothers discription "A HIDDEN GEM" There was and to this day,
harldy ANY advertising. There was a resturant in Kansas in the 1970s which had the game on the menu and
was catered to the players of the game: http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/ ... abilia.htm
Bill James (yes THAT Bill James) talk about the game here: (at bottom)
http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/ ... abilia.htm

regards
TR Lewis
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Message #5734 Mon Feb 1, 2010 6:56 pm
"dwight braid" <dwightbraid(at)yahoo.ca>
Re: info about Extra Innings

i think it might be Xtra Innings....

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> Hi everyone, I have been enjoying reading the thread about everyone's favorite tabletop baseball games.
> One game that a couple of people mentioned is Extra Innings. I have not played that game before, but
> it sounds like somthing I would like since it can be played fairly quickly. Can anyone point me to a link
> with more info about this game? A quick google search didn't turn up much. Thanks...
>
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Message #5735 Tue Feb 2, 2010 7:41 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: What is your favorite table-top baseball game to play?

hi, what years do you play? i an doing 1966 american league at present. i am about 22 games into the season
for all 10 teams and am having a blast. So far only 3 games seperate first thru 3rd and other 7 teams are
all bunched together. I f you look at the schedule a lot of the games were decided by 1 to 3 runs ,so with
a few breaks some of the lower teams could have won some of the close games they lost.
david

--- "wintopps78" wrote:
> Strat O Matic Fanatic!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5736 Tue Feb 2, 2010 1:59 pm
"mglienke23" <mglienke23(at)yahoo.com>
1923 Frantz Great American Game

Hi
I'm new to the forum and have a question. I am thinking of perhaps purchasing a 1923
Fritz Great American Game. The game seems to be well used. Can any of you give me a general
ball park figure as to what I would expect to pay? Also how rare are these games?
Thanks
Mike
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Message #5737 Tue Feb 2, 2010 2:22 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Vintage board game: Parlor Base Ball

Hi again Rene, thanks for your follow-up! Pardon if our previous response came across in any way accusatory --
you wouldn't believe how often vendors knock on the door of this forum/e-list with no interest in its purpose
other than as an opportunity for free advertising, so we just always add that little caution for new members
who inquire about games they happen to have. You, on the other hand, sound like someone who has horsehide
in their blood! Excellent Hornsby quote. You say you're not a collector per se, but have you acquired other
tabletop baseball games or baseball memorabilia nonetheless?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Jolande Boot" wrote:
<< ... Thanks so much for the information. I had no intention of selling this on the site. I'm not a dealer or
collector of BB artifacts. It was just a matter of curiosity between my son and I. We found it buried in the stacks
of a second-hand book store. So appraising it was just a way to stay connected to the game during the off-season.
I have to agree with the great Roger Hornsby. Asked what he did to occupy himself when he wasn't playing
baseball he replied: "I stare out the window and wait for spring." At the very least, you have saved me a trip to
the Antique Road Show. This is the true miracle of the Internet: putting people in touch with each other who
would never otherwise meet in the course of a lifetime, or several lifetimes, for that matter....
>>
______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message
at the Baseballgames forum/e-list, visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
on the web and click on "Post" in the lefthand
menu, or simply send your e-mail to
baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5738 Tue Feb 2, 2010 2:48 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: info about Extra Innings / Xtra Innings

Hiya Chris, you could be asking about either of two games, both of which have their fans --
Dwight is being politely circumspect regarding his game, but *Xtra Innings,* designed and marketed
by Dwight Baird, can be found at http://www.xtrainningsgame.com/

The other game is *Extra Innings,* designed by Jack Kavanaugh back in the early 1970s and published
through much of that decade by Gamecraft. It has many longtime adherents, and updated editions are nowadays
published and sold by BigLeagueCo, Keith Henricksen's company (most famous for *Big League Manager* and
Negamco's *Major League Baseball*), and you can usually (but not always) find those by doing an "advanced"
search on eBay for vendor "bigleagueco." Here's one right now:
http://cgi.ebay.com/Extra-Innings-Baseb ... 0501418310

Don't confuse either of those with *Xtra Out,* a (deservedly) obscure 1976 game by Ian Novelty...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "dwight braid" wrote:
<< i think it might be Xtra Innings....
> --- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> Hi everyone, I have been enjoying reading the thread about everyone's favorite tabletop baseball games.
> One game that a couple of people mentioned is Extra Innings.... Can anyone point me to a link with
> more info about this game? A quick google search didn't turn up much. Thanks...
>>
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Message #5739 Tue Feb 2, 2010 3:06 pm
"OLDTIX(at)AOL.COM"
Ball Park Baseball League/ Best Baseball Game

My God, I thought I was the only person who remembered this! There was a Ball Park in Salina, Kansas
which was my favorite hangout in high school c.1971-72. I have some of the old box score pages stashed
somewhere, but wanted to thank you for resurrecting those memories.

The Salina Ball Park had fantastic hot dogs, which only added to the game-playing experience.
Great, great place. Wonder how many others there were?
Rick
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Message #5740 Tue Feb 2, 2010 3:13 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Re: re: info about Extra Innings / Xtra Innings

Cool, thanks for the info about both games.
-- Chris

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya Chris, you could be asking about either of two games, both of which have their fans --
> ...*Xtra Innings* ... can be found at http://www.xtrainningsgame.com/
> The other game is *Extra Innings* ... by Gamecraft. It has many longtime adherents, and updated editions
> are nowadays publishedand sold by BigLeagueCo... on eBay... vendor "bigleagueco"...
>
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Message #5741 Tue Feb 2, 2010 3:28 pm
"jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.net>
Re: Be A Manager - Koufax (was: Re: info about Extra Innings / Xtra Innings)

Hey Butch and all,
Great to see the interest in these games. Butch, I wanted to let you know we have resloved our problem of
having no Sandy Koufax pitchers card in the 1967 version of our BE A MANAGER game. We made our own!
We took a statistical analysis of all the pitchers from 1966 as well as a comparison of the other pitchers cards
in the game and came up with a composite. I can send you the card if there is any interest.
Thanks again for being there and providing resources to fanatics like me.
Jim

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya Chris, you could be asking about either of two games, both of which have their fans...
> ...
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5742 Tue Feb 2, 2010 3:49 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1923 Frantz Great American Game

Howdy Mike, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! *The Great American Game - Base Ball*
was first produced in 1923 by Frantz Manufacturing Co (still in business!), then throughout much of the 1920s
by their (then) new subsidiary, Hustler Toy. It's a terrific game, from the standpoints of both playability and
aesthetic appeal, so its popularity and success back in the day mean it's not an uncommon find even 85 years later.

There are several subtle variations in the gameboard graphics -- different colors for the frame and hood, spectators
or a blank blue area in the field illustation -- but these seem to make little difference in the market price. Examples
in decent condition -- spring-activated roller working, little or no major damage to the graphics (scratches, rust, &c')
-- have ranged over the past several years from as much as $300. to as little as $25., but average a very typical
$90.-$100. Examples in better condition and with all or most of the wooden pegs tend to fetch the higher prices,
but "ya never know at auction" -- better, more complete specimens sometimes don't do as well as lesser examples,
depending on who's watching and who's bidding.

Examples that include the decorative box are scarce and therefore in considerably higher demand,
averaging well over $200.

We hope that helps! Anything else you need to know, just ask.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mglienke23" wrote:
<< Hi - I'm new to the forum and have a question. I am thinking of perhaps purchasing a 1923
Fritz Great American Game. The game seems to be well used. Can any of you give me
a general ball park figure as to what I would expect to pay? Also how rare are these games?...
>>
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Message #5743 Tue Feb 2, 2010 5:24 pm
"KATHY A KAMINSKI" <kaminski.k(at)sbcglobal.net>
Questions about an old baseball game board

Hi, I hope you don't mind but I would like to ask all of you a few questions about an old baseball board game
that I inherited by way of my late father. The game belonged to my uncle and was passed on to my father.
The game is called "The Pitchers Battle". There is a pitcher (pictured on the board) by the name of Tommy
Bridges. Detroit is printed on his uniform. Would that be the Detroit Tigers? Is the signature part of the photo
or did he really sign it? Do you know anything about him? Printed toward the top of the game is the manufacturer.
Patented July 30, 1935 by R.G. Kollmorgan. Is this the only game they made? It doesn't look machine made.
There is a plunger (?) thing down in the right hand corner that is spring loaded. I'm guessing that a baseball
goes in there? Where can you get a replacement baseball? Can you tell me what the brown wooden X is
that spins around toward the bottom of the game. On the ends of the X are dished out or carved out cups.
The game looks like an early version of a pin ball machine and is very colorful. I know my description is very bad
but I'm hoping that someone can tell me how the game works and how to play, something about the pitcher, what
other games this company made, where they were located and did they have other pitchers photo's on the game
other than Tommy Bridges? Thank you for taking the time to read this.
Kathy
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Message #5744 Tue Feb 2, 2010 5:47 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
the 1966 AL league -- strat-o-matic? replay

dr j:
please remember to keep the forum posted as to the outcome of your 1966 AL season.
i have long contended, with no time to prove or disprove it, that the yankee organization, owned by CBS by then,
was "tanking" that season in hopes of getting a very high position in the draft. since the draft was new to MLB,
no one knew how valuable/invaluable the draft would turn out. many years ago, i checked the 1966 yankee
pitching and hitting stats and found them to be around league average, feeding my suspicion that management
was bagging the season in hopes of improving through the draft.

please keep us informed,
curt young
chittenango NY
kannapolis NC

hey is that ngrid in CNY?

--- "David.Jerome" wrote:
> hi, what years do you play? i an doing 1966 american league at present. i am about 22 games into the season
> for all 10 teams... So far only 3 games seperate first thru 3rd and other 7 teams are all bunched together....
>
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Message #5745 Tue Feb 2, 2010 6:25 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
Re: Ball Park Baseball League/ Best Baseball Game

hey tim and other mgrs in that BPB league:
what a coincidence that this bit of history would cross my screen today. just sunday, dr mc dade returned
1 of my copies of the 1984 bill james baseball abstract i had lent him a few weeks ago. eric the stott,
of malone NY, has also borrowed and perused this copy. i remember reading it during graduation ceremonies
in CLT NC in the spring of 1984. finally, we get a peek into that mysterious game mentioned in bj's dedication.

holy cow! i m hoping this bit of memorabilia will whet the appetites of dr mc dade and eric the stott 4 that
return trip 2 PNC park in pittsburgh this summer. i hate them pie-rats, but eric loves them and dr mc dade is
a native of nearby beaver PA. quizically, eric the stott had no idea that such a thing as a baseball simulation
existed until that visit 2 the hall of fame in cooperstown a few springs ago. how he ever got past age 40
so clueless is a major phenomenon in these parts.

thanks 4 the attachments,
curt young
chittenango NY
kannapolis NC

--- "trlewisatc" wrote:
> Hello: I would like to tell all about A terrific baseball CARD AND DICE GAME
> The name is BALL PARK BASEBALL. I am starting a draft league for 2009 season.
> If after reading about the game and you want to join the league e mail me at:
> TRLEWISATC(at)YAHOO.COM
> The link for the game is here: http://www.bpbaseballgame.com/descriptionofgame.php
> The fan site is here: http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/
> Testimonials are here: http://ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com/ ... onials.htm
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5746 Tue Feb 2, 2010 7:04 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
1966-7 Be A Manager - Koufax

dr w:
i would love 2 c how u guys built a sandy koufax card from 1966 stats. i do not have a BAM sim, but
m interested in whether u guys used BB/IP, H/IP, K/IP, etc, or used BFP [total opposing plate appearances]
and SO, BB, H, HR totals, then compared 2 the league average pitcher. did u use a spreadsheet 2 gather
the data 4 other pitchers from which 2 compare? have u ever checked the BAM cards 2 b sure the designer
did a good job of modelling the pitchers in the first place? inquiring minds want 2 know!

curt young
chittenango NY
kannapolis NC

--- "jimwhitty" wrote:
> ... Great to see the interest in these games.... I wanted to let you know we have resloved our problem of
> having no Sandy Koufax pitchers card in the 1967 version of our BE A MANAGER game. We made our own!
> We took a statistical analysis of all the pitchers from 1966 as well as a comparison of the other pitchers cards
> in the game and came up with a composite. I can send you the card if there is any interest....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5747 Tue Feb 2, 2010 8:00 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: The Pitcher's Battle (was: Re: Questions about an old baseball game board)

Hello there Kathy, welcome to the group and thanks for your questions! Do we mind? Not hardly,
it's precisely why this forum is here!

We're quite familiar with *The Pitcher's Battle,* and it's a dandy thing you have on your hands.
The game is quite in demand among collectors. To answer your many questions in order:

That is a Detroit Tigers uniform Bridges is wearing. Bridges was a terrific pitcher back in his day,
a six-time All-Star, and he spent his entire 16-year major league career (1930-1946) with the Tigers.
You can look up his records at http://www.baseball-reference.com

Unless there's more than one signature on the Bridges photo, the one that's present (running at an upward slant
from Bridges' right foot, no?) is a facsimile printed on the game and not an authentic signature.

*The Pitcher's Battle* seems to be the only game produced by its designer, R G (Robert) Kollmorgen, who,
unfortunately, passed away at the age of 95 just over a year ago. We're unclear on exactly which fabricator
handled the actual physical production of the game, but it came out of the Detroit area -- thus the Bridges
endorsement. Several other star players of the day had agreed to endorse the game as well, we're told --
but a number of factors, including the onset of WWII, evidently curtailed any ongoing production. Kollmorgen's
nephew arrived here in the Forum in July of 2008 with some valuable insights on the game, its inventor, and
its marketing, and you can find the ensuing discussion threads in our Message Archives --
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballg ... ssage/4583
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballg ... ssage/4801

The "front-office" nitwits here in the Forum haven't been fortunate enough to have been hands-on with the game,
so we can't do much of a job of explaining the mechanics of it -- but at least a couple of the group's members
own an example of the game, and perhaps they'll be along soon to describe exactly how it's meant to work.
You are correct, though, in that the plunger launches a ball onto the "playing field," pinball fashion.
No replacement ball is likely to be available anywhere, but a suitable substitute could be found or made
if one of the fellas who owns the game can provide the dimensions and weight of the ball.

Bridges is the only player to appear on the Kollmorgen editions of the game. A nearly identical game, titled
*The Professional Player,* was produced by H C Guetschoff at about the same time, but we don't really know
anything about that company or designer or what have you, including whether it preceded or followed
the Kollmorgen version. Instead of a player image, it sports an illustration of a snarling tiger (an actual tiger,
not a Detroit Tiger).

