Archive - Yahoo forum posts, 2009 June

Eventually, all posts from the old Yahoo Baseball Games Forum, 2004-2013. Registered members may read, but posting here is by forum administrators/moderators only. Comments on posts here, however, are welcome in the main Baseball Games forum (above) or the Baseball Sims forum (below).

Archive - Yahoo forum posts, 2009 June

BaseballGamesBKW
Site Admin
Joined: October 25th, 2013, 6:10 am

June 1st, 2015, 5:38 am #1

BASEBALLGAMES FORUM 2009 June, Messages 5309 - 5364
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Message #5309
Wed Jun 3, 2009 3:27 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire and a trigger bat?
Hello Dale, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! "What's this game" questions are usually
our favorites, but you've really got us stumped on this one. Then again, it's been something of a whirlwind week
for us, away from the Forum here, so maybe we're just temporarily addled...

Unless -- we're picturing a ball travelling along a wire somehow mounted horizontally, parallel to the playing field
-- did you instead mean a ball *suspended* from a wire and "pitched" in a sort of pendulum fashion?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "patriotgames" wrote:
<< About mid-seventies there was a baseball game where the bat was trigger activated and had
a point at the bottom and it sat in a cup. The ball was launched by the pitcher and it would travel
on a wire towards the batter. Once hit the ball would either hit the thin plastic playing field for an out
or it would travel up and hit one of the markers on a tall pole that displayed HR, triple, single, etc.
The pitcher had control of the ball on the wire to make it dip or go high, etc. Does this ring a bell
with anyone? Many thanks...
>>
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To reply to a message or post a new message at Baseballgames,
visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/ on the web
and click on "Post" in the lefthand menu, or simply send your
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_______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5310 Wed Jun 3, 2009 8:42 pm
"yankfans_1961" <yankfans_1961(at)yahoo.com>
Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire and a trigger bat?

Sounds somewhat like Aurora's Skittle Baseball ...

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hello Dale, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! ... you've really got us stumped on this one.
> ... Unless -- we're picturing a ball travelling along a wire somehow mounted horizontally, parallel to the
> playing field -- did you instead mean a ball *suspended* from a wire and "pitched" in a sort of pendulum
> fashion?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5311 Wed Jun 3, 2009 10:30 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire and a trigger bat?
Hi Dave, yep, that's what we were hinting at in our "revised" interpretation of Dale's description.
When he wrote that "the ball... would travel on a wire towards the batter," we all pictured something like
a ball sliding along a horizontal wire between the mound and the plate, like a bead on an abacus, instead of
the pendulum motion in *Skittle.* Not to play semantics, but we'd call that more of a "string" than a "wire."
Or so we remember it, anyway, but then again, we can't recall what we had for dinner last night, either...

Hopefully Dale will be back soon to confirm or refute our suspicions...
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "yankfans_1961" wrote:
<< Sounds somewhat like Aurora's Skittle Baseball ...
>>
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Message #5312 Fri Jun 5, 2009 11:45 am
"chrisharrison355" <chrisharrison355(at)yahoo.com>
Looking for Pursue the Pennant and Clubhouse Baseball...
Hi guys. I'm looking for the Clubhouse Baseball game, either season 1989 or 1990, and Pursue the Pennant
with the same seasons. If anyone has them and would be willing to trade or sell them, let me know.

For trade I don't have much, as I usually sell my games after I have played them. I do have the new
Replay Basketball board game with the latest season pdf cards (celtics vs lakers finals, etc.).
I also have the 1981 season APBA baseball set, with the extra cards.

Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5313 Fri Jun 5, 2009 1:42 pm
"jacques chabot" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
Re: Looking for Pursue the Pennant and Clubhouse Baseball...
Hi Chris,
I no longer have Clubhouse but i think i might have the PTP...
just send me an email at chabot65(at)hotmail.com and i'll tell you.
Jacques

--- "chrisharrison355" wrote:
> Hi guys. I'm looking for the Clubhouse Baseball game, either season 1989 or 1990, and Pursue the Pennant
> with the same seasons. If anyone has them and would be willing to trade or sell them, let me know....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5314 Fri Jun 5, 2009 1:55 pm
"patriotgames" <patriotgames(at)ymail.com>
Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire and a trigger bat?
Hello! Was not the skittle baseball, there was an actual plastic unit beside the playmat that the wire
protruded from, about 1-2 feet long and the plastic ball was attached at the end of it. The unit allowed
the ball to dip when pitched and travel and hit a scoreboard when hit.
Thanks for all your effort, this was probably a rare one of a kind type of toy not made by a famous
manufacturer. Oh well, many thanks!
Dale
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Message #5315 Fri Jun 5, 2009 2:17 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire and a trigger bat?
Hey there Dale, thanks for the reply, but whoa! Don't give up on us yet! This hasn't been any effort at all
on our part so far -- we're still just trying to picture what you've been describing. And now we've got a *little*
better idea of it -- it's not a ball sliding along a horizontal wire or rod, it's not a ball swinging pendulum-like
at the end of a wire or string, it's -- correct us again if we still haven't got this right -- a ball stuck on the
end of a wire, or arm, that swings laterally, sort of like a turnstile. Right?
And actually, that sort of almost kinda rings a faint and distant bell with us... maybe someone else on board will
recognize that, but if not, we'll do a bit of digging tonight or this weekend and see what we can come up with.
"Rare games our specialty." Hang in there!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "patriotgames..." wrote:
<< Hello! Was not the skittle baseball, there was an actual plastic unit beside the playmat that the wire
protruded from, about 1-2 feet long and the plastic ball was attached at the end of it....
Thanks for all your effort, this was probably a rare one of a kind type of toy not made by a famous
manufacturer. Oh well, many thanks!
>>
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Message #5316 Sat Jun 6, 2009 5:24 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Baseballgames update, 6-05-09
Hiya fellers!
Like analog television broadcasting, spring is almost over and done, signalling that it's time once again for
that hallowed institution here, the monthly State of the Website Address. You'll notice that clean-up/paint-up/
fix-up season has not spared the front page of the Forum, where *Our National Ball Game,* McGill & Delany's
venerable 19th-century landmark effort, has been returned to the archives and replaced by *Wiry Dan's
Electric Baseball Game,* a 1950 product of Harett-Gilmar. We thought it was an appropriate choice as an
accompaniment to our recently-added feature on Jim Prentice and his long line of Electric Game Company
electric baseball games -- plus it's got a nice red-white-and-blue color scheme that should serve well for
Independence Day less than a month hence.

There's not too much to report this month, but before we get to what little there is, let's make sure to offer
the customary introductions and welcome to the newcomers who signed in with the group in May -- say hello
to sfclittle, bobcat2580, lc_calamese, cpropst1967, george_rousos, hotstovegames, crw4rams, dcarey3153,
mixmaster167, philarem, raymond17950, samsoniaw2, riqr, klinix2004, manosmith30, nafeesgame, testwtest,
seanr73, umd_dad09, greten401, suzannechrysler, and patriotgames. We're pleased to have you on board,
and we hope you'll enjoy your time here! If you haven't yet done so, please make sure you're familiar with
our Forum Policy [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/Forumpolicy.htm ],
then feel free to peruse the searchable Message archives, Files, Links, and Photo galleries here, as well as
the features at our main website [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/ ] --
hang around, introduce yourselves, let us know how you found us, and don't hesitate to chime in with any
questions, comments, or news that you might have.

