Archive - Yahoo forum posts, 2009 August

BaseballGamesBKW
Site Admin
Joined: October 25th, 2013, 6:10 am

September 12th, 2015, 8:57 pm #1

BASEBALLGAMES FORUM 2009 August, Messages 5424 - 5502
________________________________________________________________________________________________


Message #5424 Sat Aug 1, 2009 3:15 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Newcomer

Hi
My name is Mike and I'm known on the CU boards, net54, and other boards as Stone193.

I've been collecting actively since 1989 but only really developed focus around 2004!

One area - obviously - is board games. I don't have any really cool games from the 1800s
since they're out of my budget range.

I posted one of my recent pickups on net54 and Butch responded.

I had the 'list' of games from this web bookmarked and use it from time to time
since it's more comprehensive than the list in my memorabilia catalog.

I'm looking forward to communicating and learning.

My first question - is there a reference for games alone that included all/most of the baseball board games?

The big problem with some games - not knowing what constitutes a complete game.

Thanx
mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5425 Sat Aug 1, 2009 2:24 pm
"Butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Newcomer

Hiya Mike, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! We wish all our new members
would provide a little introduction as you did, but we're glad to have everyone on board anyway,
whether they post often or merely lurk.

Unlike the Net54 forum where we "recruited" you, this is a low-tech forum, and every message
is moderated for approval by one of the three "front office" guys before posting, so there are often
significant delays between anyone hitting "send" and the message showing up here. Completely eliminates
$p@mmers and trolls, though (just deleted a couple of attempted $p@ms and banned another couple of
$p@mmers mere moments ago), and spares everyone the weird line-breaks imposed by the Yahoo software.

Also unlike the Net54 forum, most of the guys here -- we *think* -- are not millionaires. *We* sure ain't,
here in the front office. So -- with a few notable exceptions -- there aren't a *lot* of folks on board with
19-century McLoughlins and suchlike. If you don't mind, though, since it's already public at Net54, we'll
mention to the rest of the crowd here that you were the buyer of Beth's 1913ish *National-American
Base Ball Game
* that was discussed in this forum just over a month ago. Great pick-up, and at a nicely
fair price for both you and she. Even that one was out of *our* budget range...

To your question -- Mark Cooper's *Baseball Games: Home Versions of the National Pastime 1860s-1960s"
is still the standard work in our little niche hobby. Mark, owner of indisputably the world's best collection of
tabletop baseball, is a member here, as you may have noticed from his recent post. We hope you were able
to catch the exhibition of highlights of his collection last year at the Hall of Fame in Cooperstown (we were
consultants on that, and HOF curator Tom Shieber is also a member of this forum). Mark, and we, have
discovered probably hundreds of additional games since that book was published, but it's still an indispensible
primer for what you and we collect. You can find the book on eBay and Amazon, among other places.

Your last point is a good one and one we make a continuing effort to address. Right now we're trying to get
a proper card count for a scarce 1922 baseball card game, which you'll also see mentioned among recent
forum posts. Between the front office and the thousand members here, though, there's a lot of knowledge
about a lot of games, so if you're wondering about what should be included in something you've got or are
looking to buy, ask away, and sooner or later someone should be able to provide the answer.

B, K,& W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< Hi My name is Mike and I'm known on the CU boards, net54, and other boards as Stone193.
I've been collecting actively since 1989 but only really developed focus around 2004!
One area - obviously - is board games. I don't have any really cool games from the 1800s
since they're out of my budget range.
I posted one of my recent pickups on net54 and Butch responded....
I'm looking forward to communicating and learning.
My first question - is there a reference for games alone that included all/most of the baseball board games?
The big problem with some games - not knowing what constitutes a complete game.
Thanx ...
>
_______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message at Baseballgames,
visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
on the web and click on "Post" in the lefthand menu, or simply
send your e-mail to baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
_______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5426 Sat Aug 1, 2009 8:56 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Newcomer

Thanx Butch for the reference source!
And - no - not a millionaire either! The Lajoie game is the most I've ever paid to date.

I like looking at the graphic changes on some games that stood the test of time for their respective era...

It's obvious that simple board games could begin to 'captivate' the imagination of a child today!

I just picked up another Parker Bros Peg BB - 1957 I'm pretty sure ya saw it on ebay:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1248822759

Here's one that dates earlier but no date anywhere on the box - anyone know what the year/s might be
- my guess 40s?
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1248822881

And that starkly departs from the 1900s version of the game:
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1248823020

Can anyone tell me what constitutes a complete 1908(?) game?
This is the 3rd upgrade I've made on the game over the past 4 to 5 yrs.