We hope that helps! Anything else you'd like to know, just ask.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "KATHY A KAMINSKI" wrote:
<< Hi, I hope you don't mind but I would like to sk all of you a few questions about an old baseball board game
that I inherited by way of my late father.... The game is called "The Pitchers Battle". There is a pitcher
(pictured on the board) by the name of Tommy Bridges. Detroit is printed on his uniform. Would that be
the Detroit Tigers? Is the signature part of the photo or did he really sign it? Do you know anything about him?
... Patented July 30, 1935 by R.G. Kollmorgan. Is this the only game they made? It doesn't look machine made.
There is a plunger (?) thing down in the right hand corner that is spring loaded. I'm guessing that a baseball
goes in there? Where can you get a replacement baseball? Can you tell me what the brown wooden X is
that spins around toward the bottom of the game.... I'm hoping that someone can tell me how the game works
and how to play, something about the pitcher, what other games this company made, where they were located
and did they have other pitchers photo's on the game other than Tommy Bridges? Thank you....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5748 Wed Feb 3, 2010 4:07 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Baseballgames update, February 2010

Hiya fellers! It's time again for another installment of that obligatory and little-loved feature, your
regularly-scheduled state-of-the-website address. Nothing new on the main site -- although anything there
may be new to new members who haven't yet explored it -- but it is time to replace the festively
holiday-season-hued game on the Forum's front page. It's back into the closet for *National Pastime*
(Robert L Plachta, 1947), and on display now instead is that well-known companion of many a Baby Boomer
boyhood, *Baseball Card Game* by Ed-U-Cards, which debuted in 1957. As most of you know, it's just
a simple draw game -- shuffle the cards, turn 'em over one by one for the results -- but it holds a special place
in the memories of your front-office knuckleheads, as it was the first baseball game any of us owned.
Many were the summer afternoons we spent playing that game on our grandparents' front porch, while
simultaneously listening to faraway major league games on a transistor radio...

Before we get to anything else, we'll extend the traditional hello and how-d'ya-do to those newest members
of the group -- let's welcome these folks who joined the group in January: chris.hemperley, abhishekshop2,
ashishoffice1, jmontr, avantti63, drifter_san, splendidfriend, kaminski.k, j_weston, mcgillgamers, and jboot62.
We're glad to have all of you on board here! If you haven't yet done so, please make sure you're familiar with
our Forum Policy [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/Forumpolicy.htm ] before you post to the Forum/e-list
-- then take some time to browse our searchable Message archives, Files, Links, and Photo galleries, as well as
the many features at our main website [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/ ]. Stick around, introduce
yourselves, let us know how you found us (seriously -- that's useful info for us), and don't hesitate to chime in
with any questions, comments, or news that you might have.

We were heartened to see a relatively busy month of activity in the Forum/e-list in January, with more posts
than in the disturbingly quiet November and December combined. Thanks to everyone who contributed to the
discussions! It took a new member, David Beisner, to start a thread that energized a lot of veteran members
who've been too quiet for too long, and a tip of the hat to everybody who chimed in on that often controversial
topic, for never was heard a discouraging word.

We'd be very pleased to see more posts along the lines of both the show-'n-tell John Horn provided, regarding
the latest acquisitions for his collection of vintage games, and the photo Jim Whitty submitted, showing the action
and some of the principals involved in his tabletop league. If anyone else has added something interesting to their
collection, let us know about it -- and if you play in a tabletop league (even solitaire!), give us all a look at ya!

In other news, "Monty" apprised us of a new discovery, a game included in a 1934 newspaper. Just when we think
that, after almost twenty years of collecting and research, we really must have finally seen it all, not only did
that one pop up, but, just since mid-December, so did *five* other games we'd never run across before, anywhere,
ever. Humbling as that was, it was pretty exciting too, and best of all, we managed to acquire four of 'em ourselves.
We'll be providing a bit of show-'n-tell for ya in the weeks ahead.

Finally, we'll once again encourage you, newcomers to the group especially, to take a look also in the Photos
section's "Mystery Games" folder -- maybe a fresh set of eyes will at long last help us polish off the remaining
enigmas there. Games 3, 4, 6, 8, and 9 have been solved, but we're still looking for additional info on #s 1 and 2,
and #s 5 and 7 continue to elude identification. No prize money for a correct answer, but the gratitude of the
front office will be yours.

Keep up the chatter, boys!
Butch, Kerm, & Win
Baseball Games
http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message
at the Baseballgames forum/e-list, visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
on the web and click on "Post" in the lefthand
menu, or simply send your e-mail to
baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5749 Wed Feb 3, 2010 8:00 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: the 1966 AL league -- strat-o-matic? replay

Curt,
Hi, MIGHT be some truth to that, however a lot of teams in that season had very similar stats,
and i don't see any team running away with the laegue. By the way I LIVE IN marcellus, ny.
david

--- "curt young" wrote:
> dr j: please remember to keep the forum posted as to the outcome of your 1966 AL season. i have long
> contended, with no time to prove or disprove it, that the yankee organization, owned by CBS by then, was
> "tanking" that season in hopes of getting a very high position in the draft....
> ... hey is that ngrid in CNY?
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5750 Wed Feb 3, 2010 4:32 pm
"Jolande Boot" <jboot62(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: Vintage board game: Parlor Base Ball

Butch: No other baseball board games. Just a fan of the sport. Living in NY State, I am immersed in the game
on a daily basis. Certain cities are BB-centric places: Boston, St. Louis, New York... Places where the NFL hasn't
completely captured the fan base. And, yes, I'm a Yankee fan. Who was it that said that rooting for the Yankees
was like rooting for U.S. Steel? George Will?
At 51, I've lived through the good and the bad. But I do worry about the future of the game. My son plays soccer,
not BB. We play catch occasionally, but his heart is with the pitch, not the diamond. Are we a dying breed Butch?
Rene

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hi again Rene, thanks for your follow-up! Pardon if our previous response came across in any way accusatory
> -- you wouldn't believe how often vendors knock on the door of this forum/e-list with no interest in its purpose
> other than as an opportunity for free advertising... You, on the other hand, sound like someone who has
> horsehide in their blood! Excellent Hornsby quote. You say you're not a collector per se, but have you acquired
> other tabletop baseball games or baseball memorabilia nonetheless?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5751 Wed Feb 3, 2010 4:45 pm
"Jolande" Boot <jboot62(at)yahoo.com>
e-list overload (was: Re: Vintage board game: Parlor Base Ball)

Butch: Anything you can do to prevent me from being inundated by all these e-mails from your site?
Must have received 20 already.
R
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5752 Wed Feb 3, 2010 5:39 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: e-list overload

Sure thing, Rene, we've adjusted your membership to receive the "Daily Digest" (all one day's posts
in a single e-mail). It *was* an ususually busy couple of days on the Forum/e-list.

By the way, group, just for the record, any member can very simply adjust their own membership details
(receive individual e-mails, the digest, or no e-mail at all, among other things) just by clicking,
ironically enough, the "Edit Membership" link near the top of any page of the Forum.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Jolande Boot" wrote:
<< Butch: Anything you can do to prevent me from being inundated by all these e-mails from your site?...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5753 Wed Feb 3, 2010 5:34 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
Re: "rooting for the Yankees..." (was: Re: Parlor Base Ball)

hey u guys:
it had 2 b some1 long b4 george will who first said "rooting for the NY yankees is like rooting 4 US steel",
because i m sure i heard that in the mid-1950s around central NY. many here would not back the yankees
as they thought it was too e z 4 casey win as a push-button manager. i tend 2 disagree.

curt young
chittenango NY
kannapolis NC

--- "jboot62" wrote:
> ... Just a fan of the sport. Living in NY State, I am immersed in the game on a daily basis....
> ... Who was it that said that rooting for the Yankees was like rooting for U.S. Steel? George Will? ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5754 Wed Feb 3, 2010 6:09 pm
"jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.net>
Re: 1966-7 Be A Manager - Koufax

Hi Curt and all
Sy Marder, the creator of BAM was pretty right on in regards to being statistically correct re the pitchers and
batters cards. What he may have had a problem with was how a particular hitter performed against a particular
pitcher. All baseball sim games seem to suffer in this regard to some degree. We are in the midst of a 6 team
60 game season right now and I can post the stats on this website when we are through. Here is the process
of how we made the Sandy Koufax card. Note that the Dodgers won't be utilized until the next "season"
so we won't have data for him yet.

We took into consideration four main stats from the 1966 season.
1. Walks per 9 innings pitched
2. Strikeouts per 9 innings pitched
3. Total ERA for the season
4. WHIP
We took these stats and compared them to other top pitchers in 1966. Specifically...
Juan Marichal
Jim Bunning
Jim Kaat
Jim Perry
Gaylord Perry
Bob Gibson
Don Drysdale
Jim Maloney
Sam McDowell

If you are not familiar with BAM they use a three six sided dice combination chart. Essentially there are
216 dice combinations that can be rolled. example would be 1-1-1 would be a ONE 1-1-2 TWO etc

We gathered a spreadsheet of the other players stats and then compared that to each card that Sy Marder created.
Example: Juan Marichal 1966 stats were 36 walks, 222 strikeouts, 307 IP, ERA 2.23 His card has 31 SO,
52 Batter outs, and 3 possibilities for walks out of 216. Total outs then are 83 Total walks 3.
If the the result is not on the pitchers card then the batter card is allowed to roll.
Sandy Koufax card has 50 SO, 36 Batter outs and 9 possibilities for walks out of 216.

We looked at all the top pitchers mentioned above and came up with the Koufax card.
The card has slightly more outs than Marichal's but slightly higher in the walks category.
We live in the SF bay area so naturally we hate the Dodgers, but I was objective as possible. If there was ever
a Dodge worthy of highest praise and regard it definitely was Sandy Koufax. Is it perfect, hell no. But it is
something everyone in the league agreed on that we had to have this guy. He had such a huge impact
on the 1966 season I truly cannot understand why Sy Marder left him out. Email back with any questions.
Jim Whitty

PS- we have added MANY rules to the game such as beanballs, injuries, errors, fights etc etc
I can email you those if you'd like. When we play it tends to get boisterous to say the least.

--- "curt young" wrote:
> dr w: i would love 2 c how u guys built a sandy koufax card from 1966 stats. i do not have a BAM sim,
> but m interested in whether u guys used BB/IP, H/IP, K/IP, etc, or used BFP [total opposing plate appearances]
> and SO, BB, H, HR totals, then compared 2 the league average pitcher.... have u ever checked the BAM cards
> 2 b sure the designer did a good job of modelling the pitchers in the first place? inquiring minds want 2 know!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5755 Thu Feb 4, 2010 7:41 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: Vintage board game: Parlor Base Ball

RENE, hI, i TO AM A YANKEE FAN, WHOSE KIDS GREW UP PLAYING SOCCER AND I LIVE IN UPSTATE NEW YORK.
I worry about the game also, as it has truly become a business more than a sport. And i was appalled at
all the money the yanks spent last year ,especially in these terrible economic times.
david

--- "Jolande Boot" wrote:
> ... Just a fan of the sport. Living in NY State, I am immersed in the game on a daily basis.... yes, I'm
> a Yankee fan.... At 51, I've lived through the good and the bad. But I do worry about the future of the game.
> My son plays soccer, not BB. We play catch occasionally, but his heart is with the pitch, not the diamond.
> Are we a dying breed Butch?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5756 Thu Feb 4, 2010 9:24 am
"johnbarnes37" <johnbarnes37(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Ball Park Baseball League/ Best Baseball Game

Rick-
Great story! I never knew there was more than one Ball Park other than the one in Lawrence. Unfortunately,
I attended KU in the late 70s and the Ball Park in Lawrence had closed by then, but I played the game a lot -
great game, way ahead of its time with stadium effects, batters and pitchers controls and a game engine
that reflected all the nuances of baseball and its players.

The game is still being produced by its creator, Charles Sidman, who used to be a professor at KU. It's been
updated and he offers all the major league teams and stadiums from the 1890s to the present - the result of
his more than 50 years of dedication to the game. You should check out the web site at http://www.bpbaseballgame.com ,
the fan site at http://www.ball-park-baseball-fan-site.com , and the Delphi Forum on Ball Park Baseball.

The guys on the forum would love it if you shared your memories of playing the game in the 70s
and your old hangout in Salina!
Jon

--- "OLDTIX" wrote:
> My God, I thought I was the only person who remembered this! There was a Ball Park in Salina, Kansas....
> had fantastic hot dogs, which only added to the game-playing experience. Great, great place....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5757 Thu Feb 4, 2010 5:37 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? (was: Re: Vintage board game: Parlor Base Ball)

If we have the gist of Rene's question correctly, she's more concerned about the possibility of a diminishing interest
in baseball *per se* among a younger audience whose preferences run more to football, basketball, soccer, and
auto racing. We're not so sure that's something to worry about. Television ratings for MLB remain strong and,
despite obscene prices, so does attendance at major league games. Minor league action offers a very affordable
and entertaining afternoon or evening at the ballpark if you happen to be in an area that provides that, and
those too draw good crowds. And there seems to be no shortage of enthusiastic sign-ups for amateur and
youth baseball programs.

Not to in any way curtail this discussion, but our own concern, if we can skew Rene's question in another direction,
is whether young people still have, or will in future have, any interest in baseball boardgames. We have grandkids,
nieces, and nephews that are quite involved with playing baseball (for now, at least), but getting them interested
in any boardgame, baseball or otherwise, is like asking them if they'd like a root canal. Instead, they've got
PlayBoxes, XStations, WeeWees and whatnot they find completely absorbing -- a mystery to us, since those things
seem to forbid any use of one's imagination -- which, again to us at least, is one of the great delights of
boardgaming. We also perceive a gross lack of interest in or appreciation for history -- baseball history,
any history -- among the younger generation, which doesn't seem to bode well for any future interest on their part
in the antique games and memorabilia that fascinate us. The Net54 board recently featured a thread expressing
similar concerns, for similar reasons, about the future of collecting vintage baseball cards. Any thoughts along
those lines, fellers?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Jerome, David R." wrote:
<< ... i too am a Yankee fan, whose kids grew up playing soccer and I live in upstate New York.
I worry about the game also, as it has truly become a business more than a sport. And i was appalled
at all the money the yanks spent last year ,especially in these terrible economic times.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5758 Thu Feb 4, 2010 6:14 pm
"Rick Teverbaugh" <rickert46015(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

But I would take exception with obscene prices. Getting 3 hours of entertainment at a baseball game is
much cheaper than at an NBA, NFL or NHL game. So if you mean obscene as in what it costs for a loaf of bread,
I will concede. But as pro sports tickets go, baseball is far from obscene.
Rick T.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> If we have the gist of Rene's question correctly, she's more concerned about the possibility of a diminishing
> interest in baseball *per se* among a younger audience whose preferences run more to football, basketball,
> soccer, and auto racing. We're not so sure that's something to worry about. Television ratings for MLB remain
> strong and, despite obscene prices, so does attendance at major league games. Minor league action offers....
> ... Not to in any way curtail this discussion, but our own concern... is whether young people still have, or
> will in future have, any interest in baseball boardgames.... We also perceive a gross lack of interest in or
> appreciation for history -- baseball history, any history -- among the younger generation....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5759 Thu Feb 4, 2010 9:48 pm
"Willie Drye" <dryemorr(at)mchsi.com> beaucat001
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

Butch, Rick, et al:
I'm picking up this thread on a quick hit, and these are hastily assembled thoughts, but:

I agree with Rick that getting into a baseball stadium -- if you're not particular about where you sit --
is usually cheaper, even at Major League parks. If you want a decent seat, however, that's a different story.