Seriously -- don't hesitate! It's been weirdly slow and quiet in the Forum so far this year and we'd really like
to see a little more activity. You'd think a thousand members would generate a little more traffic than this!
Something we can do for you guys that we're not doing? Let us know. In case anyone missed it, May saw
a long-overdue auction report from Win, a detailed rave review of *MVP Baseball* by Rick Teverbaugh, and
discussion of a couple of rarities -- the 1915 *Akins Real Base Ball* and the 1947 Plachta *National Pastime.*
And not that anyone but us here in the front office cares, but our International League Bisons went 12-16
on the month, which is actually remarkable good news considering they won all but 17 of their 19 games
in April.

One thing we did do in May was put up that big photo-essay on the Jim Prentice games, as alluded to above,
and along with that, we did a subtle bit of reconfiguring the navigation at the main site. Saves us a lot of
trouble adding and adjusting links every time we add a feature to the site -- and there will be more to come
in the months ahead -- and it shouldn't require more than one additional click, if any, for any of you who visit
there.

Finally, we'll again remind you all of our standing invitation to ya for any sort of Show 'n Tell presentation
you'd like to make -- if you've recently acquired some interesting vintage tabletop baseball game you'd like to
show off and talk about, or if you'd care to parade a few unusual favorites from your games collection, then
please, by all means, be our guest -- you can post pics in the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album in our Photos section.
We remain hopeful, too, that someone can help us polish off the remaining enigmas in the "Mystery Games"
folder of our Photos section -- if you care to look in over there, know that #s 3, 4, 6, 8, and 9 have been
solved, but we're still looking for additional info on #s 1 and 2, and #s 5 and 7 still elude identification.
Help out, if you can.

Don't sit around with your hands in your pockets now -- let's see some hustle out there!
Keep up the chatter, boys!
Butch, Kerm, & Win
Baseball Games
http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
_______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message at Baseballgames,
visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/ on the web
and click on "Post" in the lefthand menu, or simply send your
e-mail to baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
_______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5317 Sat Jun 6, 2009 11:33 pm
"Larry" <swimlarry(at)yahoo.com>
National Pastime Game Board Received
Just want to Thank All of you, especially Butch and Mark Cooper, who helped me in my search for the
baseball board game titled National Pastime--1947. Mark shipped the game board to me and I received it
yesterday. Brought back so many great memories that I was lost dreaming about those days for a while.

I know many, if not all of you, have a favorite game that is probably NOT National Pastime. However, IMO,
that is only because you never had the opportunity to play NP when you were a kid. It is very realistic and
those who played the game were encouraged to determine the statistics of each player after every game
by the instructions. I believe that was one of the reasons I aced Statistics/Probability in college.

I can make up the cards that went with the game as well as the numbers that Mark did not have.
However, if anyone does come across the game with the cards and numbers, please let me know.

Again I thank ALL of you who helped me finally complete my search for this game (over 40 years).
My Best to All,
Larry
Swimlarry(at)aol.com
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Message #5318 Sun Jun 7, 2009 7:46 am
"Bill Staffa" <daedalus67(at)verizon.net> czarskeeter
Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Larry -
Are you referring to the NATIONAL PASTIME game that was patented by Clifford Van Beek in 1926 and issued
with the 1930 season? Was the forerunner of APBA. If so, I can help you with facsimiles of the original card set.

Contact me via eMail on the DAEDALUS67 above.
Bill

--- "Larry" wrote:
> Just want to Thank All of you, especially Butch and Mark Cooper, who helped me in my search for the
> baseball board game titled National Pastime--1947. Mark shipped the game board to me and I received it
> yesterday. Brought back so many great memories that I was lost dreaming about those days for a while....
> I can make up the cards that went with the game as well as the numbers that Mark did not have.
> However, if anyone does come across the game with the cards and numbers, please let me know....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5319 Sun Jun 7, 2009 2:32 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Hey there Larry, you're certainly very welcome! It's gratifying to us here in the front office to know we were
able to help someone identify and locate a long-lost treasure, and we're sure it was gratifying to Mark as well
to be able to put that rarity in your hands. Good luck finding the original cards and scoreboard chips, although
as you noted those can easily be recreated. The indispensible playing board was the tough part!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Larry" wrote:
<< Just want to Thank All of you, especially Butch and Mark Cooper, who helped me in my search for the
baseball board game titled National Pastime--1947. Mark shipped the game board to me and I received it
yesterday. Brought back so many great memories that I was lost dreaming about those days for a while....
... Again I thank ALL of you who helped me finally complete my search for this game (over 40 years)....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5320 Sun Jun 7, 2009 2:43 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Hiya Bill, thanks very much for that very gracious offer -- but no, Larry's game, also titled *National Pastime,*
is a 1947 rarity by Robert L Plachta, not Van Beek's landmark Major Games product. If you're interested,
you can follow the whole discussion/search in the Message archives -- start with Message 5238 from April 22nd,
then scroll halfway down that page to find the rest of the conversation. There's a pic of the game in the
"Viewer Mail" folder of our Photos section. Thanks again!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Bill Staffa" wrote:
<< Larry - Are you referring to the NATIONAL PASTIME game that was patented by Clifford Van Beek in 1926
and issued with the 1930 season? Was the forerunner of APBA. If so, I can help you with facsimiles of the
original card set....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5321 Sun Jun 7, 2009 2:46 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
hey u guys:
now that i think about it, the national pastime is the previous generation of APBA baseball. i had not heard of it
b4 visiting the barry halper room in the baseball hall of fame last fall. the similarity 2 me 1980 APBA was what
caught me i. only the pitcher rankings or defense differences were missing. i m pretty sure i know where
a gameboard is then! u might need 2 bring some tools, though. ne1 know if those games r on still on display?
lyle13

--- "swimlarry" wrote:
> Just want to Thank All of you, especially Butch and Mark Cooper, who helped me in my search for the
> baseball board game titled National Pastime--1947. Mark shipped the game board to me and I received it
> yesterday. Brought back so many great memories that I was lost dreaming about those days for a while....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5322 Sun Jun 7, 2009 4:14 pm
"Bill Staffa" <daedalus67(at)verizon.net> czarskeeter
Re: Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Okay. I never realized there was another National Pastime Game. I'll read up on it.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5323 Sun Jun 7, 2009 6:50 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Hi Curt -- ehhhh -- ambitious idea you have there, but we really can't endorse breaking into the Hall of Fame!
Anyway, that marvellous exhibit of Mark's games is, as far as we know, no longer on display there.

There is an indepently-reissued edition of Clifford Van Beek's original *National Pastime* occasionally available
on eBay. The re-release was produced in 2003 by Sports Game Publishing and usually sells for around $20.-$25.