Last - I posted in net54 about a year ago of a game I picked up on ebay: Danny MacFayden's Stove League
Baseball Game
- does anyone have this game - I found one that was NEVER played and looks like it was
in a dark cool place since it's pristine! If anyone's interested, I'll post some scans.

That's enough for now - don't want to outstay my welcome!
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya Mike, welcome to the group and thanks for your question!
> ... unlike the Net54 forum, most of the guys here -- we *think* -- are not millionaires.
> *We* sure ain't, here in the front office.
> ... we'll mention to the rest of the crowd here that you were the buyer of Beth's 1913ish *National-American
> Base Ball Game* that was discussed in this forum just over a month ago. Great pick-up, and at a nicely
> fair price for both you and she. Even that one was out of *our* budget range...
> To your question -- Mark Cooper's *Baseball Games: Home Versions of the National Pastime 1860s-1960s"
> is still the standard work in our little niche hobby....
> ... Between the front office and the thousand members here... there's a lot of knowledge about a lot of games,
> so if you're wondering about what should be included in something you've got or are looking to buy, ask away,
> and sooner or later someone should be able to provide the answer.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5427 Sun Aug 2, 2009 1:37 am
"cavalcadeofsports"
Re: Peg Base Ball (was: Newcomer)

Hi there Mike, some quick answers for ya while my cohorts are still out and before I turn in --

The "yellow box" edition of *Peg Base Ball Game* was first issued in 1936. As a Parker Brothers game,
though, it had a long shelf life, so it was probably still available in that edition well after WWII.

That edition, and the 1954 "red box" and 1957 "green box" editions, as well as the 1961 *Game of Peg Baseball,*
were actually revivals of Parker games of the 1890s -- *The Professional Game of Base Ball* (1890),
*The Game of BaseBall* (1899), and *The College Base Ball Game* (circa 1906, possibly earlier).
Game play is essentially indentical in all seven of those, which in turn were based on McGill & Delany's
groundbreaking *Our National Ball Game,* introduced around 1886-87.

Parkers' *Peg Base Ball,* which debuted in 1908, is really a different (and as you know, much simpler) game
altogether. It, too, had a very long shelf life, in production well into the 1920s. We *think* the "red border"
edition (there's also navy, yellow, and grey) is from about the middle of that run, but we're not sure.
A complete edition should include the box (rules on the underside of the lid), the playing board, two small
wooden standard six-sided dice, two dice shakers, and twenty pegs (ten red, ten blue). It's rarely seen with
more than one die, either dice shaker, or more than half the pegs, but all you really need to have the game
playable are the box, the board, and one die.

I remember the remarkable MacFayden you posted at Net54. That game isn't terribly uncommon --
it too had a long production run, from 1927 well into the 1940s -- but it's really unusual to see one that's
not in miserable condition, let alone "like new." You sure had us all envious here!

Cheers
-- Win

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
> ... I like looking at the graphic changes on some games that stood the test of time for their respective era...
> I just picked up another Parker Bros Peg BB - 1957 I'm pretty sure ya saw it on ebay....
> Here's one that dates earlier but no date anywhere on the box - anyone know what the year/s might be
> - my guess 40s?
> http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1248822881
> And that starkly departs from the 1900s version of the game....
> Can anyone tell me what constitutes a complete 1908(?) game?
> ... I posted in net54 about a year ago of a game I picked up on ebay: Danny MacFayden's Stove League
> Baseball Game - does anyone have this game - I found one that was NEVER played and looks like it was
> in a dark cool place since it's pristine! If anyone's interested, I'll post some scans....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5428 Sun Aug 2, 2009 5:56 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Peg Base Ball (was: Newcomer)

Thanx for the info Win.
I also picked up Mark Cooper's book of amazon.
I wish I had the space to display all the games I pick up.
If anyone has pics of how they display their games, I would like to see. I know this may have been
discussed in the past.
Right now some of my games are on the shelf as a backdrop to stuff that's on them like Hartlands
and sports related whiskey decanters (another esorteric) area of my collecting.
mike

--- "cavalcadeofsports" wrote:
> Hi there Mike, some quick answers for ya....
> The "yellow box" edition of *Peg Base Ball Game* was first issued in 1936.... That edition, and
> the 1954 "red box" and 1957 "green box" editions, as well as the 1961 *Game of Peg Baseball,*
> were actually revivals of Parker games of the 1890s....
> ... Parkers' *Peg Base Ball,* which debuted in 1908, is really a different (and as you know, much simpler)
> game altogether....
> I remember the remarkable MacFayden you posted at Net54....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5429 Mon Aug 3, 2009 6:25 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Baseballgames update, 8-03-09