I finally saw a game at Yankee Stadium in 2008, the last season in The House That Ruth Built. Great seats.
I got the tix through my brother-in-law, a well-connected Manhattan attorney. I was close enough that
I could have thrown a beer bottle at Alex Rodriquez when he struck out looking with men in scoring position.
But I paid $275 for that seat and didn't want to be chased out of the ballpark at that price. Since it was
a once-in-a-lifetime thing, I gladly paid the ridiculous price for the tix and knocked back several $8.50 beers
during the game. But I could have sat in the bleachers for, what, $15 or less? And most of the time
that's where I'd be.

Re. Butch's board game comments, I also totally agree. When I was a kid playing Negamco and, later, APBA
when I had a part-time job and could afford it, the action was in my head. I visualized what was happening
on the boards. And it was totally absorbing. And I'm sure it was good for the development of brain synapses
and all that other stuff that happens up there.

I have APBA's Baseball for Windows, and I enjoy playing it, though nothing like the board game when I was a kid.
I have the BBW 1956 season. One way I've made BBW more interesting is by downloading online collections of
Topps baseball cards from that period and combining the cards with the game (it's very easy to do) so that
I can pop up a Topps card from 1956 or '57 and have that card on-screen for each batter as I go through
the lineups.

But I think Butch is right that the video games are going to erase the appeal of board games. I play video games,
and they are enthralling. And they will only get better. And as digital technology improves and the virtual perception
provided by the game becomes more realistic, I think it will further diminish the appeal of board games.

As for the appeal of various sports to kids today, we have a 13-year-old nephew who's a pretty good little athlete.
But he gave up baseball in favor of lacrosse. We went to see him play in Baltimore last summer at a tournament
that involved dozens of lacrosse teams from Maryland-DC-Pa-NJ-NY. Hundreds of kids, none of them interested in
baseball. There are more popular sports out there now than when I was a kid. So I think there has to be some
effect on baseball's popularity 15-20 years down the road. Seems unavoidable to me. Interest in the game is
going to shrink because fewer kids are playing it now.

I hope I haven't ignored important points from earlier postings on this thread that I didn't see. But this is
an interesting discussion and I think it goes beyond just the enjoyment we all get/got from baseball board games.
I think it's a comment on changing times and technology.
Willie

--- "Rick Teverbaugh" wrote:
> But I would take exception with obscene prices. Getting 3 hours of entertainment at a baseball game is
> much cheaper than at an NBA, NFL or NHL game. So if you mean obscene as in what it costs for a loaf of bread,
> I will concede. But as pro sports tickets go, baseball is far from obscene.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5760 Fri Feb 5, 2010 8:34 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

Hi,
HOWEVER PLAYER SALARIES ARE OBSCENE

--- "Rick Teverbaugh" wrote:
> But I would take exception with obscene prices. Getting 3 hours of entertainment at a baseball game is
> much cheaper than at an NBA, NFL or NHL game. So if you mean obscene as in what it costs for a loaf of bread,
> I will concede. But as pro sports tickets go, baseball is far from obscene.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5761 Fri Feb 5, 2010 12:24 pm
"Jolande Boot" <jboot62(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: e-list overload

many thanks

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... we've adjusted your membership to receive the "Daily Digest" (all one day's posts in a single e-mail)....
> By the way, group, just for the record, any member can very simply adjust their own membership details...
> just by clicking, ironically enough, the "Edit Membership" link near the top of any page of the Forum.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5762 Fri Feb 5, 2010 8:35 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

but you can't see in the bleachers

--- "Willie Drye" wrote:
> ... I agree with Rick that getting into a baseball stadium -- if you're not particular about where you sit --
> is usually cheaper, even at Major League parks. If you want a decent seat, however, that's a different story....
> I finally saw a game at Yankee Stadium in 2008... Great seats.... But I paid $275 for that seat... I could have
> sat in the bleachers for, what, $15 or less? And most of the time that's where I'd be....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5763 Fri Feb 5, 2010 1:09 pm
"Gary" <h_towngrooves(at)yahoo.com>
Re: info about Extra Innings

You can download the charts and rules for Extra Innings at Jeff Downey's site. ->
http://www.tabletop-sports.com/modules. ... oad&sid=87

Harrison Newhouse has created tons of seasons for Extra Innings... the Newhouse site ->
http://eibb.webng.com/

He has a computer version of the game, but he also has text files to use with the board game version.

Finally, there is an Extra Innings forum. It doesn't get much traffic, but there are a few regulars
who can help you out if you have any questions. ->
http://forums.delphiforums.com/extrainnings

I'm not familiar with the other game.

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> Cool, thanks for the info about both games.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5764 Fri Feb 5, 2010 1:35 pm
"Rick Teverbaugh" <rickert46015(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

Not really. the money is there. Would you rather the owners keep it? I've never once attended a game
so I could see an owner. Does anyone think that if suddenly the players took a 50% wage cut
that the owners would cut all ticket prices by 50%. I don't.
Rick T.

--- "Jerome, David R." wrote:
> Hi, HOWEVER PLAYER SALARIES ARE OBSCENE
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5765 Fri Feb 5, 2010 1:50 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "a dying breed"?

We'll have to quite completely agree with Rick on this last point. However, this splinter of the discussion
has rather gone off on a very off-topic tangent, so if you guys want to pursue this argument, we'd politely ask
that you take it over to our back-room forum at http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baseballsims/

Thanks very much. Now, if we can refocus on the future of baseball boardgaming, and how much interest
the current and subsequent generations might have in baseball history and memorabilia, that would be cool...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Rick Teverbaugh" wrote:
<< Not really. the money is there. Would you rather the owners keep it? I've never once attended a game
so I could see an owner. Does anyone think that if suddenly the players took a 50% wage cut
that the owners would cut all ticket prices by 50%. I don't.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5766 Fri Feb 5, 2010 2:15 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Re: re: info about Extra Innings

Awesome, thanks for all the good info!
-- Chris

--- "Gary" wrote:
> You can download the charts and rules for Extra Innings at Jeff Downey's site. ->
> http://www.tabletop-sports.com/modules. ... oad&sid=87
> Harrison Newhouse has created tons of seasons for Extra Innings... the Newhouse site ->
> http://eibb.webng.com/
> He has a computer version of the game, but he also has text files to use with the board game version.
> Finally, there is an Extra Innings forum. It doesn't get much traffic, but there are a few
> regulars who can help you out if you have any questions. ->
> http://forums.delphiforums.com/extrainnings
> I'm not familiar with the other game.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5767 Sat Feb 6, 2010 10:48 am
"mlamone" <mlamone(at)yahoo.com>
APBA #12

How do you tell the difference between 1957 and 1960R if the red twelve is next to 56 on both?
Thanks
Mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5768 Sat Feb 6, 2010 3:16 pm
"Dayton Payne" <dcpayne125(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA #12

Quickest way to tell is the fonts are completely different. You're talking about an original set of 1957,
so the other telling factor is down at the bottom of each card in the 1960R set is the J rating and the
copyright date (1986). No such thing on an original 1957 set. Also, look for players not in the bigs in 1957.
McCovey didn't come to the Giants until 1959. He'd be in any 1960 set.

--- "mlamone" wrote:
> How do you tell the difference between 1957 and 1960R if the red twelve is next to 56 on both? Thanks
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5769 Fri Feb 5, 2010 2:48 pm
"Chris Hemperley" <chris.hemperley(at)yahoo.com>
Free Strategy Baseball Game

Thought you might like this. A simple and FUN table-top Baseball Game. You call Pitching and Batting strategies-
Baserunning and more in this very intense and strategic baseball game. Your FREE Baseball Field and Rules are
attatched. All you need is a deck of cards and coins for baserunners. Have fun ! ... and pass along to a friend !

Christopher
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5770 Sun Feb 7, 2010 5:05 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Xtreme Baseball Strategy, and Forum stuff (was: Re: Free Strategy Baseball Game)

Thanks, Chris! Chris' game, *Xtreme Baseball Strategy,* can be opened or downloaded from
the "Games" folder of our Files section.

This also gives us the opportunity to yet once again point out two things that veteran members of the group
are surely tired of hearing but might be news to newer members: first, attachments (files, photos, &c')
*can not* be sent directly to the Forum/e-list -- Yahoo Groups software strips them off any messages.
If you have files or graphics you'd like to share with the group, send them *off-list* to webmuenster Butch
[ Butch7999(at)aol.com ] and we'll post them for you.

Second, you must be a member of the group for ninety days before you can post items or services for sale.
Additional restrictions on advertising are detailed in our Forum Policy, viewable both in the "Forum/e-list" folder
of our Files section and also on this page of our main site:
http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/Forumpolicy.htm

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Chris Hemperley" wrote:
<< Thought you might like this. A simple and FUN table-top Baseball Game. You call Pitching and Batting
strategies-Baserunning and more in this very intense and strategic baseball game. Your FREE Baseball Field
and Rules are attatched. All you need is a deck of cards and coins for baserunners. Have fun ! ...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5771 Sun Feb 7, 2010 10:08 am
"Mike Lamone" <mlamone(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA #12

Thanks so much.
Mike

--- "Dayton Payne" wrote:
> Quickest way to tell is the fonts are completely different. You're talking about an original set of 1957,
> so the other telling factor is down at the bottom of each card in the 1960R set is the J rating and the
> copyright date (1986). No such thing on an original 1957 set. Also, look for players not in the bigs in 1957....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5772 Sun Feb 7, 2010 1:32 pm
"Paul D'Amelio" <pdamelio(at)gmail.com> awk_m4
Re: Free Strategy Baseball Game

Hi Christopher
Thank you. I'd love to try it but Yahoo blocks attachments so the game you're offering needs to be posed
in out file area.
Regards
Paul D

--- "Chris Hemperley" wrote:
> ... You call Pitching and Batting strategies- Baserunning and more in this very intense and strategic
> baseball game. Your FREE Baseball Field and Rules are attatched....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5773 Sun Feb 7, 2010 5:31 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Free Strategy Baseball Game

Thank you Paul -- "*well,* class! We're glad to see *someone's* been paying attention!"
;-)
Anyway, Paul, that was addressed in our reply last night to Chris' post, and his game rules
were added to the Files section at that time as well...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Paul D'Amelio" wrote:
<< Hi Christopher
Thank you. I'd love to try it but Yahoo blocks attachments so the game you're offering
needs to be posed in out file area....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5774 Sun Feb 7, 2010 4:55 pm
"d b" <splendidfriend(at)yahoo.com>
"My Bucket List"; need your ideas to complete one item on my "Bucket List"

Hi everyone,
My bucket list item is "I want to re-play a baseball season using my computer to save me 75 % of the dice rolls
required." I heard I can set up the "managers for each team" and it plays the games in just seconds and provides
great stats as well. What do I need to get ... buy ... set up etc.? Do I need baseball for Windows and a season of
stats on a CD or what?
If so, I need some step -by-step guidelines as I suspect my technical level of expertise would create too many
hurdles to "get off the starting blocks".
Anyone helping me to set this up successfully on my computer earns a steak dinner on me ...
I pledge I will drive as far as one state away and take you to dinner .....
Or mail you a check to cover such a treat in your "hood" !!!

I lean towards a 1956 replay season. I was nine when the Redlegs made a run at the pennant with almost
no pitching. Well, they did have Hershal Freeman and Brooks Lawrence (I recall he went 13-0 thur July).
Poor Brooks lost his touch the second half of the season and ended up 19-13 (yuk).
My entire home town in Ohio rooted for them, truly. But my beloved Redlegs failed in the last week and
fell short by two games and finished third behind the eventual winner Brooklyn with the Milwaukee Braves
finishing second one game out. I began learning and appreciating the strategies of baseball then.

My cousin introduced me to APBA in 1957 and I probably played over 10,000 games mostly solo.
I started preparing for my 1956 replay (manually roll the dice for each team) in the National League.
This is taking an eternity or maybe it just me.

I wrote out "my replay rules" and drafted a checklist of the things I need to do to actually roll my first game.

1. Write my rules for the replay -
A. Batters and Pitchers must complete their IP or AB with three per cent of actual.
B. No Lefty - Righty rule this time
C. Use the Unusual Play Card
D. Use the Error re-distribution card
E. Use the Injury Card
F. Use a "Slow runner Rule" (from Maynard Aaburg in 1974 via the "Over the Hill League"
G. Use "Pitcher Appearance and IP Control Rules" developed in 1975 via a Face-to-face league
H. Transfer players based on actual trades, injuries, etc. from team to team
I. Restrict base runners to only ONE stolen base attempt per game using the old Hit and Run booklet
J. Use advanced fielding
K. I don't have the Master symbols so I won't use that.

2. Record "player transactions" for 1956 NL using website http://www.baseball-reference.com
(amazing website that posts every detail of every boxscore for every season)

3. Move players to their starting teams. Note each players usage before the "move to the next team (if traded).

4. Create Stat forms for each NL team to record replay stats and monitor G, AB and IP, Starts and
Relief Appearances.

5. Calculate my own system for Starting and Relief Pitching Rotations or use the actual boxscore
posted on above website.

6. Develop a schedule of when teams play Home and Away or use 1956 actual schedule (egad !!!
I don't relish the idea of looking up all 616 games at the website to record all Starting pitchers,
Line-ups and which teams played where.)

7. Analyze each NL team and develop the best strategy for them to use vs each other.

8. Keep the necessary stats per 4 and 5 above.

9. Roll the dice.

10. Complete the 1956 NL replay.

11. OK, now its OK to kick the bucket !!!!

Thanks for reading this.
I would appreciate any suggestions or ideas you may have, truly.
Kind regards,
David Beisner of Michigan
Home: 248-...-....

PS: I enjoyed writing this and enjoy what each of you write as well.
I look forward to new emails from the YahooBaseball Group.