By the way, just for anyone who just stumbled into this thread midway through, *National Pastime,* the 1947
game by Robert L Plachta, has no relationship to *National Pastime,* the 1931 game by Clifford Van Beek and
Major Games.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "curt young" wrote:
<< hey u guys: now that i think about it, the national pastime is the previous generation of APBA baseball.
i had not heard of it b4 visiting the barry halper room in the baseball hall of fame last fall. the similarity 2 me
1980 APBA was what caught me i.... i m pretty sure i know where a gameboard is then! u might need 2 bring
some tools, though. ne1 know if those games r on still on display?
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5324 Sun Jun 7, 2009 7:10 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: National Pastime Game Board Received
Thanks again, Bill -- yeah, not only is there the 1931 Major Games *National Pastime,* the 2003 Sports Game
Publishing *National Pastime* re-issue, and the 1947 Robert L Plachta *National Pastime,* there's also a 1946
*National Pastime* by America's House of Toys and Games... not to mention a circa-1982 indy obscurity called
*The National Pastime,* designed, so we've read, by an Allan Calhamer. Sounds like something with which
only Dan Nichols might be familiar.

Keeping all those completely different games straight while dozens of them go by *Baseball,* *Baseball Game,*
*Big League Baseball,* *Home Baseball Game,* *Major League Baseball,* *Parlor Base Ball Game,* *Batter Up,*
and so on and so on is what keeps us here in the front office perpetually dizzy...
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Bill Staffa" wrote:
<< Okay. I never realized there was another National Pastime Game. I'll read up on it.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5325 Mon Jun 8, 2009 12:19 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Att'n Dale! Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire...
Dale, you still with us? We're pretty sure we've ID'd your game. Try this on for size:
*Battsy Baseball* by Tomy, 1974. Ring any bells?
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "patriotgames@" wrote:
<< Hello! Was not the skittle baseball, there was an actual plastic unit beside the playmat that the wire
protruded from, about 1-2 feet long and the plastic ball was attached at the end of it....
Thanks for all your effort, this was probably a rare one of a kind type of toy not made by a famous
manufacturer. Oh well, many thanks!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5326 Tue Jun 9, 2009 11:49 pm
"patriotgames..." <patriotgames(at)ymail.com>
Re: Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire...
That was it!!!!!
You all are the best!!!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5327 Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:57 pm
"tshieber" <tshieber(at)baseballhalloffame.org>
Shinyakyu Sugoroku (New Baseball Game)
Folks -
Anyone know anything about the game for sale at this web site:
http://www.antiqbook.com/boox/ney/8159.shtml .

The description reads:

BASEBALL. [in Japanese] Shinyakyu Sugoroku [New Baseball Game]. [c1935?].
Colour lithograph (520x760mm) folded into eight, with the original colour printed wrapper.
A couple of short tears around the edges but pretty good.
Very bright and cheerful; a kid's baseball game to be played with dice. There are 20 stages
from start to winning the pennant and in each the dice throws and instructions are clearly labelled
so I'm sure it's easy to play. The winning team has the character 'higashi' (east) on their shirts
but I'm not sure this has any great significance.

Thanks.
- Tom Shieber
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5328 Wed Jun 10, 2009 3:17 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Re: what is the name of this 70's game with baseball on a wire...
Har! You're far too kind with your praise, but thanks very much. We're glad we were able to help out.
One trivial footnote to our previous post: that might be a 1975 game, as opposed to 1974. By the way,
if you're looking to pick up that game on eBay, the bad news is that it doesn't show up very often --
we've seen only a handful over the last several years -- but the good news is that when it does show up,
it sells (or fails to sell) for garage-sale prices, even in very nice condition.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "patriotgames" wrote:
<< That was it!!!!! You all are the best!!!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5329 Wed Jun 10, 2009 3:31 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Shinyakyu Sugoroku (New Baseball Game)
Hiya Tom, thanks for the inquiry! We just shot you a note off-list including a photo of what we're absolutely
sure is not only the game, but the exact and very same example as the game for sale there, which sold for
about 34 bucks on eBay (to, as we recall, an Australian buyer) in January. Nice mark-up!
We've also just very belatedly passed that photo along to our expert in Asian languages for eventual translation
-- we're confident, too, that a little expertise in Japanese baseball history should help narrow down a date of
publication, since the cartoons seem to be caricatures of real-life star players.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "tshieber" wrote:
<< Folks - Anyone know anything about the game for sale at this web site:
http://www.antiqbook.com/boox/ney/8159.shtml .
The description reads:
"BASEBALL. [in Japanese] Shinyakyu Sugoroku [New Baseball Game]. [c1935?]. Colour lithograph
(520x760mm) folded into eight, with the original colour printed wrapper. A couple of short tears
around the edges but pretty good...."

Thanks.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5330 Thu Jun 11, 2009 12:35 pm
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
new member
Hi folks, I'm new to the list...and also new to baseball stats and games. Just wondering where would be
a good place for someone like me to get started.

I enjoy tracking things and keeping records, that's why I was drawn to this list after reading the SlashDot story
on the USA Today article about Strat-O-Matic and APBA. Is Strat a good place to start, or is there something
a little simpler (and free)?

Thanks,
Chris in San Antonio
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5331 Thu Jun 11, 2009 4:53 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: new member
Hello Chris, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! It's a good question, and a tough one --
there's no one game for everybody, but there is *some* game for everybody, if you catch our drift. And
you'd get almost as many different opinions and recommendations as there are members of this forum.

Thanks also for the mention of the two articles, which we hadn't been aware of -- the original *USA Today*
piece, by the way, is here: http://snipurl.com/jxi7w
and here: http://tinyurl.com/kvw8ng
-- and the SlashDot piece here: http://snipurl.com/jxik7
and here: http://tinyurl.com/noq7oq

Here in the front office, we could go on and on (and often do) about the delights and rewards of collecting
(and playing) antique and vintage games, but it seems clear you're looking for a "sim," not a "generic,"
currently in production. *Strat-O-Matic* has the largest following, and the somewhat simpler *APBA*
(no disrespect, *APBA* fans!) isn't too far behind. Although no longer in production by Cadaco, the oldest
(since 1941) successful sim, *Ethan Allen's All-Star Baseball,* is kept thriving by its many fans, whom you'll
find gathered here: http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cad ... eballGame/
Our friends at collegues at the "ASB" forum have developed loads of optional add-ons for that game
that can make it as sophisticated or leave it as simple as you like.

Other boardgame candidates for sim play would include *Dynasty League,* created in 1985 as *Pursue the
Pennant
,* and regarded by some as the most complex and sophisticated of them all -- there's a popular
computer version of that as well. *Big League Manager* (in production since 1956, and so, contrary to the
*USA Today* assertion, older than Strat) is available on eBay. There's the series of Sherco simulation games,
around since 1968, most recently as *SherCo's Grand Slam Baseball Game.* *Replay* is highly regarded
and has its own website. *Baseball Classics,* also with its own website, is relatively new and has gotten
good reviews. The *Statis Pro* games are no longer published by Avalon Hill, nor the *Superstar Baseball!*
games by Sports Illustrated, but as with "ASB," their legions of fans keep those games alive, turning
new cards out at various forums.