Hiya fellers!
Here we go with another installment of your favorite forum feature, the regularly-scheduled state-of-the-website
address. For a change, we do have some actual news for you this time! But first... Well, for one thing, we're
overdue for change of the guard on the forum's front page, so back to the shelf goes *Wiry Dan's Electric
Baseball Game
* (Harett-Gilmar, 1950), and in its place for the remainder of the summer is *Approved
Little League Baseball Game
* (Standard Toykraft, 19.. er... well, even hands-on with this one, we're not
quite sure what year it hails from. Around or about 1960, we guess). We select it this time because we like to
rotate antique, vintage, and modern games up there and it's been a while since we had something of relatively
recent manufacture on display, but mainly in tribute to the brave effort of, variously for the front office crew,
our granddaughter's/grand-niece's Little League team in reaching the state regional final just a couple of weeks
ago. Pretty good for a gaggle of 12-year-olds who'd been together for barely a month, and it took what
appeared to be the US Olympic Women's Softball team to finally knock 'em out of the tournament.

Next, let's recognize the new members who signed on in July and extend the traditional warm welcome:
say hello to mccormickmolly, riyaagarwal69, gary_schmalz, jason_carriger, madmachell, cannon2961,
hamo_200954, kennynyny, fshrmn69, wallyclay (what took you so long!), allenshock1 (likewise!),
huskerbruce2002, zk180609, dbaran0428, groundzero20, jose59g, and the returning stvans3 and kcmoor.
We're glad to have all of you on board here! If you haven't yet done so, please make sure you're familiar
with our Forum Policy [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/Forumpolicy.htm ], then take some time
to browse our searchable Message archives, Files, Links, and Photo galleries, as well as the features at our
main website [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/ ] -- stick around, introduce yourselves, let us know
how you found us, and don't hesitate to chime in with any questions, comments, or news that you might have.

We'll add again, as always, our frequent but ever relevant advisory, to both newcomers and veteran members
of the group -- please do make sure your Yahoo membership has you registered/subscribed with a currently
active e-mail address. We do occasionally check for and eliminate memberships with an inert or disconnected
e-mail address -- and for some reason, that's the status of a number of folks who've joined in just the last few
months. If you're signed in that way, we have to assume you're no longer really on board, and, regrettably,
your membership will be deleted. So please do keep your status active, fellers -- just click on that "Edit
Membership" link above the Forum title if you're no longer using the e-mail address you registered when
you joined, or if you need to update anything else about your membership.

The news, then, such as it is, was sparked by recent inquiries and comments in the forum regarding free
on-line baseball games and free computer downloads of baseball boardgames. We slapped together a fairly
decent list for that discussion, but after further review, we found we overlooked several others. Not really
our cup of tea, or bottle of beer, here in the front office, but as a service to the many members of the group
who enjoy the computer baseball, we've assembled a slightly more complete and authoritative list of free
games, and you can find that here: http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/BbOnline.htm

If you're into baseball for the PC, you'll want to bookmark that page, since it's not linked from the other pages
at our main site [ http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com ] -- we made it just for you guys, not accessible
to the general public. Any additions or corrections, let us know off-list -- and if you care to comment on any
of the cybergames we've linked to, we'd appreciate it if you'd post that material over in our "back room"
Baseballsims forum [ http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Baseballsims/ ] instead of the main forum here.

On a related note, a shout-out here to the beleaguered Jeff Downey, whose Tabletop-Sports site is one of
the great resources for sports games of any genre, not just baseball and not just boardgames. Jeff's downloads
section is very temporarily disabled during a technical update, and Jeff, one of the real good guys in our hobby,
has taken a bit of completely undeserved flak while trying to provide even better service. We're with ya, Jeff!

A little more somberly, a big shout-out too for our pal Gene Newman, a valued contributor to this forum since
Day One and Moderator Emeritus of our neighbor Cadaco ASB forum. Gene's dealing with some very serious
family health issues, so let's all send some good thoughts his way and on to his household.

After another slow start in July, the forum cranked up a bit toward the end of the month, so let's see if
we can't keep it spinnin' through August. Keep up the chatter, boys!