--- "Willie Drye" wrote:
> ... Re. Butch's board game comments, I also totally agree. When I was a kid playing Negamco and, later,
> APBA when I had a part-time job and could afford it, the action was in my head....
> I have APBA's Baseball for Windows, and I enjoy playing it, though nothing like the board game when I was
> a kid. I have the BBW 1956 season. One way I've made BBW more interesting is by downloading online
> collections of Topps baseball cards from that period and combining the cards with the game....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5775 Sun Feb 7, 2010 5:30 pm
"d b" <splendidfriend(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA #12 on 56 for 1957?

Most of the original card sets I bought / saw in the 1950's and 1960's had "cutting knobs"
on the side of all the cards.
I don't know about after the 1960's

--- "mlamone" wrote:
> How do you tell the difference between 1957 and 1960R if the red twelve is next to 56 on both? Thanks
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5776 Sun Feb 7, 2010 5:26 pm
"d b" <splendidfriend(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

Hello again,
I believe we can all choose to "take a personal challenge" and simply introduce the idea of boardgames
to those we know. We can broach the topic easily enough by asking anyone, "Do you like professional sports?"
What is your favorite pro sport? Would you feel remotely interested in learning more about a table top board game
that simulates the results very closely to your favorite sport.

I play several times a week and a game takes maybe 30 minutes, etc.

A person's reply to these questions will yield an interested party or not. I trained two people to play APBA.
I found six other people over the years that also play APBA and we formed a league which was a fantastic
experience. My wife would sing the National Anthem when the guys came to my house when I live near
Dayton, Ohio. We would all join in. My wife would prepare a light snack for "our seventh inning stretch"
which usually occurred between our 2nd and 3rd game in our face-to-face four or five game series.
But then one of our league managers used the Montreal team and we didn't know the National Anthem
of Canada .... we all had a good laugh at that one.

Also, keep in mind, everyone does not like chocolate or have the exact same tastes in clothes, hobbies, food,
beverages, family values, politics, religious views, etc. So what? Some will; Some won't So What ?
(SW) 3 Some weeds will grow in your garden. Some weeds won't. So What?
Just take a few moments; pull the weeds out of your garden and move foward.
That was just a metaphor; I don't garden myself .... I'd rather roll dice.

Kind regards,
David of Michigan.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... Now, if we can refocus on the future of baseball boardgaming, and how much interest the current and
> subsequent generations might have in baseball history and memorabilia, that would be cool...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5777 Sun Feb 7, 2010 5:49 pm
"lynn lambert" <ronlynn3679(at)yahoo.com>
Re: "My Bucket List"; need your ideas to complete one item on my "Bucket List"

Hey David I remember those Reds teams as well. I also was from a small town in Ohio and began playing apba
in about 57 or 58. My friend and I played the entire nl schedule and I kept all the stats without a computer .
How was that possible ? A big job for 15-16 yr old boys. Brings back a lot of memories and not many games on tv.
Thank goodness for radio and Waite Hoyt. Thanks for the memories.

--- "d b" wrote:
> Hi everyone, My bucket list item is "I want to re-play a baseball season using my computer to save me
> 75 % of the dice rolls required." I heard I can set up the "managers for each team" and it plays the games
> in just seconds and provides great stats as well. What do I need to get ... buy ... set up etc.? ....
> I lean towards a 1956 replay season. I was nine when the Redlegs made a run at the pennant with almost
> no pitching.... My entire home town in Ohio rooted for them, truly.... I began learning and appreciating
> the strategies of baseball then. My cousin introduced me to APBA in 1957....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5778 Sun Feb 7, 2010 8:27 pm
"Paul D'Amelio" <pdamelio(at)gmail.com> awk_m4
Re: re: Free Strategy Baseball Game

You're welcome Butch.
:)
Looing at my email I missed your reply to the message Chris sent.
Regards
Paul D

--- "Butch7999" wrote:
> Thank you Paul -- "*well,* class! We're glad to see *someone's* been paying attention!" ;-)
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5779 Sun Feb 7, 2010 6:18 pm
"Chris Shockey" <jameshkidd(at)msn.com> acwmichbrig
Re: re: "a dying breed"?

I run the gaming room at a sci-fi convention called "Farpoint" near Baltimore, MD and I always make a point
to take all of my sports games with me to teach others. I currently own APBA baseball, football, and hockey;
Strat baseball, football, and basketball; Replay baseball, Second Season football; Statis Pro baseball and football;
Baseball Strategy, Football Strategy and Basketball Strategy; Paydirt! Football; Cadeco All-Star Baseball;
Ebbets Field Baseball (a very basic game that's great for the kiddies who are just starting out), as well as
numerous free games I've downloaded from the www, and a game of my own design called Days of Glory
based on the 1871-1875 National Association. Oh and PC Replay baseball.

I am also working on a baseball conversion for Games Workshops popular Blood Bowl Fantasy Football game.
I'm usually very good at determining a persons level of skill and suggesting an appropriate game to start them out.
Chris Shockey
Sent from my iPhone

--- "d b" wrote:
> Hello again, I believe we can all choose to "take a personal challenge" and simply introduce the idea of
> boardgames to those we know. We can broach the topic easily enough by asking anyone, "Do you like
> professional sports?" What is your favorite pro sport? Would you feel remotely interested in learning more
> about a table top board game that simulates the results very closely to your favorite sport....
> A person's reply to these questions will yield an interested party or not....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5780 Sun Feb 7, 2010 6:01 pm
"Chris Shockey" <jameshkidd(at)msn.com> acwmichbrig
Re: "My Bucket List"; need your ideas to complete one item on my "Bucket List"

I believe Replay Baseball is getting ready to release the 1956 season later this month for it's pc game.
It handles 100% of all dice rolls on screen (or u can roll real dice and input the rolls manually.
The actual schedules are used including all actual game day lineups and starting pitchers. All stats
are tracked automatically. You can also print out the scorecard and score while you play (this is what I do).
You can also play a tabletop game and input all stats manually into a boxscore. All boxscores are printable as well.

The game sells for $50, but you get one free season of your choice with your purchase, which is a pretty good
bargain. Other available seasons are only $22.
I'm currently replaying the 1964 season and I have the 1923 Negro League season waiting in the wings.
Best of all, the entire transaction is handled online and is completed with a download directly to your pc.
They will also provide you with an extra licence for free if you want to run the game on a laptop as well.
It's a very easy program to install. The game will automatically handle all transactions between teams.
If I remember correctly, the website is: http://www.replaybb.com
They have a free demo to download and try. I believe it is the 1984 season.

Hope this info helps!
Chris Shockey
Arbutus, MD

--- "d b" wrote:
> Hi everyone, My bucket list item is "I want to re-play a baseball season using my computer to save me
> 75 % of the dice rolls required." I heard I can set up the "managers for each team" and it plays the games
> in just seconds and provides great stats as well.... I need some step -by-step guidelines....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________
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Message #5781 Mon Feb 8, 2010 12:58 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

David, Chris, thanks for the follow-ups on this particular thread, which we'd very much like to see continue
with more input from the rest of the membership as well. We're restarting the topic with a new thread here,
since the old one has become quite fragmented with replies that are new and entirely separate discussions.

Not to take too strong a hand here in directing the conversation, but with everyone's indulgence, if we might
just try to focus the topic a bit more tightly -- perhaps the real question is "what *works* when it comes to
getting younger people seriously interested in boardgaming in general, and specifically in baseball boardgames,
baseball memorabilia, and baseball history?"

We can conjecture all we like about what *might* work, or what we try to do in this direction with other adults
-- but as we mentioned earlier in this discussion: for kids brought up in a world of iPods, Blueberries, Blacktooths,
GameBoxes, and WiWis, boardgames (especially the antique and vintage games that are the ostensible central
theme of this forum) often seem to strike most of them as something with all the relevance and excitement of
dial telephones or manual typewriters. What can -- or do -- adult players of baseball boardgames do
to turn the little videogame zombies into dedicated fans of the cardboard, dice, and spinner games we love?

To save some time and space, we'll posit that, as a given, the kids have to become fans of baseball, the actual
game on the field, before there's any chance of getting them to enjoy a baseball boardgame. How to do that
is really a separate question, and fortunately, at least for the granddads and uncles here in the front office,
that part hasn't been too difficult. Getting them to sit still for an hour and roll the dice or spin a spinner, however,
is like asking them if they'd like to do extra homework.

We're confident, though, that at least a few of the 1100 folks in this group have converted their kids or grandkids
into enthusiastic players of one baseball boardgame or another. What was your method? What's your secret?
How did you do that? We look forward to some good feedback on this one...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5782 Mon Feb 8, 2010 10:50 pm
"yankfans_1961" <yankfans_1961(at)yahoo.com>
Recent Acquisition - "4 Game Boards"

Thought I'd share with you an acquisition I made a few months back ...

The item is a large children's game book (looks to me like the 1940s) from the Faircrest Lowe Series.
Pretty ingenious for its day ... there is one game board per set of facing pages and the spinner
in the upper right corner is used for all four games (baseball, football, basketball, auto racing).
The play result numbers are obtained from adding the number in the inner circle to the number on
the outer circle after spinning the dial. I computed the actual percentages ... not your standard
2 through 12 results. The baseball game involves a pitcher spin to determine ball, strike, and in-play.
In the latter case, the spin opportunity moves over to the batter.

Butch & crew have promised to post some images I sent along.
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5783 Tue Feb 9, 2010 4:35 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Recent Acquisition - "4 Game Boards"

Hi Dave, thanks for the Show-'n-Tell contribution! Very cool pick-up. And we expected we'd have your photos
of the game up on-line before we even posted your message, but as luck would have it, Yahoo is implementing
yet another wonderful little glitch in their software, which you can read about here, where Yahoo techs routinely
declare problems solved long before they're actually solved, and Yahoo Groups owners/moderators and confused
non-English speakers meet to grouse and whine:
http://www.ygroupsblog.com/blog/2010/01 ... ad-issues/

As soon as Yahoo sorts out their photo-upload snafu -- hopefully within the next couple of days
-- we'll get some pics up for ya. Our apologies for the inconvenience...
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
<< Thought I'd share with you an acquisition I made a few months back ...
The item is a large children's game book (looks to me like the 1940s) from the Faircrest Lowe Series.
Pretty ingenious for its day ... Butch & crew have promised to post some images I sent along.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5784 Tue Feb 9, 2010 8:32 pm
"reviewboy1" <reviewboy1(at)yahoo.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

Butch and others -
Over the past two years I have introduced five people to baseball boards games. Of the five, none had ever
played a sports board game before. Of the five, four liked the game and continue to play baseball board games.
The youngest of the four is in his early 20s, and the others' ages range from early 30s to mid-50s.
Not that I am an expert at this, but for what it's worth here's my approach:

+ Approach people who like both baseball and games. The games that they like don't need to be sports
board games, or even board games in general. One of the most avid 'converts' I found was (and is)
enthusiastic about playing bridge.

If the person does not like baseball or does not like games, I think it is a long shot that the person will
like baseball board games.

+ Those of us who want baseball board games to continue to enjoy some degree of popularity need to actively
recruit new players. Most people, even many (most?) baseball fans, are not aware that these games exist.
There is so little advertising for these games that few new gamers will find out about baseball board games
on their own.

+ Make the person's first game fun. This probably seems like such a trivial a statement that I shouldn't bother
stating it. But, it doesn't always happen. I got introduced to a couple of sports (mountain biking and downhill
skiing) in the worst possible way imaginable, by being taken down the equivalent of a black diamond run
on the first day. In the rain.

So, how do I make the first game fun? First of all, choose an appropriate game. Even though it's not the game
that I play the most myself, I consider Strat-O-Matic to be the best intro game, because the Basic game is to
incredibly easy to learn and play, and it is so easy to add Advanced rules.

Introduce the recruit to the most stripped-down version of the game possible. For Strat, that means ignoring,
initially the Advanced, Super Advanced, and 'for greater realism' (Basic Comprehensive) rules.

In fact, don't even explain all of the Basic Basic rules before playing. You can tackle the X-Chart when the first
X play comes up. Rules are boring, and playing is fun. So, try to get the first game started within 5-10 minutes
of having the lineups selecting and game parts laid out. You can do it. Rather than explain how to reason results
of the player cards before starting the game, use the first at bat to explain that.

For the person's first game, try to provide the person with a team/year that they like. If they are a Yankees fan,
choose a season when the Yankees were very strong. For yourself, choose an opposing team that will probably lose.
I do this by choosing the worst pitcher possible for my team. This gives the recruit lots of offense. We know that
winning is more fun than losing, and we want the newbie to have a positive experience.

People are naturally competitive, so set up some sort of tournament, even if it only consists of a few games.

If your 'recruit' likes the game, then you can pique his or her interest in baseball in general by recommending
movies, DVD (for example, Ken Burns' series), books, trivia, etc that are related to the games that you are playing.

I can assure that there are TONS of potential new board gamers out there. We just need to recruit them.
With all of the amazingly fun and sophisticated baseball board games available today, there is no reason
that this should not be the golden age of baseball board games.

That's my perspective on the subject. If you are still reading after all that I wrote, I'm impressed with your endurance.

If Butch will forgive me (perhaps I should start a new string?) for some topic drift, where I have failed to
get to first base is in introducing seniors to baseball board games. I've written and called senior center
activity directors, and I've received zero interest in receiving a demo. If anyone can suggest networking
approaches I'd be grateful.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5785 Tue Feb 9, 2010 11:12 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Recent Acquisition - "4 Game Boards"

There we go -- either Yahoo finally sorted out their programming glitch, or we snuck in a window
while the photo upload app was briefly working -- in either case, here in the front office, at least,
we're now seeing Dave's pictures of his game, and hopefully all of you can, as well. They're in the
"Wha'd Ya Get?" album of the Forum's Photos section, the last pic on that album's first page and
the first pic on the second page. Let us know if those, or any photos anywhere in the Forum pages,
aren't showing up properly.

Dave, thanks again for sending those along! Although clearly intended for a very young audience,
the graphic set-up, anyway, really is quite clever -- the spinner for all four games is on the last
right-hand page, the inside back cover if you will, and is visible for all four games through a die-cut window.

While the game appears to sport no copyright date, "1940s" is a good estimate. The Samuel Lowe company
also published a similar volume -- *Baseball Football Hockey Basketball 4 Thrilling Games 4* -- with a 1942
copyright, and it's probably safe to assume both "game books" were published within couple years of each other.
They seem to be surprisingly scarce today -- Dave's is only the third example of *Baseball... 4 Board Games*
we've seen, and we've seen *Baseball... 4 Thrilling Games 4* just once.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
<< Thought I'd share with you an acquisition I made a few months back ... The item is a large children's game book
(looks to me like the 1940s) from the Faircrest Lowe Series. Pretty ingenious for its day.... Butch & crew have
promised to post some images I sent along.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5786 Tue Feb 9, 2010 11:38 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

Outstanding post, Ralph, thanks -- intriguing, encouraging, even inspirational. Excellent things to keep in mind
when and if we can ever so much as get the young'ns to sit down and give a baseball boardgame a try.