We've lost count of how many new sims have been offered in the past year or two, both as boardgames,
and as free computer downloads from several sports-game forums, but we're certain many of the members
on board here will be along momentarily to recommend any number of those too. Just remember, guys,
feel free to laud your game of choice, but let's not have any put-downs of anyone else's preferences...
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
<< Hi folks, I'm new to the list...and also new to baseball stats and games. Just wondering where would be
a good place for someone like me to get started. I enjoy tracking things and keeping records, that's why
I was drawn to this list after reading the SlashDot story on the USA Today article about Strat-O-Matic and
APBA. Is Strat a good place to start, or is there something a little simpler (and free)? Thanks...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5332 Thu Jun 11, 2009 5:07 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Shinyakyu Sugoroku (New Baseball Game)
A follow-up on this one, for anyone who's interested -- our always affable and invaluable pal Gene Newman
notes that the Japanese name of the game in question is *not* "Shinyakyu Sugoroku," as the sale/auction
in question has it, but rather *Puro Yakyu Taikai Sugoroku,* which translates as "Pro Baseball Tournament
Dice Game."

Gene also notes that the caricature of Victor Starffin, a star in Japanese baseball from 1936 through 1955,
identifies the game as circa 1948, since Starffin is shown wearing a Kinsei Stars uniform, and '48 was his
only season with that club. Amazing! Good eye, Gene -- thanks!
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "tshieber" wrote:
<< Folks - Anyone know anything about the game for sale at this web site:
http://www.antiqbook.com/boox/ney/8159.shtml .
The description reads:
"BASEBALL. [in Japanese] Shinyakyu Sugoroku [New Baseball Game]. [c1935?]. Colour lithograph
(520x760mm) folded into eight, with the original colour printed wrapper. A couple of short tears
around the edges but pretty good.... "
Thanks.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5333 Thu Jun 11, 2009 10:38 pm
"momike_99" <momike_99(at)yahoo.com>
Re: new member
If you want a great baseball site that is free check out retrosheet.com. Not only can you get boxscores
and some play-by-play of almost every game since the 1950's, they have tons of stats, records, individual
player bios, stadium info- everything you could ever want- it's baseball stat heaven, a great for you to get
place to get started, and user friendly, in my opinion. Good luck!

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> Hi folks, I'm new to the list...and also new to baseball stats and games. Just wondering where would be
> a good place for someone like me to get started.
> I enjoy tracking things and keeping records, that's why I was drawn to this list after reading the SlashDot
> story on the USA Today article about Strat-O-Matic and APBA....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5334 Fri Jun 12, 2009 7:30 am
"John" <Jgardiner(at)dial.pipex.com> john2412
Re: new member
Chris, my opinion it depends on whether you want computer or cards and dice but if you want a good
FREE computer baseball game take a look at http://www.sbs-baseball.com/
where you will find links to nearly every season and also a good game.

I persobally dont have time for cards and dice games and certainly not season replays like that
so can recommend STRAT, or PC Replay Baseball if you want a computer game that plays like a board game,
but both of these are paying games.
John
UK

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
> Hi folks, I'm new to the list...and also new to baseball stats and games. Just wondering where would be
> a good place for someone like me to get started.
> I enjoy tracking things and keeping records, that's why I was drawn to this list.... Thanks...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5335 Fri Jun 12, 2009 9:54 am
"Chris Hudson" <chrishudson(at)gmail.com> chud3_1967
Re: Re: new member
Thanks for your reply. So far I have downloaded SBS ( http://www.sbs-baseball.com/ ) and I really like it.
I am also thinking about trying to find an old copy of Si Baseball Strategy, because it is supposed to be
a good game to teach casual baseball fans like me the basics of underlying strategy.
Thanks,
Chris

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hello Chris, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! It's a good question, and a tough one --
> there's no one game for everybody, but there is *some* game for everybody, if you catch our drift. And
> you'd get almost as many different opinions and recommendations as there are members of this forum....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5336 Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:16 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Baseball stat sites (was: Re: new member)
Howdy Mike, thanks for the comment! Our thought was that Chris was looking mainly for recommendations
on a game, but if and when he needs a stat site to supplement and enhance his game-playing, RetroSheet
(and its affiliated RetroList forum) is an excellent suggestion, so thanks again.

We'd also direct him (or anyone looking for MLB stats) to [ http://www.baseballreference.com ].

Apologies for the delay in getting your message posted, Mike -- Yahoo ran another one of their "one-hour
system upgrades" yesterday that as usual turned into about twelve hours and made the forum temporarily
inacessible.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "momike_99" wrote:
<< If you want a great baseball site that is free check out retrosheet.com. Not only can you get boxscores
and some play-by-play of almost every game since the 1950's, they have tons of stats, records, individual
player bios, stadium info- everything you could ever want- it's baseball stat heaven, a great for you to get
place to get started, and user friendly, in my opinion. Good luck!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5337 Fri Jun 12, 2009 12:32 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Game recommendations (was: Re: new member)
Hi again Chris, and John, thanks too for your recommendations! Apologies again for the delay in getting
your messages posted -- Yahoo, well, hey it's free...

John makes an excellent point about anyone's preference for boardgames versus computer games, and
in the context of boardgames, a preference for dice, cards, or spinners or what-have-you. Most of us,
we'd guess, feel most comfortable with whichever game mechanic was in play in whichever game
we first got seriously involved in playing.

Chris, *Baseball Strategy* is one of the best "generic" games ever made, originally published in 1958
by Strategy Games, then beginning in 1962 by Avalon Hill, and then in the 1970s and '80s by AH and
Sports Illustrated. Various editions can be found on eBay at almost any given moment, and often very
cheaply, especially if condition isn't a big factor for you (seems like you're more interested in the play factor
than the collecting aspect).

Another relatively simple "MLB sim" we should have recommended earlier is Negamco's *Major League
Baseball
.* That's been around since about 1959, and both older original samples and newly produced games
are likewise for sale or auction on eBay, with a wide range of seasons (and players) available.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Chris Hudson" wrote:
<< Thanks for your reply. So far I have downloaded SBS ( http://www.sbs-baseball.com/ ) and I really like it.
I am also thinking about trying to find an old copy of Si Baseball Strategy, because it is supposed to be
a good game to teach casual baseball fans like me the basics of underlying strategy. Thanks...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5338 Sun Jun 14, 2009 7:04 pm
"Peggy Angstadt" <fivestonesofgospa(at)yahoo.com>
1910 Baseball game board
I have a game board made of wood, with metal attachments. I just cleaned it up for a wall display.
It has a label that reads:

THE MOREHOUSE MFG. CO.
Sole Makers
Columbus, Ohio USA

Baseball
WIZARD
Game
Patented
Nov 8th, 1910

We acquired this as part of a great-uncle's estate in the early 1980's. I'm wondering if anyone has
further information on this. I have found only two nominal references using an Internet search.