Butch, Kerm, & Win
Baseball Games
http://baseballgames.dreamhosters.com/
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
_______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message at Baseballgames,
visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/ on the web
and click on "Post" in the lefthand menu, or simply send your
e-mail to baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
_______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5430 Mon Aug 3, 2009 11:00 am
"Warren" <sunseeker11(at)yahoo.com>
Dice-Ball Board Game (Educational Toy Company) Kitchener Ontario

I aquired this old game on the weekend at an estate sale and can not find the same game listed anywhere,
although there are some with similar names. Appears to be from 30's /??. I have 8 pictures on file.
It was manufactured by the The Educational Toy Company in Kitchener , Ontario. It is approx. 20 X 20".
with green felt as play surface with layout of ball field and spaces for , outs , runs hits etc. Nice graphics
of players in old uniforms and hats. The Dice is a Single Clear die that is labelled on 3 sides and 3 clear sides
approx 1 1/4" , BUT- within it, are a pair of dice, coloured - 1 red, 1 green. The Cube (Die) code is along
with the rules showing how the dice count, depending on what comes up , what colour and if on a dotted
clear side.

Neat old game, I am going to try it out later today with a brooklyn fan, and see if I can beat him.

would appreciate any info regarding scarcity or value. I can email pics.
Thanks
NEWBIE
- Sunseeker11
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5431 Mon Aug 3, 2009 12:53 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Dice-Ball Board Game (Educational Toy Company) Kitchener Ontario

Hello Warren, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Well, you've come to the right place,
because if someone on board here doesn't know about an obscure old game, nobody anywhere else does either.

Having said that... wow. That sounds like one pretty bizarre game, and here in the front office, we've
got to admit we've never seen hide nor hair of that one, nor anything quite like it -- and believe us, by now
we've seen just about everything. Hopefully someone else in the group may have heard of it before and
can tell us all something.

For sure, we'd really like to see some pics of what you've got there. You can post 'em yourself in the
"Wha'd Ya Get?" folder of the Forum's "Photos" section, or else just send 'em (embedded in one or more
e-mails or as e-mail attachments) to webmaster Butch [ Butch7999(at)aol.com ]. Please give us a good
close-up of that two-dice-inside-a-die thingy, if you can, and nice straight-on views of the board (and box,
if you have it).
We'd really appreciate that, and thanks just for bringing this curiosity to our attention!
We're looking forward to seeing this one.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Warren" wrote:
<< I aquired this old game on the weekend at an estate sale and can not find the same game listed anywhere,
although there are some with similar names. Appears to be from 30's /??. I have 8 pictures on file.
It was manufactured by the The Educational Toy Company in Kitchener , Ontario. It is approx. 20 X 20". with
green felt as play surface with layout of ball field and spaces for , outs , runs hits etc. Nice graphics of players in
old uniforms and hats. The Dice is a Single Clear die that is labelled on 3 sides and 3 clear sides approx 1 1/4" ,
BUT- within it, are a pair of dice, coloured - 1 red, 1 green....
... would appreciate any info regarding scarcity or value. I can email pics.
Thanks
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5432 Mon Aug 3, 2009 5:32 pm
"velocity" <velocity7717(at)sbcglobal.net>
Strat-O-Matic Baseball

Hello!
I ams earching for an original Start Baseball Game box for my sons birthday.
He played this game when he was a child. He still has the cards but the box I tossed out by mistake.

Game parts would be great but not absolutely neccessary. Thank you.
Scott Middleton
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5433 Mon Aug 3, 2009 6:57 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Strat-O-Matic Baseball

Howdy Scott, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! This one should be easy as pie.
Virtually truckloads of *Strat-O-Matic* games are at auction or on sale at eBay at almost given moment,
ranging from rare card sets, commanding hundreds of dollars in pristine condition, to rather weatherbeaten
game boxes and charts with a mimimum of cards, and going off at little more than garage-sale prices.
You should be able to find something there that suits your needs exactly within a few days of searching --
just be sure to spell the name of the game correctly.
;-)
Another avenue would be right here at this forum, where a great many Strat players are on board.
One of more of them may have a box and charts they'd be willing to sell. We can't personally vouch for
every single member here -- caveat emptor and all that -- but there is a really good bunch of folks here.
Guys, if you do want to strike a deal with Scott, please contact him with a personal e-mail off-list rather than
offering or negotiating in the Forum/e-list itself, thanks.
Good luck, Scott, that's a cool idea as a gift for your boy.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "velocity" wrote:
<< Hello! I ams earching for an original Start Baseball Game box for my sons birthday.
He played this game when he was a child. He still has the cards but the box I tossed out by mistake.
Game parts would be great but not sbsolutely neccessary. Thank you.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5434 Mon Aug 3, 2009 7:43 pm
"Frank Gallucci" <frankvgallucci(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Strat-O-Matic Baseball

I recently picked up this years Strat-o-matic Baseball package for $32.00 from a site called coolstuffinc.com.
That was the best price that I had seen, and I think they have a few left.