That's three voices heard from on this topic -- only 1,097 more to go! Hopefully Ralph's extremely thoughtful
essay will encourage more of the fellers on board to relate their own experiences and suggestions.

As to the senior citizen angle, we've often thought about that very thing, although we hadn't imagined it would be
so difficult an idea to sell -- in fact, we kind of assumed it would be the sort of thing the type of places
you mentioned would jump at! Dang -- we're probably not far away from residence in such an institution
ourselves, and what? No tabletop baseball there? We're not goin'!
Somewhere in our muddled recall, though, there was something, several years back, we thought we read about
*All-Star Baseball* -- the Cadaco / Ethan Allen game -- being shown or played at some eldercare facility.
Anybody remember anything about that?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "reviewboy1" wrote:
<< ... Over the past two years I have introduced five people to baseball boards games. Of the five,
none had ever played a sports board game before. Of the five, four liked the game and continue to play
baseball board games. The youngest of the four is in his early 20s, and the others' ages range from
early 30s to mid-50s. Not that I am an expert at this, but for what it's worth here's my approach: ...
...
... where I have failed to get to first base is in introducing seniors to baseball board games. I've written
and called senior center activity directors, and I've received zero interest in receiving a demo. If anyone
can suggest networking approaches I'd be grateful.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5787 Wed Feb 10, 2010 7:44 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

very good piece, i LIKE YOUR APPROACH,
DAVID

--- "reviewboy1" wrote:
> ... Over the past two years I have introduced five people to baseball boards games. Of the five,
> none had ever played a sports board game before. Of the five, four liked the game and continue to play
> baseball board games. The youngest of the four is in his early 20s, and the others' ages range from
> early 30s to mid-50s. Not that I am an expert at this, but for what it's worth here's my approach: ...
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5788 Wed Feb 10, 2010 10:15 am
"textraders" <rahenson1(at)hotmail.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

At this point I actually have more experience as one recruited than a recruiter. I didn't play my first
baseball board game until I was about 25. A co-worker knew I am a baseball fan and we actually started
with MLB Showdown which is I suppose a card game more than a board game.

As Ralph suggested the first game or so we played with the very basic rules that Showdown offers.
Though we didn't have full rosters of real teams we did draft teams from cards that he already had and
we recorded those rosters so in future games we didn't have to go through the lengthy draft process.
In future games we mixed in the intermediate and then advanced rules with the strategy deck.

I think it was about two years later that he showed me Sherco. In that situation we actually did start with
a team I liked. The Rangers had just finished the '04 season where they competed for the pennant into the
last week for the first time since their division wins in the '90s. So I played as that team. Again we kept
the first few games simple. Just read the pitch results from the main chart and find the play on the appropirate
card. It was later that wind, batter advantage, clutch rating, special events, etc. all made their presence.

What I particularly liked about Sherco was the player formulas were included (mostly at least as I am still
hunting that clutch rating I talked about right after joining the group here). So I was able to go home and
build more of the teams I liked and had something to look forward to when we would play again. My friend is
a Padres fan so to thank him I also built their pennant winning teams from yesteryear like the '84 and '98
NL champions.

I've showed each of those games to a brother-in-law and tried to use a similar approach. When we played
Showdown I had pre-drafted teams I thought were pretty equal and we got straight into that. For Sherco
he's a Royals fan so we played the '85 Royals against the '85 Cards (so much for picking a team he should have
an easy time beating!). We did just a few innings in each case so the time spent was only about 15 minutes.
I didn't want him to have to deal with a 30-45+ minute game and grow tired of it. He's in Iowa and I'm in Texas
so I don't know that it's terribly likely to work as he'd have to start introducing people to the game so he'd have
someone to play with before he even knows it that well himself.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Outstanding post, Ralph, thanks ... That's three voices heard from on this topic -- only 1,097 more to go!
> Hopefully Ralph's extremely thoughtful essay will encourage more of the fellers on board to relate their
> own experiences and suggestions.
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5789 Wed Feb 10, 2010 11:01 am
"zorfex77" <partinr(at)hotmail.com>
getting others to play board games

Nice post. Thanks.
I got introduced to APBA baseball in 1968 or so, when a friend asked me if I wanted to learn
how to play this baseball board game he had. I said sure.
So what did he do? He gave me the 1962 New York Mets and he took the then-loaded San Francisco Giants!
The first thing I learned was what a "D" pitcher rating meant, as every single hurler on the Mets' staff
of that 40-120 team was rated "D."

In spite of that sordid beginning, I still play APBA.
I also play all kinds of board or card games and constantly try to interest my family in playing them,
with mixed success.

The main challenge is simply coaxing someone into sitting down and trying a game. Sometimes the theme
is practically irrelevant, so long as the game's well designed, but as regards baseball it's certainly true
that one has to have an interest in the game for starters. Kids today have so many distractions, but in
my experience --even with kids who are addicted to video games --if you can get them to sit down and
try a board game (my kids are 17, 16 and 10), the inherent fun of play and social interaction shines through.
But much depends on the theme, ease of play and fun a particular game provides.
-Rick P.

--- "reviewboy1" wrote:
> ... Over the past two years I have introduced five people to baseball boards games. Of the five,
> none had ever played a sports board game before. Of the five, four liked the game and continue to play
> baseball board games. The youngest of the four is in his early 20s, and the others' ages range from
> early 30s to mid-50s. Not that I am an expert at this, but for what it's worth here's my approach: ...
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5790 Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:42 pm
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

thanks

--- "textraders" wrote:
> At this point I actually have more experience as one recruited than a recruiter. I didn't play
> my first baseball board game until I was about 25....
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5791 Wed Feb 10, 2010 1:47 pm
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: getting others to play board games

Hi, GLAD you can get your family involved. I introduced my boys then age 16 and 13 to strat back in the late 90's
.,and we played many games for 1 year. IT then faded for them as they had many others things in their lives.
Now my middle boy age 24 plays with me whenever he is over the house. We are now playing the 1966 season
with AL TEAMS.

--- "zorfex77" wrote:
> ... I got introduced to APBA baseball in 1968 or so, when a friend asked me if I wanted to learn how to play
> this baseball board game he had. I said sure. So what did he do? He gave me the 1962 New York Mets and
> he took the then-loaded San Francisco Giants! ... In spite of that sordid beginning, I still play APBA.
> I also play all kinds of board or card games and constantly try to interest my family in playing them....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5792 Wed Feb 10, 2010 3:09 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "a dying breed"? cont'd

Hi Bob, thanks for those insights! You remind us that the stories of those of you out there who've been "recruited"
as baseball boardgamers are every bit as valuable as the stories of those of you who've successfully recruited
other new players. Keep the thoughts on this topic comin' in, fellers...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "textraders" wrote:
<< At this point I actually have more experience as one recruited than a recruiter. I didn't play
my first baseball board game until I was about 25....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5793 Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:33 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Newb question on how to play Extra Innings

I have a question for all of you who play Extra Innings.
I got a used copy of Extra Innings Fourth Edition and was trying to start my first game.
I'm not as experienced as most of you at tabletop baseball, so please excuse the dumb question.
First player is at bat and I roll a 1-6-6.
The First Roll Chart says to see the pitcher's walk rating. So I go to the historic roster for the 1969
Baltimore Orioles and look at Jim Palmer. I see a W column, with 1-3-5 and a K column with 5-6-4.
How do I interpret this?

Thanks,
Chris
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5794 Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:37 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Re: getting others to play board games

> + Make the person's first game fun.... how do I make the first game fun? First of all, choose an appropriate
> game.... Introduce the recruit to the most stripped-down version of the game possible.... In fact, don't even
> explain all of the Basic Basic rules before playing.... Rules are boring, and playing is fun. So, try to get
> the first game started within 5-10 minutes of having the lineups selecting and game parts laid out....

That is good advice. I had a guy once show me how to play with Strat-O-Matic, but he was a big baseball geek
who had been playing for years, so he was using the advanced rules, triple-cross-referencing all these different
charts. He realized it was too much for me (I'm a casual baseball fan, and new to tabletop baseball games), so
the next time he brought in Statis Pro and showed me that instead.
-- Chris
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5795 Thu Feb 11, 2010 1:55 pm
"Rick Hargraves" <rickh6(at)charter.net> wordman6611
Re: re: getting others to play board games

I had a similar experience. A guy showed me APBA, but he used so many complex "innovations" to the game
that my first game took about 3 hours. And he explained EVERY possible rule, option, etc. Somehow, I survived
and have played APBA for 20 years or so. But whenever I show someone the board game, it is straight Basic
right out of the box. A very simple yet fun game, and a great way to show people how much fun board baseball
can be. All the extras and options -- even other games -- all can be explored later if the guy wishes.
But you need to get them rolling the dice.

Rick

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
>> + Make the person's first game fun....
> That is good advice. I had a guy once show me how to play with Strat-O-Matic, but he was a big baseball geek
> who had been playing for years, so he was using the advanced rules, triple-cross-referencing all these different
> charts. He realized it was too much for me (I'm a casual baseball fan, and new to tabletop baseball games), so
> the next time he brought in Statis Pro and showed me that instead.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5796 Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:35 am
"Gary" <h_towngrooves(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Newb question on how to play Extra Innings

Those ratings mean that Palmer walks a hitter on rolls 1-1-1 to 1-3-5. So, 1-6-6 would not be a walk.

For the strikeout rating, Palmer strikes out a hitter on a second roll of 5-6-4 to 6-6-6
(assuming no adjustment by a PK or MK hitter). If no strikeout, it's a ground ball.

Now, there is a chance that the walk (and strikeout) rating could be adjusted by the hitter
if they are a PW, MW, MK, or PK.

One of the weaknesses of EI is the ERA adjustment chart on hits. There are some improvements to it
that have been made by others, but if you are new to the game, you might as well get your feet wet first
before looking at those modifications. They're actually not hard, but you should probably just play with
the original chart first.

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> I have a question for all of you who play Extra Innings.... trying to start my first game....
> First player is at bat and I roll a 1-6-6. The First Roll Chart says to see the pitcher's walk rating.
> So I go to the historic roster for the 1969 Baltimore Orioles and look at Jim Palmer. I see a W column,
> with 1-3-5 and a K column with 5-6-4. How do I interpret this? Thanks...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5797 Fri Feb 12, 2010 5:17 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Re: re: Newb question on how to play Extra Innings

Gary, thank you for your reply, that makes perfect sense now.
Thanks,
Chris

--- "Gary" wrote:
> Those ratings mean that Palmer walks a hitter on rolls 1-1-1 to 1-3-5. So, 1-6-6 would not be a walk.
> For the strikeout rating, Palmer strikes out a hitter on a second roll of 5-6-4 to 6-6-6
> (assuming no adjustment by a PK or MK hitter). If no strikeout, it's a ground ball....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5798 Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:17 pm
"yankfans_1961" <yankfans_1961(at)yahoo.com>
1961 Yankees season replay

I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
Dave
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5799 Sat Feb 13, 2010 12:36 pm
"Willie Drye" <dryemorr(at)mchsi.com> beaucat001
Re: 1961 Yankees season replay

Yes. Would like to see your results as often as you'd care to post them, especially as you
get deeper into the season and the Maris-Mantle home run contest is underway.
Willie

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
> I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
> Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5800 Sat Feb 13, 2010 6:12 pm
"Henri Roca" <rocwwm2001(at)yahoo.com>
Re: 1961 Yankees season replay

Yes, Dave, please post your replay. Hopefully as boxscores.
Many thanks
Regards
Henri

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
> I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
> Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5801 Sun Feb 14, 2010 12:01 pm
"d b" <splendidfriend(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: 1961 Yankees season replay

Hello Baseball board game fans ....
Let me the second or third person to wish you all a happy valentines day .... my valentine is now touring Australia
(Tennis major) for seven weeks .... (drat )! So I trust you all appreciate having your significent other
somewhere near you in your city.

I would like to read your progress as you go .... I don't believe Ford can go 25-4 again but do keep us posted.

Question: You used a tern new to me ... "Skeetersoft cards and boards" ....
help me understand what that is and perhaps a website so I can learn more.

David of Michigan

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
> I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
> Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5802 Sun Feb 14, 2010 1:42 pm
"splendidfriend" <splendidfriend(at)yahoo.com>
Michigan fans: Develop face-to-face encounters ?????

Hello,
I would like to develop face-to-face encounters with others in this yahoo group.

I play mostly APBA but just bought Strat-O-Matic and would like to roll a few games with others
in this fine group.

Question #1: How do I find them?

Question #2: What if we encouraged everyone to include their city and state they live in
with their yahoo group comments.

Thanks
David Beisner
Rochester Hills, MI 48309 (Detroit Metro area)
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5803 Mon Feb 15, 2010 11:40 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Michigan fans: Develop face-to-face encounters ??

Hi again David, and thanks for your questions and comments!