Thank you for any information.
Peg
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5339 Sun Jun 14, 2009 9:19 pm
"dax riner" <daxriner(at)gmail.com> daxlikeherod
PTP Cards
Greetings.
I am on the hunt for PTP cards for seasons 1988, 1989 and/or 1990.
If anyone has any leads, that would be cool.
Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5340 Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:27 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: PTP Cards
Hiya Dax, welcome to the forum and thanks for your inquiry! You might have some luck in your search
by watching eBay closely for relevant sales and auctions. In the meantime, there are plenty of PTP fans
among the membership here, so someone may be along shortly either to recommend additional baseball-sim
forums where you might be able to strike a deal, or to offer you a set of cards themselves.

Guys, if you've actually got cards for Dax, please contact him off-list, directly at his own e-mail address.
Thanks!
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "dax riner" wrote:
<< Greetings. I am on the hunt for PTP cards for seasons 1988, 1989 and/or 1990.
If anyone has any leads, that would be cool. Thanks!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5341 Mon Jun 15, 2009 12:09 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1910 Baseball game board
Hello there Peg, welcome to the group and thanks very much for your question! We can't vouch for its
playability, but it certainly does make for a sensational display piece. Lucky gal! Howcum when *we*
clear up an estate, all we find are old utility bills and back issues of *Reader's Digest*?
Anyway, for the many folks here who are likely unfamiliar with this very scarce number, *Wizard Base Ball
Game
* is a wooden action game with metal "trappers," and is a whopping 28 or 29 inches square with
really nice period typography.

Peg, since you're hands-on with the game, you probably already know as much about it as we do.
We can tell you that the Morehouse edition is almost identical to the *Blackstone Base Ball Board*
of the same era -- and virtually identical to the *Wizard Base Ball Game* manufactured by the
Crawford-Barrett Co of Chicago, which on some samples displays a "patent pending" notation and
on others displays the same patent date as your Morehouse edition. The tentative conclusion we draw
is that the Crawford-Barrett models, therefore, were produced before the Morehouse models, although
we're uncertain where the Blackstone version fits into that chronology (our guess is that the Blackstone
predated both the Crawford-Barrett and the Morehouse).
The AGPC variously estimates the Morehouse as a 1912 and a 1916 product, and (at least so far)
for once we can't argue with their research.

We've never seen any of the three offered for sale or auction featuring anything besides the board itself --
no box, no miniature bat or ball, nor any instructions. The few we've seen sell over the past several years
-- only four, total, two Blackstones and two Crawford-Barretts -- have ranged in price from about $85. to
well over $300.

We hope that helps. If there's anything more you'd like to know, please post again. We'd also be very keen
on seeing a nice sharp photo or three of your Morehouse, which you could send off-list to "webmaster" Butch
[ Butch7999(at)aol.com ] here in the front office with our deep appreciation.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Peggy Angstadt" wrote:
<< I have a game board made of wood, with metal attachments. I just cleaned it up for a wall display.
It has a label that reads:
THE MOREHOUSE MFG. CO.
Sole Makers
Columbus, Ohio USA
Baseball
WIZARD
Game
Patented
Nov 8th, 1910
We acquired this as part of a great-uncle's estate in the early 1980's. I'm wondering if anyone has
further information on this. I have found only two nominal references using an Internet search.
Thank you for any information.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5342 Fri Jun 19, 2009 4:54 pm
"christymull49" <christymull49(at)yahoo.com>
Hustler Baseball
I have had in my possesion for 40 years an old game from Hustler Toy called The Great American Game.
It is in pretty good shape. It is missing some of its wooden pegs that serve as men. I am curious as to
its value and how much I might be able to actually get for it on, say, Ebay. Or through your site.
Could you let me know what it is worth?
Thanks,
Christy Mull
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5343 Sat Jun 20, 2009 2:49 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Hustler Baseball
Hi there Christy, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Before we get to an answer,
we'll just remind you that, as you read in our Forum Policy
[ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/Forumpolicy.htm ] when you signed up, you can't advertise
or sell your game on the Forum until you've been on board for ninety days.

Now then, as to the market value on the *Great American* -- it's a terrific game, and although it's always
readily available, there's always collector interest in it. Overall, examples of both the Hustler and earlier
Frantz editions, *without* the highly desirable box, have averaged right about $100. at sale and auction
over the last several years -- a little higher in better condition and with the wooden pegs, a little lower
in worse shape and without the pegs. But ya never know at auction. We've seen four sell on eBay
in just the past couple of months -- three in nice shape with some of the pegs present, which went for
$134., $110., and $76. -- and one in okay shape with no pegs, which stole away to some lucky shopper
for a ridiculous $23. just a day or two ago.

We hope that helps! Any further questions, don't hesitate to ask.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "christymull49" wrote:
<< I have had in my possesion for 40 years an old game from Hustler Toy called The Great American Game.
It is in pretty good shape. It is missing some of its wooden pegs that serve as men. I am curious as to
its value and how much I might be able to actually get for it on, say, Ebay. Or through your site.
Could you let me know what it is worth? Thanks...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5344 Sat Jun 20, 2009 8:02 am
"erfurman" <erfurman(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Hustler Baseball
hi christy, they turn up pretty frequently on ebay and they generally sell for between $50 and $150
depending on condition. if you can provide pictures i might be interested in buying it.
eric - spookyshobbyshop.com

--- "christymull49" wrote:
> I have had in my possesion for 40 years an old game from Hustler Toy called The Great American Game.
It is in pretty good shape. It is missing some of its wooden pegs that serve as men. I am curious as to
its value... Could you let me know what it is worth? Thanks...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5345 Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:11 pm
"spedtchr_4life" <spedtchr_4life(at)yahoo.com>
I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Can anyone help me get an idea of value of this . . . I bought at an estate sale, the 1913 National-American
Baseball game
by Parker Brothers - in blue box - with red playing cards w/a player (wearing Cleveland uniform)
on each of them, also a gameboard, wooden pieces . . . . Can someone help me find a guesstimate of value?
Thank you so much!!!
Beth
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5346 Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:32 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Hello Beth, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Nice pick-up.
We'll give ya twenty bucks for it right now, no questions asked.

Sorry! Standard joke for newcomers. In fact, you've got your hands on a very nice, very desirable item
(why izzit that with all the thousands of estate sales and yard sales we've been to over all these years,
all we find are old Mantovani LPs?). There are several variations of *National-American* (it was also
packaged as simply *Baseball Cards*), but the one with the card backs you've got -- the player is
Hall of Famer Nap Lajoie, which is why a lot of collectors refer to this as the "Nap Lajoie game" --
is the one that commands the highest prices.

Editions with the card backs featuring an illustration of a generic player range from around $35. to $100.,
depending on condition, averaging about $65. Your edition, however, assuming it has something close to
all 52 cards in nice condition, has ranged from $300. to a hair over $500. in on-line sales and auctions
over the last several years, averaging about $360. Nice goin'!