To your first question, inquiring here as you just did is probably the best (and maybe only) way to find folks
*in this particular group* who'd be available for face-to-face gameplaying. Some guys include their location
in their Yahoo profile (which can be viewed by clicking on their Yahoo ID in Forum messages), but most don't,
and you'd have to click on all 1100 of 'em one by one to see who does and who doesn't. As another comment
on our affiliated "Cadaco ASB" forum recently reminded us, though, the existence of webcams allows for
what might be the next best thing, rendering geographic location moot. If, however, your heart's set on
real face-to-face gaming, you might try checking out sites like Meetup.com [ http://www.meetup.com ]
and seeing if there's anything going on in your area. You can also ask around at other Yahoo groups
devoted solely to *APBA* and *Strat-O-Matic.*

As to your second question, we certainly don't and wouldn't *discourage* anyone from mentioning their location
-- some of our regular contributors already do, as a matter of course -- but for a lot of people (including us here
in the front office), a certain level of anonymity is a big part of the internet's appeal, so we'll never *require*
anyone in this group to disclose *any* personal info. That said, if enough folks on board want to make some of
their basic data accessible to the rest of the group, we'd be fine with putting something in our Files section
(or maybe a new Database) that would include as much information as anyone cares to provide about themselves.
Guys, let us know if you want to volunteer some contact data, and we'll straightaway get to establishing
a corresponding list...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "splendidfriend" wrote:
<< Hello, I would like to... roll a few games with others in this fine group.
Question #1: How do I find them?
Question #2: What if we encouraged everyone to include their city and state they live in with
their yahoo group comments....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5804 Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:38 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: 1961 Yankees season replay

dave. Hi, i would be interested.
david

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
> I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
> Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5805 Tue Feb 16, 2010 10:56 am
"Art Williams" <elbonian(at)yahoo.com>
1961 season Reply and Skeetersoft

http://www.skeetersoftinc.com

Are you using the NP3 or the Legacy cards??
Ron
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5806 Tue Feb 16, 2010 2:55 pm
"cavalcadeofsports"
SABR 2010 Guide freely available

Passing the word along for replay enthusiasts and for baseball fans in general:

<< From: sabr.notes(at)sabr.org
> Subject: SABR Makes Baseball Guide Available to Everyone
> Last year, you downloaded The Emerald Guide to Baseball 2009. In case you haven't heard already,
> the 2010 edition is now available. SABR is pleased once again to offer The Emerald Guide to Baseball
> as a free PDF download from the SABR website. Edited by Gary Gillette and Pete Palmer with Rod Nelson
> and Ted Turocy, the Guide condenses the 2009 season into 580+ fact-filled pages. Developed in the spirit of
> the classic guides published by the Sporting News, Spalding, and Reach, The Emerald Guide includes all
> pitching, hitting, and fielding statistics for every player active in the major and minor leagues during 2009.
> Other features include team histories, up-to-date team contact information and schedules, an extensive
> Year in Review essay, team day-by-day game logs, All-Star Game box score and play-by-play, post-season
> box scores and play-by-play, transactions, debuts, first-year player draft, and major and minor league
> necrology. All we ask in exchange for the free PDF is filling out [ http://snipurl.com/ue0ll ] a very short form.
> ... A bound version is available via print on demand at Lulu.com for $24.95. The electronic version of the Guide
> contains all of the pages of the printed version. Please tell all your baseball friends about this offer.
> Thanks!
> John Zajc, Executive Director
> Society for American Baseball Research
> 812 Huron Rd E #719
> Cleveland OH 44115 [ http://www.sabr.org ]
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5807 Fri Feb 19, 2010 2:59 pm
"Chris Bryant" <prince_charming98bg(at)yahoo.com>
Re: 1961 Yankees season replay

Sure,and the standings now and then.
Chris Bryant

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
> I'm 3 games into a 1961 Yankees season replay using Skeetersoft cards and boards.
> Anyone interested in me posting game results as the season progresses?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5808 Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:18 am
"Bruce Rubin" <barubin(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: Be A Manager - Koufax

Jim,
I'd like to see your Koufax card for Be A Manager. Is it an image or a pdf?
TIA.
--Bruce

--- "jimwhitty" wrote:
> ... Great to see the interest in these games. Butch, I wanted to let you know we have resloved our problem
> of having no Sandy Koufax pitchers card in the 1967 version of our BE A MANAGER game. We made our own! ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5809 Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:52 am
"mlamone" <mlamone(at)yahoo.com>
APBA boards

Can someone tell me when the cardboard boards began putting A-B-C-D on the boards? Thanks
Mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5810 Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:26 am
"Bruce Rubin" <barubin(at)yahoo.com>
Cookie Rojas hits a HR with a 2-2-2 roll!

Cookie Rojas! Yeah!
BTW, did you notice that Stargell, whose uniform was "8", hit a HR when 1-2-3 was rolled (i.e. an "8")
on his 1967 card?!?

--- "jimwhitty" wrote:
> Here is my vote for favorite! Ever since I was a little kid my brothers and I played a game called "Be A Manager"
> by BAMCO and Sy Marder. This game is out of print but I managed to get a copies of the National and American
> league versions from 1966 on Ebay. The beauty of this game is that we now have a 6 team league that we play
> at our local pub, our houses and pretty much anywhere.... This game is great because it brings back our youth
> and it gets us yet another excuse to hook up with friends and drink beer and yell HOME RUN when Cookie Rojas
> rolls 2-2-2!!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5811 Sat Feb 20, 2010 1:01 pm
"jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.ne>
Re: Cookie Rojas hits a HR with a 2-2-2 roll!

Oh Yeah!
My nephew manages the Pirates team in our BE A MANAGER league and he points that out to me
every time he hits a home run off one of my pitchers. ;)
Jim

--- "Bruce Rubin" wrote:
> Cookie Rojas! Yeah! BTW, did you notice that Stargell, whose uniform was "8", hit a HR
> when 1-2-3 was rolled (i.e. an "8") on his 1967 card?!?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5812 Sat Feb 20, 2010 1:02 pm
<jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.net>
Re: re: Be A Manager - Koufax

Its on an Excel file and I will send it to Butch to post on the web site.
Jim

--- "Bruce Rubin" wrote:
> Jim, I'd like to see your Koufax card for Be A Manager. Is it an image or a pdf? TIA.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5813 Sat Feb 20, 2010 1:59 pm
"yankfans_1961" <yankfans_1961(at)yahoo.com>
Re: 1961 season Reply and Skeetersoft

Legacy cards.

--- "Art Williams" wrote:
> ... Are you using the NP3 or the Legacy cards??
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5814 Sat Feb 20, 2010 2:01 pm
"yankfans_1961" <yankfans_1961(at)yahoo.com>
Re: 1961 Yankees season replay

I'm only playing the Yankees games, so standings would be out of context.

--- "Chris Bryant" wrote:
> Sure,and the standings now and then.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5815 Sat Feb 20, 2010 2:03 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Be A Manager - Koufax

Thanks very much, Jim! The Koufax card can now be downloaded from the "Games" folder of our Files section
-- it's BeAManager_Koufax.xls -- and for those of you who don't have Excel, a free viewer can be downloaded
from this site: http://www.softwarepatch.com/software/excelviewer.html

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "jimwhitty" wrote:
<< Its on an Excel file and I will send it to Butch to post on the web site.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5816 Sat Feb 20, 2010 2:38 pm
"Tom Nahigian" <tnahigian(at)bigplanet.com>
Re: Hot Corner Baseball Question

A couple of years ago I picked up a copy of Hot Corner Baseball. It came with great teams such as
the 1927 Yankees and the 1931 Philadelphis Athletics. I sat down to play a game and wrote in the lineups,
but then I got stuck. You need to combine the batter and pitcher rating for another rating. I was confused
about how to do this.

Has anyone played this game? How does the game play? Is it a game one would recommend? Thank you.
Take Care,
Tom Nahigian
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5817 Sat Feb 20, 2010 5:01 pm
"Lionheart®" <za7002az(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA boards

The last boards I got - 1995, have it, the ones from 1986 don't. I don't know why it's there because it doesn't
change anything. Perhaps they thought it would make the game a little more interesting with the play descriptions.
Gary

--- "mlamone" wrote:
> Can someone tell me when the cardboard boards began putting A-B-C-D on the boards? Thanks
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5818 Sat Feb 20, 2010 4:16 pm
"Allen Shock" <allenshock1(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA boards

1951, with the first edition of APBA Baseball; the pitcher grades have always been in the game
(since APBA started, at least).
Allen

--- "mlamone" wrote:
> Can someone tell me when the cardboard boards began putting A-B-C-D on the boards? Thanks
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5819 Sat Feb 20, 2010 9:26 pm
"Allen Shock" <allenshock1(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA boards

I think I may have misunderstood the question ...was it in referebce to the "radio boards" from the 90's?
I thought it was asking when they added pitching grades..
Allen

--- "Lionheart..." wrote:
> The last boards I got - 1995, have it, the ones from 1986 don't. I don't know why it's there....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5820 Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:51 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

Hi everyone,
I've been reading the posts but have had little to contribute. I thought I'd report on a pickup I made
a few months ago - The Base Ball Game - H.H.Durgin, Pittsfield, Mass. - 1885.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1259720147

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1259720191

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1259720257

It's missing the parts to play the game but I was reading Baseball Games by Mark Cooper
and I found a similar game with a different adverstiser.
The game appears to be a premium supplied by the clothing/shoe company to customers.
The missing part is the teetotum or spinner to play the game.

Here's the picture from the book which shows the similar game given to patrons by the
S.D. Hadley & Co. which references H. H. Durgin as the copyrighter.
One might infer that Durgin is the maker of the game - but as one can see from my game,
that it's a clothing company. I'm guessing the maker of the game - as such - is anonymous?

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266697556

Any input would be much appreciated - this appears to be a kid's pocket/travel style game
- in that it's only 4x4" - mine is very fragile.

This is the oldest game I - personally - have in my collection.
My plan is to eventually add a game section to a website so I can share what I've picked up
over the years. I've been actively collecting games since 2005, I believe.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5821 Sun Feb 21, 2010 8:53 am
"Mike Lamone" <mlamone(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA boards

I was asking about the large white boards. I have seen them without letters and letters
on the bottom right hand corner.

--- "Allen Shock" wrote:
> I think I may have misunderstood the question ...was it in referebce to the "radio boards" from the 90's?
> I thought it was asking when they added pitching grades..
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5822 Sun Feb 21, 2010 12:47 am
"johnvitz" <angelusmusic(at)aol.com>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

This is FANTASTIC! The cover and artwork are fascinating; but, the rules are hysterical...
("Choose your favorite team"?).... not nearly as complicated as my BASEBALL CHALLENGE game!
This is what makes our group so much fun. You guys never cease to amaze me with your knowledge of
the history of table top baseball.
Butch, what can you tell us about Durgin's game. I'll bet, in its day, it was really a hot commodity!
:-)
Thanks!
John Vitz
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5823 Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:07 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

Hi Mike, welcome back to the Forum and thanks very much for your message!
It's no secret that it's the old games like this one that get our dessicated little hearts a-flutter
and are the reason we started this group in the first place.

There are actually three confirmed variations of your game, and a reported but unverified fourth. Based mainly
on the H H Durgin credit/copyright that's carried on all the versions and the fact that yours is a promotional piece
for Durgin's own haberdashery, we *think* your version -- *"Base Ball Game"* -- is the original edition.

The two known variations -- both titled *New Base Ball Game.* -- are the S D Hadley & Co version (shown in
Mark's book) and another for C W Smith's. Durgin's operation was, as plainly seen on the cover of your game's box,
located in Pittsfield Massachusetts, about 30 miles southeast of Albany. Hadley's was a shoe store in Northampton
Mass', about 30 miles southeast of Pittsfield. Smith's was another haberdashery, in Hudson Mass', just west of
Boston. We've run across one further reference to the game as a promotional piece for "Clark & Martin's," but
we have yet to actually see evidence of that version.

Durgin, listed with a Boston address, is credited as the copyright holder on both the Hadley and Smith variations.
*Tuff Stuff's Baseball Memorabilia Price Guide* (1998), a valuable if occasionally inaccurate resource, includes
a listing for "Durgin's New Baseball Game" and credits the company as "Durgin & Palmer," the only citation
we've seen for anyone named Palmer in connection with the game. We'd like to know whence they got that tidbit.
Perhaps they had access to yet a fifth variation.

We can't prove any of this, but we think this story makes sense: the game was devised by Durgin himself or by
one of his partners or employees (the mysterious Mister Palmer, perhaps) and Durgin then produced the game
as a promo giveaway for his Pittsfield store. Finding the promotion successful, he copyrighted it, convinced at least
a couple of related businesses of its advertising value, and, in return for some sort of renumeration or compensation,
produced new versions for those outfits (or allowed them to produce the game themselves), sporting the Durgin
copyright notice.

The original teetotum, which makes the game playable, is considerably more scarce than the game's box and board.
Fortunately, we have a good photo of it, and it's a ridiculously easy thing to reproduce -- a little cardboard octagon
about an inch and a half across, marked with a play result on each of the eight edges (clockwise, O, 1, O, 2, O, 3,
O, HR). A wooden peg roughly an inch and a half long and an eighth of an inch in diameter was inserted through
the center of the octagon in order to spin it. Little flat circular markers were also included to indicate baserunners.

We know Mark owns (or has owned) both the Hadley and Smith versions, and perhaps other variations as well,
so hopefully he'll chime in on this thread and perhaps offer some additional insights or correct any erroneous
surmises on our part.

In any case, Mike, congratulations on a terrific acquisition! We've seen only five of these hit the auction market
over the last ten years, so that 125-year-old cutie is quite an enviable prize. If you don't mind, we'll add a couple
of your pics to the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album of our Photos section. Now get to work on that website!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< Hi everyone, I've been reading the posts but have had little to contribute. I thought I'd
report on a pickup I made a few months ago - The Base Ball Game - H.H.Durgin, Pittsfield, Mass. - 1885.
http://snipurl.com/uggfi
http://snipurl.com/uggg0
http://snipurl.com/ugggf
...
... I'm guessing the maker of the game - as such - is anonymous? http://snipurl.com/ugggu ...
... My plan is to eventually add a game section to a website so I can share what I've picked up over the years....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5824 Sun Feb 21, 2010 2:28 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
Re: re: APBA boards

hey u guys:
r u referring 2 scoring notations after the outcome description? such as:
4-3 for a groundout 2 the second baseman relayed 2 first? E5 for an error on the thirdbaseman?
i will have 2 look at my 1981 boards 2 c if they were absent back then.
curt young

--- "allenshock1" wrote:
> I think I may have misunderstood the question ...was it in referebce to the "radio boards" from the 90's?
> I thought it was asking when they added pitching grades..
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5825 Sun Feb 21, 2010 3:37 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

Thanx for the kind words Butch!
My brother is a junior 'hack' and is gonna help me with a web which will tandom off his account -
so I'm gettin' it for free - just the right price! LOL

I do have another gem to post and will when it comes in - I've seen the 'daddy' of the game
but have never seen it's 'junior' version. Stay tuned!

I also have a question - how does everyone feel about cannibalizing games to make the best version?
I would guess a purist would want an entire game - intact - in good condition vs. picking up a few
and piecing them together.
I've picked up 3 Parker Bros. Peg Baseball - 1908 version - to - not only - get the best looking game
but add to missing pieces.

Also, I picked up a 2nd Big League Baseball Game - Selchow & Righter, 1940.

I posted the first one a while back and one of the spinners was broken; I inferred from Butch I could've gotten
a better version, if I had been patient - well this one came up with a cleaner board - the box is crimped -
the first game box is in better shape - plus the 2nd game - the pieces have never been played with!
To boot - I picked it up for 10 bucks.
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266597011

When I get the game - I'll see how it looks in the end.

There's another game which I've been working on to get the best of all worlds - when I'm donewith it -
I'm gonna post it.
Thanx guys - a pleasure - as always.
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hi Mike, welcome back to the Forum and thanks very much for your message!...
> There are actually three confirmed variations of your game, and a reported but unverified fourth....
> ...
> ...
> In any case, Mike, congratulations on a terrific acquisition! We've seen only five of these hit the auction market
> over the last ten years, so that 125-year-old cutie is quite an enviable prize. If you don't mind, we'll add a couple
> of your pics to the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album of our Photos section. Now get to work on that website!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5826 Sun Feb 21, 2010 9:19 pm
"Lionheart®" <za7002az(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA boards

Mike,
Oh, now I understand. My old ©1986 board still had them (I now recall seeing them on older boards).
My newer board ©1995 doesn't. Board is "Bases Empty" with "Runner on First" on the other side, etc.

My original answer was meant to say that on #1-11, the description on the old boards was simple:
#2 - Triple. On the newer boards that description for the triple changes under each of the four pitcher's ratings.
As a matter of fact all the descriptions sound like what you'd hear from a radio announcer.
Gary

--- "Mike Lamone" wrote:
> I was asking about the large white boards. I have seen them without letters and letters
> on the bottom right hand corner.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5827 Mon Feb 22, 2010 11:43 am
"tshieber" <tshieber(at)baseballhalloffame.org>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

Regarding the "New Base Ball Game":

I featured Mark Cooper's version of the game (advertising Chas. S. Childs, a boot and shoe dealer in Holyoke, MA)
in our "Home Games" exhibit here at the Hall of Fame. If I am not mistaken, an identical version (advertising Childs)
is in the Hall of Fame's permanent collection.

I believe the Durgin & Palmer reference comes from the copy of the game shown in the Congdon-Martin and
Kashmanian book "Baseball Treasures." I am unfamiliar with a Clark & Martin version.

For what it's worth, I found an advertisement in the "Boston Globe" of August 29, 1887 in the classified section
under "Agents, Partners, etc." that reads:

A SMART MAN in every State in the U.S. to sell Durgin's new parlor game of Base Ball,
also Durgin's parlor base advertising scheme, the best advertisement ever shown;
entirely new, sells for $30 thousand, good men can make big pay, samples and full particulars
on recipt of 23 cts. H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, Mass

Hope that helps.
- Tom Shieber

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hi Mike, welcome back to the Forum and thanks very much for your message!...
> There are actually three confirmed variations of your game, and a reported but unverified fourth....
> ...
> In any case, Mike, congratulations on a terrific acquisition! We've seen only five of these hit the auction market
> over the last ten years, so that 125-year-old cutie is quite an enviable prize.
> ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5828 Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:15 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Cannibalizing games and combining parts

Mike raised an intriguing question -- in his last post about the Durgin game -- and we thought it deserved
separate discussion, so we're starting a new thread here, and we hope the collectors of vintage games
will chime in on this one.

We've given this idea some occasional thought in the past, here in the front office, and oddly we're all
rather ambivalent on the topic. We don't think it matters much for more recent games that are plentiful
and easily affordable in the second-hand market -- we doubt anyone's going to care or could even possibly
notice if, say, the audio cassette from an example of *Head-On Baseball* with a crushed box is placed in
a nice box from the same game that was missing the audiotape.

It seems more of an issue when it comes to rare antique games, like the Durgin games or something, say,
by McLoughlin. Obviously you wouldn't want to mix the cover from a "Hadley" Durgin with the box bottom /
gameboard from a "C W Smith" Durgin -- because just for starters the advertising text wouldn't match --
but would it matter if two Hadley versions, one with a nice lid but a gameboard in poor shape, the other
with a cherry gameboard but a rough lid, were mixed and matched to produce one excellent example and
one miserable one? It kinda "feels" wrong, but at the moment we're at a bit of a loss to articulate why.

Gentlemen? Thoughts?

Butch, Kerm, & Win
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< ... I also have a question - how does everyone feel about cannibalizing games to make the best version?
I would guess a purist would want an entire game - intact - in good condition vs. picking up a few and
piecing them together. I've picked up 3 Parker Bros. Peg Baseball - 1908 version - to - not only - get the
best looking game but add to missing pieces....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5829 Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:38 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

Hiya Tom, thanks very much for your comments and information!
As ever, your research is astounding and invaluable.

That the Durgin on display in the tremendous "Home Games" exhibition was a "Childs" version somehow went
overlooked in two visits. (We'd really appreciate a photo of that variation from either you or Mark as soon as
it's convenient for either of you.) In any case, there we have it, a confirmed fourth edition, with a fifth (or more)
still possible. We'll also have to locate the *Baseball Treasures* book and see just what it is they show in there.

Big thanks as well for discovering and transcribing the *Boston Globe* advert. It's worth plenty and you bet
it helps (aww, you knew that), and all but confirms our theory that the game originated with Durgin and was
then marketed to related businesses.

Butch, Kerm, & Win
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "tshieber" wrote:
<< Regarding the "New Base Ball Game":
I featured Mark Cooper's version of the game (advertising Chas. S. Childs, a boot and shoe dealer in Holyoke, MA)
in our "Home Games" exhibit here at the Hall of Fame. If I am not mistaken, an identical version (advertising
Childs) is in the Hall of Fame's permanent collection.
I believe the Durgin & Palmer reference comes from the copy of the game shown in the Congdon-Martin and
Kashmanian book "Baseball Treasures." I am unfamiliar with a Clark & Martin version.
For what it's worth, I found an advertisement in the "Boston Globe" of August 29, 1887 in the classified section
under "Agents, Partners, etc." ...
...
Hope that helps.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5830 Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:48 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Baseball Researcher

Hiya fellers! A post over at Net54 lured us just a few days ago to a website we hadn't previously known of, and
a wonderful thing it is -- Baseball Hall of Fame Senior Curator Tom Shieber's own blog, "Baseball Researcher."
(We're guessing the comments we left there may have been what lured Tom back here to chime in on the Durgin
thread.) Anyway, we can't recommend it to you highly enough -- brilliantly researched and excellently written,
both educational and entertaining, as you'd expect, a real showcase for Tom's superb sleuthing.
Here's the address: http://baseballresearcher.blogspot.com/

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5831 Mon Feb 22, 2010 8:50 pm
"Mark Cooper" <markwcooper(at)comcast.net>
Re: Cannibalizing games and combining parts

Guys
I have had many opportunities in the past 30 years to mix and match many game tops
which were in excellent condition with "crummy " bottoms etc,etc

As BKW mentioned,it kind of felt wrong,I also agree,it is like taking Steroids,just not what the game is all about.

It is as bad as slabbing baseball game cards

As an aside,with the illicit market for fake and counterfeit baseball memorabilia,I always felt secure
in not having to worry about a bogus 1888 Mcloughlin game..

Unfortunately,the memorabilia/card market will be undergoing their own Watergate,tainting the
entire hobby"business"!!!

My 2 cents
Mark Cooper

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Mike raised an intriguing question -- in his last post about the Durgin game -- ... and we hope the collectors
> of vintage games will chime in on this one.
> We've given this idea some occasional thought in the past, here in the front office, and oddly we're all rather
> ambivalent on the topic. We don't think it matters much for more recent games that are plentiful and easily
> affordable in the second-hand market.... It seems more of an issue when it comes to rare antique games,
> like the Durgin games or something, say, by McLoughlin. It kinda "feels" wrong, but at the moment
> we're at a bit of a loss to articulate why. Gentlemen? Thoughts?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5832 Mon Feb 22, 2010 9:20 pm
"Tom Stillman" <giantsfan_94121(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: Cannibalizing games and combining parts

As an only child, I was never very good at sharing
8-)
So I always kept my games (baseball and otherwise) in pristine condition.
So mixing up parts of different games seems wrong to me.

Mark Cooper mentioned something that I'd like to add to as an aside. I don't know how I feel about slabbed cards,
coins, or stamps. Granted they bring a premium if you try to sell them AND you can see both sides of the item.
What I never got is the idea of a slabbed comic book! What the heck. If it's slabbed I can't read it
so why would I care what condition it is. O.K. I'm done with my digressions (and revealing way too much
about my collecting interests LOL)

Tom Stillman

--- "Mark Cooper" wrote:
> ... I have had many opportunities in the past 30 years to mix and match many game tops which were
> in excellent condition with "crummy " bottoms etc,etc As BKW mentioned,it kind of felt wrong,I also agree,
> it is like taking Steroids,just not what the game is all about. It is as bad as slabbing baseball game cards....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5833 Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:38 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Base Ball Game - H.H. Durgin, Pittsfield, 1885.

I also want to thank Tom for that information - it's kind of what I deduced - based on the copyright thing
and the fact that mine is a Durgin game - as such.

I was also interested in the Baseball Treasures book - I wanna say I've seen it but won't know fer sure until I see it.
Thanx!
mike

--- "tshieber" wrote:
> Regarding the "New Base Ball Game":
> I featured Mark Cooper's version of the game (advertising Chas. S. Childs, a boot and shoe dealer in Holyoke, MA)
> in our "Home Games" exhibit here at the Hall of Fame....
> I believe the Durgin & Palmer reference comes from the copy of the game shown in... "Baseball Treasures."
> I am unfamiliar with a Clark & Martin version....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5834 Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:53 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Cannibalizing games and combining parts

I had a feeling that a purist view of this would go in that direction.

I'm not sure how I feel totally. As a card collector - we know restoration is death.
While movie poster collector have no problem with it being restored.

On the slabbing - it's the easiest way to get some assurance in this climate - tho I don't love them -
I like my cards in binders.

You guys have given me something to think about - since I haven't done anything that's etched in stone at this point.

With the current sale of the Action Comic #1 for a cool mil - which has been graded/encapsulated -
I had brought up the topic years ago about it being entombed - never to be read until cracked out.

Tho - I will say - a precious item like that - made from rather poor quality paper should be handled as little
as possible. I was thinking how it would be fun to have it as a "well marked" reprint for fun and reference.

Thanx for all the input guys.

--- "Tom Stillman" wrote:
> As an only child, I was never very good at sharing 8-)
> So I always kept my games (baseball and otherwise) in pristine condition. So mixing up parts of different games
> seems wrong to me. Mark Cooper mentioned something that I'd like to add to as an aside. I don't know how I feel
> about slabbed cards, coins, or stamps.... What I never got is the idea of a slabbed comic book! What the heck.
> If it's slabbed I can't read it so why would I care what condition it is....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5835 Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:43 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Baseball Researcher

Thanx for the link Butch!
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya fellers! A post over at Net54 lured us just a few days ago to a website we hadn't previously known of, and
> a wonderful thing it is -- Baseball Hall of Fame Senior Curator Tom Shieber's own blog, "Baseball Researcher"...
> we can't recommend it to you highly enough -- Here's the address: http://baseballresearcher.blogspot.com/
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5836 Tue Feb 23, 2010 12:47 pm
"markwcooper(at)comcast.net"
Re: re: Cannibalizing games and combining parts

Guys
Not attempting to get on a tangent but I remember "in the old days" pre slabbing (1970 -1990's) when acquring cards
took some skill in discerning what was a 7 vs a 9. However,the slab industry has taken away any skill /knowledge
from the hobby,and has instead created a milieu of "mine is bigger than yours"!!. It has become an unfortunate
battle to acquire the best and highest graded set in the "official registry".

I feel sorry for the card collectors who base their collection on these grading company reports ,
and leave it to their jaundiced eyes to ascertain the value,like reading the Wall Street Journal.

I never believed that the card collectors would defer to the so called grading experts who seem to have
their share of mistakes. In fact, another "watergate" with the grading companies appears to be in the winds
with trimmed ,skinned, and doctored cards.

STICK WITH BOARD GAMES FOR AUTHENTICITY
My 2 Cents
Mark Cooper

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
> I had a feeling that a purist view of this would go in that direction. I'm not sure how I feel totally.
> As a card collector - we know restoration is death. While movie poster collector have no problem with it
> being restored. On the slabbing - it's the easiest way to get some assurance in this climate - tho I don't
> love them - I like my cards in binders....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5837 Tue Feb 23, 2010 3:36 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
OT: Graded cards (was: Re: Cannibalizing games and combining parts)

Hi Mark
I can't argue with your position and reasoning as it pertains to personal collecting - the fun of selecting
ones own cards based on his or her discrimating taste.

I remember when the grading stuff kicked off with early companies like Superlative and perhaps the true originator
in Accucard/Accugrade aka ASA - a brainchild of Alan Hager - who IMO became totally part of the problem
by grading and selling his own material! To his credit - the arrowhead holder and a 10pt grading system.

On the meritorious side - TPG's helped to weed out fakes and doctored cards - all of which
the saavy experienced collector will learn to discern with exemplars, black light, 10X loupe etc.

So, let's just say, necessity (the need to help the junior collector)was the mother (Alan Hager)
of invention (ASA e.g.).

With others like SGC (100pt system) who failed at first, and PSA - probably the company that truely created
the "big bang" - the cat was out of the bag. With a clever promo/ad campaign and the grading of the notorious
PSA 8 Wagner (trimmed or not trimmed?) the whole thing took off - spawning many other companies too numerous
to mention other than the low of lows like Gem and Pro Grading - who - for a price - will grade just about anything
and entomb it into a plastic coffin.

And finally - as you pointed - the ultimate insult to the hobby reared it's ugly head - the PSA Registry - where else
but in America can the quest to be NUMBER ONE result in a grown man with normal intelligence paying 3 or 4 grand
for a PSA 8 (Population 1 or 2) card that one can pick up at a show for maybe a buck - i.e., before the rush to find
these gems and get them off to PSA in hopes of adding to the fray - for a nice profit. And, one of the problems?
Mr Average Guy who paid 4K for the pop 1 card, becomes terribly dissappointed and disenchanted, when within a
year or two the pop 1 explodes to say - a population of 100 cards and he sees his card now worth - 30 or 40 bucks?
Now he's demoralized - dumps his set and quits the hobby and moves on to beanie babies!

So, what had good intention, but on final approach - may have crash landed and created a monster that just won't
die. And if it does? I'll still have my games and cards in binders. Now, I do have some graded sets - but very,
very small compared to raw.

Sorry for the length - back to you.
mike

--- "markwcooper" wrote:
> ... Not attempting to get on a tangent but I remember "in the old days" pre slabbing (1970 -1990's) when
> acquring cards took some skill in discerning what was a 7 vs a 9. However,the slab industry has taken away
> any skill/knowledge from the hobby,and has instead created a milieu of "mine is bigger than yours"!!.
> It has become an unfortunate battle to acquire the best and highest graded set in the "official registry"....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5838 Tue Feb 23, 2010 4:09 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Fan Craze 1904 small version - no name player cards

I picked this up from the same seller as the H.H.Durgin game.

I was familiar with the Fan Craze game with the player cards of popular gamers from that era -
it's very popular with card collectors and some go for some righteous bucks!

This one appears to be a travel version in that the game is 6 1/14 X 6 1/14" in size.
It's played with a deck of cards (2 1/2 X 3 1/2").