Just one question for ya -- do your cards have eight separate play results on the fronts, or just
a single result? Just another variation in the way the game was published over the years, makes
no difference in the market value. We're just curious. Any other questions for us, don't hesitate to ask.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "spedtchr_4life" wrote:
<< Can anyone help me get an idea of value of this... I bought at an estate sale, the 1913 National-American
Baseball game
by Parker Brothers - in blue box - with red playing cards w/a player (wearing Cleveland uniform)
on each of them, also a gameboard, wooden pieces . . . . Can someone help me find a guesstimate of value?
Thank you so much!!!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5347 Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:51 pm
"Beth Patton" <spedtchr_4life(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Hahha!!! You are so funny!! You notice that I am a special ed teacher so - a sense of humor is necessary -
and I died laughing at your opening statement . . . heh heh. Thank you so much for the information!!!
I am excited - that I got it - and I won't tell you what I paid for it or you will really be mad!!!
(but I did NOT buy any Mantovani LP's - saw some though!!!).

In referring to your question - I will have to answer it tomorrow because I am just NOW going home from
my parents' from Fathers Day thing (although I spent all day at the auction). Not sure of the rules on here
but - if you know anyone who's interested, I will be selling it like . . . . TOMORROW . . . on Ebay because
I truly need the money (finishing my masters in social work - not teaching any more).
Anyway - hate to rant but - I will let you know later on tomorrow about the "variation" thing - to satisfy
your curiosity - thank you so much for the information and quick response!!!! Have a great evening.....
Beth Patton

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hello Beth, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Nice pick-up.
> We'll give ya twenty bucks for it right now, no questions asked.
> Sorry! Standard joke for newcomers. In fact, you've got your hands on a very nice, very desirable item
> (why izzit that with all the thousands of estate sales and yard sales we've been to over all these years,
> all we find are old Mantovani LPs?). There are several variations of *National-American*... but the one
> with the card backs you've got -- the player is Hall of Famer Nap Lajoie, which is why a lot of collectors
> refer to this as the "Nap Lajoie game" -- is the one that commands the highest prices....
> Just one question for ya -- do your cards have eight separate play results on the fronts, or just
> a single result? Just another variation in the way the game was published over the years, makes
> no difference in the market value. We're just curious. Any other questions for us, don't hesitate to ask.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5348 Sun Jun 21, 2009 12:40 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Hey Beth, hi again and thanks for your reply. Seriously, you may be the first person actually amused by
our patented answer to "what's it worth?" questions! Really, though -- thirty? Wouldja take thirty?

Special ed, a noble calling -- we have a cousin who's a special ed teacher, and the wife of one of
the guys here just retired after a 30-plus-year career as an ed administrator -- so we'll cut you some slack
in flogging your game. Consider a heads-up given that a 1913 *National-American*/"Nap Lajoie" is
imminently available on eBay. The guys here should be able to find that. Bear in mind again, though,
that the prices we mentioned are for complete or nearly-complete sets. If you're missing a substantial
number of cards or if the cards are in rough shape, you'll have to lower your sights just a bit, although
it should do pretty well in any case. Good luck with it!
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Beth Patton" wrote:
<< Hahha!!! You are so funny!! You notice that I am a special ed teacher so - a sense of humor is necessary
- and I died laughing at your opening statement . . . heh heh. Thank you so much for the information!!!
I am excited - that I got it - and I won't tell you what I paid for it or you will really be mad!!!
(but I did NOT buy any Mantovani LP's - saw some though!!!).
In referring to your question - I will have to answer it tomorrow... Not sure of the rules on here but -
if you know anyone who's interested, I will be selling it like . . . . TOMORROW . . . on Ebay because
I truly need the money (finishing my masters in social work - not teaching any more).
... I will let you know later on tomorrow about the "variation" thing - to satisfy your curiosity - thank you
so much for the information and quick response!!!! Have a great evening...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5349 Sun Jun 21, 2009 7:22 pm
"Beth Patton" <spedtchr_4life(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Okay - here are the pics - just so you can drool .. haha. No - I accidentally dropped the game in the water....
NO - just jokin - that was getting you back for BOTH the $20 AND the $30 joke!!! Hee hee.

Can you please tell me what you were referring to when you said something about the cards being different
somehow? And - YES they are all there.... I even took pics of all fronts and backs for the posting on Ebay.
In case you know anyone who was interested - my username is the SAME as my email addy - spedtchr_4life
.... posting within the next 2 hours. . Thanks!!! Have a great Fathers Day!!!
Beth

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey Beth, hi again and thanks for your reply. Seriously, you may be the first person actually amused by
> our patented answer to "what's it worth?" questions! Really, though -- thirty? Wouldja take thirty?
> Special ed, a noble calling -- so we'll cut you some slack in flogging your game.... Good luck with it!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5350 Mon Jun 22, 2009 6:11 pm
"Beth Patton" <spedtchr_4life(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Hi - its the sped teacher again - I wondered if you saw the pics I sent and if you could tell me -
(I believe I know what you are talking about . . . assuming that is) if these are separate play cards?
I believe you were referring to each card being different? I don't quite get it but then again -
the reason for my calling as a sped teacher I suppose - haha.

If you could let me know - I want to list this correctly . . . . . Thanks!!!!
Beth

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hello Beth, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Nice pick-up.... you've got your hands on
> a very nice, very desirable item... There are several variations of *National-American*... but the one
> with the card backs you've got -- the player is Hall of Famer Nap Lajoie... -- is the one that commands
> the highest prices....
> Just one question for ya -- do your cards have eight separate play results on the fronts, or just a single
> result? Just another variation in the way the game was published over the years, makes no difference
> in the market value. We're just curious. Any other questions for us, don't hesitate to ask.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5351 Mon Jun 22, 2009 9:03 pm
marsh511 <131met(at)cox.net>
Old Time games w/ real player stats?
I guess I still come from the 'baseball sim' side of our hobby (APBA, Replay, Strat, etc.), but I was wondering
if there are any truly 'vintage' baseball games that attempted to simulate real players' skills. I seem to
remember a game from the 1910's or early 20's that did this - or at least it had small "chits" with real players'
names (maybe 'Parlor Baseball'??). I'm not sure about the granularity of the skills rated, but still...something
from that era with REAL players would be nice to see. This needs to be farther back than the Ethan Allen games
- maybe in the 20's or so. Any such games still floating around?
Thanks,
Marshall
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5352 Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:31 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: I found 1913 Natl American Baseball Game by Parker - help w/value?
Hi again Beth, sorry to leave you hangin' -- we've been at work on an unrelated project here in the front office
for the past couple of days and the Central Computer has been giving us some problems...

Anyhoo, no, sorry again, we didn't see any photos you might have attached to your post -- Yahoo Groups
software strips all attachments from messages sent to its forums (thus the little "Non-text portions have been
removed" thingy you often see at the end of messages here). You'll have to send photos to "webmaster"
Butch off-list [ Butch(at)aol.com ].

As long as the cards belong to the game, though -- that is to say, the cards aren't from some other game
that have somehow found their way into a *National-American* box -- it shouldn't make much if any difference
in the price you get. And since we know the Nap Lajoie cards are "right" for the game, it's only academic
(hello! that's us!) as to whether they have one result or eight results on the card faces.

Here's the thing: Parker Brothers produced what are essentially two different games -- one with the single
result on the cards, the other with the eight results on each card. Those two games were produced with
four different card backs -- a red monochrome of Lajoie, a blue monochrome of Lajoie, a red monochrome
illustration of a generic player, and a blue monochrome illustration of a generic player. And they were
produced both as *The National-American Base Ball Game* and as *Baseball Cards.* So there are a lot of
permutations of the variations in those elements. We've seen several of the possible combinations, but
not all of 'em, which is why we wanted to know "eight results or one." But we figured we'd see once you had
the game up for sale on-line. The major thing for you is that you have the Lajoie backs, which are a lot more
valuable to many collectors than the generic backs (graded high-condition individual Lajoie backs sometimes
fetch three figures alone, but, just us maybe, we regard breaking up a game to sell the individual cards
as heresy). Thus the difference in price in the two editions which we noted a couple of posts ago.

If you still want us to confirm *exactly* what you've got, though, send along a photo or two of a card back
and a card face in representative condition of the whole set, and we'll be happy to tell ya more!
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Beth Patton" wrote:
<< Hi - its the sped teacher again - I wondered if you saw the pics I sent and if you could tell me -
(I believe I know what you are talking about . . . assuming that is) if these are separate play cards?
I believe you were referring to each card being different? I don't quite get it but then again -
the reason for my calling as a sped teacher I suppose - haha.
If you could let me know - I want to list this correctly..... Thanks!!!!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5353 Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:58 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Old Time games w/ real player stats?
Howdy Marshall, long time since we've heard from ya! Thanks for the excellent question.
Technically, though, the answer is "no," with the notable exception of Clifford Van Beek's *National Pastime*
(Major Games, 1930-31). That game is the landmark, Ground Zero entry for tabletop baseball sim games,
and it's a, er, major reason why the very few surviving examples of that game easily fetch four figures
at sale or auction. Ethan Allen's *All-Star Baseball game* (Cadaco-Ellis, 1941) was in fact the next true
baseball sim produced and the first to find commercial success. *APBA,* based directly on *National
Pastime
,* was the next, in 1951, followed by *Big League Manager* from what was then Arrowhead
Industries (now BigLeagueCo) in 1957.

You're right, though, in that many games even earlier than *National Pastime* included rosters and/or chits
and/or player-figures representing star ballplayers of the day. *Major League Indoor Base Ball* and *Major
League Base Ball Game
* (Philadelphia Game Mfg Co, 1913) were among the first and most prominent games
with these sort of features. None of those elements, however, had any bearing on how well each "player"
performed at the plate or on the mound. The results were the same for every guy, so the names in the line-up
were in a sense completely interchangeable. We'd have to do some digging to come up with a comprehensive list
of such games, although *"Inside" Base Ball* (The Popular Games Co, circa 1914) and *Steele's Inside Base Ball*
(Burr-Vack Co, circa 1915) are two more pre-WWI examples that come to mind.

We hope that answers your question! Anything further you'd like to know, just ask.
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "marsh511" wrote:
<< I guess I still come from the 'baseball sim' side of our hobby (APBA, Replay, Strat, etc.), but I was
wondering if there are any truly 'vintage' baseball games that attempted to simulate real players' skills.
I seem to remember a game from the 1910's or early 20's that did this - or at least it had small "chits"
with real players' names (maybe 'Parlor Baseball'??). I'm not sure about the granularity of the skills rated,
but still...something from that era with REAL players would be nice to see....
Any such games still floating around? Thanks...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5354 Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:31 am
"Beth Patton" <spedtchr_4life(at)yahoo.com>
Re: I Listed Nap Lajoie last nite!!
Hey - sorry bout that - didn't know pics didn't go thru - instead of sending them to your private email -
can you check them out on Ebay and let me know more about it? (Listed it last nite)
Sorry - i guess I just want to know more about the game - PLUS - I try to "file away" the type of information
I am reading in the postings that I am now getting since I signed up and.... maybe I will be lucky here
in Kansas and pick up something else if I just knew what to look for!!! Thanks so much - I am enjoying
learning about this!!!
Beth a/k/a spedtchr_4life

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... Anyhoo, no, sorry again, we didn't see any photos you might have attached to your post -- Yahoo Groups
> software strips all attachments from messages sent to its forums (thus the little "Non-text portions have
> been removed" thingy you often see at the end of messages here). You'll have to send photos to
> "webmaster" Butch off-list [ Butch(at)... ]. As long as the cards belong to the game, though... it shouldn't
> make much if any difference in the price you get. And since we know the Nap Lajoie cards are "right" for
> the game, it's only academic (hello! that's us!) as to whether they have one result or eight results...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5355 Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:52 pm
"chrisharrison355" <chrisharrison355(at)yahoo.com>
Two No-Hitters in a row! Well, almost....
Hey guys! Wow, what an exciting two days for me playing baseball games. 2 nights ago, I had a no-hitter
going for 8 2/3 innings for Greg Matthews with the '87 Cards vs. the '87 Royals. I am using the SBS baseball
simulator game. Up comes George Brett and pow ...ruins the no-hitter. Darn it!

Last night, Jack Morris had one going against those same Royals (obviously in a bit of a teams slump).
He went 8 1/3 and guess who was on deck? George Brett again! But, this time Kevin Seitzer singled and
ruined the no-hitter before Brett could. In fact, Morris barely hung on to a 4-0 lead after he gave up a
3-run homer to Danny Tartabull before finally getting the 2 outs.

How many no-hitters have you guys ever had? I have probably played 2000-2500 of these games
and I can only remember 5 no-hitters.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5356 Wed Jun 24, 2009 3:46 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: I Listed Nap Lajoie last nite!!
Hiya Beth! Ahh, "I Listed Nap Lajoie Last Night"... the Joan Baez version of that old Woody Guthhrie song
keeps going through our heads now... wait, sorry, we're thinking of something else...

Your auction looks excellent -- loads of very good pics, very detailed information. The hefty (but quite
reasonable) starting bid will probably delay most bidding action until late (only serious bidders need apply),
but we're sure somebody will jump on that. Your set is just what we expected to see from what you'd already
told us here in the forum. Red Lajoie backs, eight results per card. The box is actually in okay condition
(a very minor factor anyway) for a Parker cardgame box from that era -- we have a couple of other
(non-baseball) Parker cardgames of similar vintage and have seen plenty of others. Sturdy little boxes
they are, but very subject to the sort of flaking of which yours shows only mild symptoms.
The playing pieces/markers, that's tough for us to say. Those very rarely show up as a component
in surviving examples of *National-American,* so we don't have much to which to compare them.
We have seen markers of varying colors with the game before, though, and the ones you have look to be
standard Parker Brothers shapes, so we'd *guess* they're original to the game, although we can't say for sure.
The playing field and playing rules are a nice plus, too. Yes, fifty cards, obviously that's correct for this set.
Some editions include two or four extra "advertising" cards trumpeting other Parker Brothers products,
so a count of 52 or 54 is sometimes seen for the game.

Attachments, yeah, sorry, we could've said something about that earlier -- a reminder for us, then,
to make note of it on our "Forum Policy" page.