Here's the cover - Fan Craze, Cinn., Ohio - 50 cents: unfortunately it's missing one of the sides.
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266958691

The board is solid wood - about 6 X 6" and 3/8" thick - it's in truly nice condition:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266958720

When you place a player on first, e.g. - a set of small nails were included.

The rules manual is very fragile but looks good and has to be handled carefully:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266958850

note the copyright of 1904.

I included a few of the playing cards and the style of the backs - including the cover card:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266958954

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1266959000

I'm looking forward to playing this gem with my son - if I can break him away from his
50 gig 5000 watt whatever he plays at his house!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5839 Wed Feb 24, 2010 8:19 am
"markwcooper(at)comcast.net"
OT: Re:tulips and slabbed cards (was:Re: OT: graded cards)

BBG
I guess you never know you are in an asset bubble till it bursts.
We all can recall the internet,credit, and real estate bubbles.

With the infinite supply of baseball cards, you name the series . Whether it is Old Judge or T206 or Goudeys , the
holy grail of slabbing with the next shoe to drop(expose of shill bidding ,grading scams,bogus population reports),
the manipulated inflated prices of all these cards will eventually be added to the list of tulips in Holland in 1637.

Enjoy them while you can,just do not be the last guy out the door !!!!
my 2 cents
Mark Cooper

---- "mikestone193" wrote:
> ... I can't argue with your position and reasoning as it pertains to personal collecting - the fun of selecting
> ones own cards based on his or her discrimating taste. I remember when the grading stuff kicked off with
> early companies.... what had good intention, but on final approach - may have crash landed and created
> a monster that just won't die. And if it does? I'll still have my games and cards in binders....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5840 Wed Feb 24, 2010 10:50 am
"Beckner, Derrick" <dgb100(at)psu.edu> pokingwithstick
Re: OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards (was: Re: OT: graded cards)

I was out the door in 1993. I used to love collecting cards but it became such a money grubbing racket
I was totally turned off.

Back when I was a kid you could deal with the local vendor or flea market guy, take in your doubles and
trade cards or make a little cash. They'd usually trade at 50% book and give you 25-50% cash depending on
how in demand a card was. Of course you couldn't unload scrubs for much if anything, if anything.
In the early 90s all dealers wanted were chase cards and pre-rookie cards of 15 year kids who would
never amount to anything, and if they did deal with you you'd be lucky to get 10% book, usually closer to 5%.
And that was of course the low Beckett value.

Just goes to show that a couple jack-holes can ruin just about anyone's fun given the opportunity
to make easy money.

The grading services are just the stake in skeleton that used to be card collecting.
Who the hell is going to pay $10 to $50 to have a stinkin piece of cardboard "graded"?

Anyway, rant off. o

--- "markwcooper" wrote:
> ... I guess you never know you are in an asset bubble till it bursts. We all can recall the internet,credit, and
> real estate bubbles. With the infinite supply of baseball cards, you name the series.... the manipulated inflated
> prices of all these cards will eventually be added to the list of tulips in Holland in 1637....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5841 Wed Feb 24, 2010 6:29 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards (was: Re: OT: graded cards)

Mark
I don't quite understand this post?
It's connected to my response that I agree with you that TPGs may have caused more bad than good.
Who or what is BBG? And with the closing remark about "being last out the door" - who are you talking to?
mike

--- "markwcooper" wrote:
> BBG
> I guess you never know you are in an asset bubble till it bursts. We all can recall the internet,credit, and
> real estate bubbles. With the infinite supply of baseball cards, you name the series... the manipulated inflated
> prices of all these cards will eventually be added to the list of tulips in Holland in 1637.
> Enjoy them while you can,just do not be the last guy out the door !!!!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5842 Wed Feb 24, 2010 11:07 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards (was: Re: OT: graded cards)

Hi Mike -- and Mark, and Derrick --
Mike, we're pretty sure "BBG" = Baseball Games, by which we infer Mark was responding to your post but
directing his comments to the entire group. Likewise his closing remark, which we took as a general advisory
to cardies at large.

In any case, though, interesting and perhaps even entertaining as this thread has been so far, the subject of grading
and slabbing cards really is a ways off-topic for this Forum. We hate to play school-marms, but if anybody wants to
pursue this discussion, we'd appreciate it if you'd instead take it up in the "back room" --
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baseballsims/

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< I don't quite understand this post? It's connected to my response that I agree with you that TPGs may have
caused more bad than good. Who or what is BBG? And ... "being last out the door" - who are you talking to?
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5843 Wed Feb 24, 2010 11:13 pm
"Tom Stillman" <giantsfan_94121(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards

I subscribe to a stamp auction catalog and they have coins as well as cards and autographs in addition to the stamps.
Invariably each auction has about a dozen lots of several thousand cards (20,000+) each that are "1980s to 1990s
mostly common." I think, "Yeah, you got suckered in and now you might get 100 bucks for the whole bunch."
Tom Stillman

--- "Beckner, Derrick" wrote:
> I was out the door in 1993. I used to love collecting cards but it became such a money grubbing racket
> I was totally turned off.... The grading services are just the stake in skeleton that used to be card collecting.
> Who the hell is going to pay $10 to $50 to have a stinkin piece of cardboard "graded"? Anyway, rant off. o
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5844 Wed Feb 24, 2010 11:36 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Fan Craze 1904 small version - no name player cards

Hey there Mike, another excellent acquisition -- thanks for the Show 'n Tell! It may be 106 years old and
missing an apron from the lid, but judging by your photos of it, your example looks like it was just pulled
fresh off the store shelf!

The "generic" (no player photos) edition of *Fan Craze* was actually produced in *two* sizes -- the 6 x 6" box
and board you have there, and also an otherwise identical 6 x 4" version. There's no reason to question the 1904
copyright on those means they were released in 1904, but in case anyone hasn't heard, it's now been established
that the "Art Series" editions (those with the Carl Horner player portraits) are actually from 1906.

The little bits of strategic advice and vaguely moral instruction on some of the cards in the generic set
add hugely to its charm, or such is the feeling here anyway.

Your mention of individual cards from the two "Art Series" sets selling for big prices now leads *us* off onto a
bit of a tangent, but one we think more germane to the Forum's focus: the breaking up of baseball card games
-- *Fan Craze,* *Great-Mails Baseball Game* (1924), *The National Game* (1936), and several others -- into
individual cards. We'll be up front about our feeling on the subject: sacrilege! Absolutely horrendous, and
entirely beyond our understanding. Anyone care to agree or disagree?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< I picked this up from the same seller as the H.H.Durgin game. I was familiar with the Fan Craze game
with the player cards of popular gamers from that era - it's very popular with card collectors and some go for
some righteous bucks! This one appears to be a travel version in that the game is 6 1/14 X 6 1/14" in size.
It's played with a deck of cards (2 1/2 X 3 1/2").... unfortunately it's missing one of the sides.
http://snipurl.com/ui7mc ...
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5845 Wed Feb 24, 2010 11:26 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards

I agree Butch.
BBG - in text messaging means "best be going" - so that's why I was confused.
To be honest, I would've rather that the topic of TPG's not be linked to my thread to eliminate any confusion.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... we're pretty sure "BBG" = Baseball Games ... In any case, though, interesting and perhaps even entertaining
> as this thread has been so far, the subject of grading and slabbing cards really is a ways off-topic for this Forum.
> We hate to play school-marms, but if anybody wants to pursue this discussion, we'd appreciate it
> if you'd instead take it up in the "back room" -- http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baseballsims/
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5846 Thu Feb 25, 2010 12:03 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Fan Craze 1904 small version - no name player cards

Thanx for the response Butch! I think it's a great addition to my collection.

On the breaking up of a game - when I posted on the pickup of my 1913 Lajoie game, I think
the seller was concerned about what I would do with it. It's still and will remain intact.

If I were ever lucky enough to pick up the "player" version of Fan Craze, it would stay totally together -
that's the charm. However, the fact that the cards sell for so much, the odds of me finding and being able
to afford the game is probably doubtful.

Perhaps, in a way - by reverse thinking - I've answered - my question about cannibalizing -
leave something the way it is.
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey there Mike, another excellent acquisition -- thanks for the Show 'n Tell! ...
> The "generic" (no player photos) edition of *Fan Craze* was actually produced in *two* sizes -- the 6 x 6" box
> and board you have there, and also an otherwise identical 6 x 4" version.... Your mention of individual cards
> from the two "Art Series" sets selling for big prices now leads *us* off onto a bit of a tangent, but one we think
> more germane to the Forum's focus: the breaking up of baseball card games... into individual cards. We'll be
> up front about our feeling on the subject: sacrilege! Absolutely horrendous....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5847 Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:19 pm
"chrisharrison355" <chrisharrison355(at)yahoo.com>
Bring on the spring!

Hey guys, I haven't posted since I finished my 17th baseball league with the 2008 season using the
SBS computer game in October. Well, it's a bit early, but I don't care I am ready for baseball!
I think all the snow this winter has got me extra ready.

I have decided to try the Action PC baseball game this time and I picked the 1970 season. This is the first time
I have ever played a season that I did not actually watch unfold (I was two). I picked the Braves (had to use
Aaron for the first time), Giants (same thing with Mays), Pirates, Reds, Orioles, and Twins to battle it out
in a 40 game season

Anyone have thoughts on this season or these teams? I'm hoping this will be great fun and
be a doorway into playing the 60's & 50's pretty soon too.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5848 Fri Feb 26, 2010 2:46 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Pinch Hitter - pinball type game - 1938

I found this game listed in the reference book - Baseball Games, pg. 131.
Pinch Hitter - J & S Corp. was made in the late 30s - probably early 40s, I would guess.

I picked this one up on ebay - needs some repair and a pinball - I'll make an attempt - and if I can't get it working
- I'll take it - hopefully - to a shop that sells/services pinball machines. I'll report back on that one!

Here's the game: http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1267169351

I usually don't get that excited over bagatelle type games but this one had some really cool graphics.

I also have a marble type game - Roger Maris Baseball - 1962 - Pressman Toy Company -
that I initially was attracted to the box but found the game to be fun!

I do have a couple of baseball gumball machines - one is Play Baseball on pg 147 of BB games,
the other's not listed.

Ya gotta love this stuff!
Thanx for viewing
mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5849 Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:32 pm
"newfan72" <newfan72(at)yahoo.com>
Re: program IV request for help

I used to play program iv bb.
i thought it was a cool game. very basic and kinda flawed in the ranges in re to rating your players.
but, i was 12 y/o. didnt think anybody remembered program iv games out of illinois.

--- "Rick Teverbaugh" wrote:
> Is there anyone out there who plays Program IV Baseball who also knows Excel and might help me
> with a project?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5850 Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:27 pm
"newfan72" <newfan72(at)yahoo.com>
OT: Re:tulips and slabbed cards

i am glad someone broached this subject re "slabbed". awhile back i went to a coin show and saw a slabbed
morgan dollar MS 60 grade or something. the coin looked liked it was more rusted than toned. bottom line is
-evaluate by eye appeal not a grade that someone stuck on because they might've known the coin grader.
COLLECT BECAUSE YOU ENJOY IT.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5851 Sat Feb 27, 2010 3:01 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
OT: Re: tulips and slabbed cards

Hi Eric, welcome to the group and thanks for your input! We're gonna let that be the last word on this topic in here,
though -- so fellers, as we suggested a day or three ago, if anybody wants to pursue this OT discussion, please
take it into the "back room" -- http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baseballsims/

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "newfan72" wrote:
<< i am glad someone broached this subject re "slabbed".... bottom line is-evaluate by eye appeal not a grade
that someone stuck on because they might've known the coin grader. COLLECT BECAUSE YOU ENJOY IT.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5853 Sat Feb 27, 2010 3:48 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Pinch Hitter - pinball type game - 1938

Hey there Mike, thanks for your comments! *Pinch Hitter* is indeed a visually appealing game, and
rather difficult to find in decent working condition. You're right about the date -- 1938 is the consensus
on that one. Best of luck with the repairs and restoration!

*Roger Maris' Action Baseball* can be found with the gameboard in like-new working shape as frequently
as it's found missing the bell mechanism, the balls, &c' -- but for some reason, the highly attractive box is
almost always a wreck. And the same is true for the other almost-identical versions of Pressman's game,
*Carl Yastrzemski Action Baseball,* *Tom Seaver Game Action Baseball,* and the several generic editions of
*Action Baseball.* We're not sure why that's so -- the boxes don't seem especially flimsy, and you'd think
even kids would've taken some care with the nifty sports-page-motif lids of the Maris, Yaz, and Seaver versions.

We've catalogued quite a number of obscure coin-ops, so give us a look at that unnamed gumball machine you've got
and either we can tell you something about it or you'll have given us something new to add to the database!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< I found this game listed in the reference book - Baseball Games, pg. 131.
Pinch Hitter - J & S Corp. was made in the late 30s - probably early 40s, I would guess.
I picked this one up on ebay - needs some repair and a pinball - I'll make an attempt - and if I can't get it working
- I'll take it - hopefully - to a shop that sells/services pinball machines. I'll report back on that one! ...
...I also have a marble type game - Roger Maris Baseball - 1962 - Pressman Toy Company - that I initially
was attracted to the box but found the game to be fun! I do have a couple of baseball gumball machines -
one is Play Baseball on pg 147 of BB games, the other's not listed....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5854 Sat Feb 27, 2010 5:03 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Yahoo forums/e-lists: new glitches

Hiya fellers! We're not sure how long it will take for this post to reach the Forum/e-list, because of the very nature
of the problem -- but Yahoo has done it again, with a fresh set of tech problems that are causing a huge lag between
the time a message is sent and the time it finally arrives here, and between the time a message is moderated and
approved by us for posting and the time it finally shows up in the Forum/e-list. This is randomly affecting groups
all across the Yahoo network, not just ours. All we can do is nag Yahoo for a tech fix and all you can do is be patient...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

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______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5857 Sat Feb 27, 2010 11:53 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Pinch Hitter - pinball type game - 1938

Thanx Butch
I don't use a camera - but my wife has one and it's time I got into the "20th" century
and learn how to download pics to my computer!

On the other one I have - I'll get on it - it's common - I picked up a restored one on ebay, have seen another
for sale - and coincidentally, a friend gave me one as a present! I didn't have the heart to tell him I already have it.
His is in really poor condition; would be a nice challenge to restore.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey there Mike, thanks for your comments! *Pinch Hitter* is indeed a visually appealing game, and rather
> difficult to find in decent working condition.... Best of luck with the repairs and restoration!
> ... We've catalogued quite a number of obscure coin-ops, so give us a look at that unnamed gumball machine
> ... either we can tell you something about it or you'll have given us something new to add to the database!
>
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