Thanks, by the way, for the little shout-out to our site in your auction. We're keeping an eye on it --
out of our range, alas, but... someday...
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Beth Patton" wrote:
<< Hey - sorry bout that - didn't know pics didn't go thru - instead of sending them to your private email
- can you check them out on Ebay and let me know more about it? (Listed it last nite) Sorry - i guess
I just want to know more about the game - PLUS - I try to "file away" the type of information I am reading
in the postings that I am now getting since I signed up and . . . . maybe I will be lucky here in Kansas and
pick up something else if I just knew what to look for!!! Thanks so much - I am enjoying learning about this!!!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5357 Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:04 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Two No-Hitters in a row! Well, almost....
Hey there Chris, thanks for the report! Two near no-nos in succession, pretty cool.
We do wish more guys on board here would send along some recaps of particularly exciting
or unusual results from their tabletop leagues.

Us, we honestly haven't played a single game in over two years now -- we were in the midst of
a major rules tweak, readying for a new season, when, sadly, we lost a quarter of the four-man
front office here, so we had to restructure league management and haven't had any time to really
get back into it. Funny thing is, we were tweaking the rules to boost the frustratingly thin offense
we've had the past couple of seasons, during which we had a number of one-hitters (but always
with the hit coming early, not in dramatic ninth-inning fashion) but no no-nos at all. We'd already
adjusted the results a number of times over the years to suppress what had been (to our tastes)
an excessive amount of hitting and scoring, during which we had a couple of no-hitters. Been
decades since we've had one, though, not that we've played that many games total...

Anybody else? What's the frequency of no-hitters in the games and leagues the rest of you fellers play?
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "chrisharrison355" wrote:
<< Hey guys! Wow, what an exciting two days for me playing baseball games. 2 nights ago, I had
a no-hitter going for 8 2/3 innings for Greg Matthews with the '87 Cards vs. the '87 Royals. I am using
the SBS baseball simulator game. Up comes George Brett and pow ...ruins the no-hitter. Darn it!
Last night, Jack Morris had one going against those same Royals (obviously in a bit of a teams slump).
He went 8 1/3 and guess who was on deck? George Brett again! But, this time Kevin Seitzer singled
and ruined the no-hitter before Brett could....
How many no-hitters have you guys ever had? I have probably played 2000-2500 of these games
and I can only remember 5 no-hitters.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5358 Wed Jun 24, 2009 12:37 pm
meeker1996 <emeek19(at)aol.com>
Re: Two No-Hitters in a row! Well, almost....
I have been playing tabletop baseball since 1977 and in the thousands of games I have had two no-hitters.

APBA 1976 Cubs vs Dodgers, Bill Bonham pitched a perfect game......wish I still had the scoresheet for it
was on regular notebook paper.
I was in a face to face league and in 1987 my team, Covina Valley Sting, had a pitcher by the name of
Tom Seaver throw a no-hitter.

Since then.....nada.
Edward R. Meek
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5359 Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:46 pm
"Tom Stillman" <giantsfan_94121(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Re: Two No-Hitters in a row! Well, almost....
My only no-hitter came with the 1971 Sports Illustrated Baseball. I know I still have the scoresheet
from that because (to the dismay of my gf), I don't throw anything out.
Tom Stillman

--- "emeek19" wrote:
> I have been playing tabletop baseball since 1977 and in the thousands of games I have had two no-hitters.
> APBA 1976 Cubs vs Dodgers, Bill Bonham pitched a perfect game......wish I still had the scoresheet
> for it was on regular notebook paper. I was in a face to face league and in 1987 my team, Covina Valley Sting,
> had a pitcher by the name of Tom Seaver throw a no-hitter.
> Since then.....nada.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5360 Wed Jun 24, 2009 5:55 pm
"chabot652002" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com>
No hitter today the 24th of June
Hi Everybody,
Kind of funny to read today about no hitters, since this afternoon i had my first perfect game ever
(in 33 years!).

I am replaying 1982 with Strat-o-Matic and it was the Phillies in Montréal.
Scott Sanderson won over Larry Christenson...1-0

I think i will laminate the score sheet since i might never see that again!

Don't know if the inspiration came from there, but i was at Quebec's Municipal stadium last night
and A. J. Wideman of the New Jersey Jackals pitched a perfect game until one out in the 8th .

Tonight it's Éric Gagné pitching for Québec still against NJ (CANAM independant league). So far
Gagné's return as a starter is not a success...but who knows he might recover during the Summer.
Jacques
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5361 Wed Jun 24, 2009 6:49 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
kevin [fathead] seitzer
reminds me of the time kevin seitzer broke up curt young's no-hitter with a single
that bounced off the third-base bag. arrrggghh.

--- "chrisharrison355" wrote:
> Hey guys! Wow, what an exciting two days for me playing baseball games. 2 nights ago, I had
> a no-hitter going for 8 2/3 innings for Greg Matthews with the '87 Cards vs. the '87 Royals. I am using
> the SBS baseball simulator game. Up comes George Brett and pow...ruins the no-hitter. Darn it!
> Last night, Jack Morris had one going against those same Royals (obviously in a bit of a teams slump).
> He went 8 1/3 and guess who was on deck? George Brett again! But, this time Kevin Seitzer singled
> and ruined the no-hitter before Brett could....
> How many no-hitters have you guys ever had? I have probably played 2000-2500 of these games
> and I can only remember 5 no-hitters.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5362 Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:36 pm
"Gene Newman" <belinyoh(at)charter.net> uofa57
Re: Two No-Hitters in a row! Well, almost....
On our Cadaco All Star Baseball game forum, I posted several years ago about a game I played
that carried a double no-hitter for 9 and a half innings. The winning run in the bottom of the 10th
came on a HR by the weakest hitter in the home team lineup!
Gene

--- "chrisharrison355" wrote:
> Hey guys! Wow, what an exciting two days for me playing baseball games. 2 nights ago, I had
> a no-hitter going for 8 2/3 innings for Greg Matthews with the '87 Cards vs. the '87 Royals. I am using
> the SBS baseball simulator game.... Last night, Jack Morris had one going against those same Royals...
> He went 8 1/3...
> How many no-hitters have you guys ever had? I have probably played 2000-2500 of these games
> and I can only remember 5 no-hitters.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5363 Wed Jun 24, 2009 4:04 pm
"pokropowicz" <swgstks(at)aol.com>
Re: No hitter today the 24th of June
great job Jacques!!!! I live 5 minutes from the Worcester Tornandoes Field
I got to see Gagne last week
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5364 Wed Jun 24, 2009 11:56 pm
"jacques chabot" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
Re: Re: No hitter today the 24th of June
Québec lost 11-10 and there was a rumble at the end...between Lantigua and Tucker.

New Jersey have won 12 in a row!!
Worcester has a pretty nice team. I saw them a couple of weeks ago.
My son would like us to go see a game out there ...one of these days

We missed our Expos but CanAm isn't bad...and these guys are playing for the love of the game.

--- "swgstks" wrote:
> great job Jacques!!!! I live 5 minutes from the Worcester Tornandoes Field
> I got to see Gagne last week
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________
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