--- "velocity7717" wrote:
> Hello! I am searching for an original Start Baseball Game box for my sons birthday.
> He played this game when he was a child. He still has the cards but the box I tossed out by mistake.
> Game parts would be great but not absolutely neccessary. Thank you.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5435 Mon Aug 3, 2009 10:52 pm
"malsman250" <malsman250(at)neo.rr.com>
Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

I attended the National in Cleveland on Saturday. There were a few games about...
frankly, I sort of blew it because I found some underpriced ones and left them on the table.

I did pick up a Psychic Baseball (1927 version), Swat Baseball, and Whitman (Gustafson) Big League Baseball.

Bummer of the day was I found a roller for a Frantz Great American Game, and I have a game with no roller.
But, sadly, the new one is too big, must be different edition. Anybody in need on one? Maybe we can
work something out.

The dealer also threw in some plastic player game pieces. They are two teams, red and green, flat plastic,
each with the position named. Can anybody help with the game?

Also - Regarding the Trojan Baseball Bagatelle game that was discussed -I saw the same game,
it had the same springy thingy to launch the balls. So, indeed, that was the way they were made.

Sorry to ramble,
Bill Malson
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5436 Tue Aug 4, 2009 9:13 am
"velocity" <velocity7717(at)sbcglobal.net>
Re: re: Strat-O-Matic Baseball

Thanks Frank!
I will check them out.

--- "Frank Gallucci" wrote:
> I recently picked up this years Strat-o-matic Baseball package for $32.00 from a site called coolstuffinc. com.
> That was the best price that I had seen, and I think they have a few left.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________


Message #5437 Tue Aug 4, 2009 6:36 pm
"curt young" <curtyoung13(at)hotmail.com>
Re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

if this is rambling, please ramble on.
n e 1 who gets 2 attend such an event should b REQUIRED 2 submit a report a lot longer than that!

--- "malsman250" wrote:
> I attended the National in Cleveland on Saturday. There were a few games about...
> frankly, I sort of blew it because I found some underpriced ones and left them on the table.
> I did pick up a Psychic Baseball (1927 version), Swat Baseball, and Whitman (Gustafson) Big League Baseball.
> Bummer of the day was I found a roller for a Frantz Great American Game, and I have a game with no roller.
> But, sadly, the new one is too big, must be different edition. Anybody in need on one? Maybe we can
> work something out. The dealer also threw in some plastic player game pieces. They are two teams,
> red and green, flat plastic, each with the position named. Can anybody help with the game?
> Also - Regarding the Trojan Baseball Bagatelle game that was discussed -I saw the same game, it had
> the same springy thingy to launch the balls. So, indeed, that was the way they were made. Sorry to ramble ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5438 Tue Aug 4, 2009 7:21 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Ba-boom! Expect some delays...

Hiya fellers! An interesting afternoon here at the front office, where a massive lightning strike hit
and did something weird to the modem of our main computer, not to mention startling all of us enough
to jump so high we banged our pointy heads on the ceiling.

The upshot is that we're going to have to resort to using another computer at another location
for at least the next few days, so it may take even longer than usual to get some messages posted.
Apologies for the inconvenience.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5439 Tue Aug 4, 2009 7:38 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

Hiya Bill, thanks very much for that report! We were wondering if anyone had attended --
a couple of us were close to going there ourselves.

Very cool pick-ups on the three games, and we hope they're in decent condition and that you got them
at a reasonable price. Gotta wonder what the games were that you left behind... Did you see any real
high-end games (19th-century, McLoughlin, &c') on the tables?

Strange that the Frantz roller doesn't fit your other Frantz game. As far as we know, they're all pretty much
identical in terms of nuts and bolts and size. Is it possible the roller actually belongs to the circa 1919
Evan Reed version (which we had assumed was also identical in size and fittings), or even to the 1940s
Principal or 1960s Hasbro versions?

We'll take a look for the red and green flats, but more information or a picture would likely help get us
to an answer more quickly. Off the tops of our heads, the Bobby Shantz game? We don't have our photo files
(or much of anything else) at hand while we're at this computer...

Fascinating news on the Trojan bagatelle! What are the odds of a game that obscure surfacing twice within
a couple of weeks! Thanks for noticing the launch mechanism, that's important information for the database.

Please feel free to ramble on further!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "malsman250" wrote:
<< I attended the National in Cleveland on Saturday. There were a few games about...
frankly, I sort of blew it because I found some underpriced ones and left them on the table.
I did pick up a Psychic Baseball (1927 version), Swat Baseball, and Whitman (Gustafson) Big League Baseball.
Bummer of the day was I found a roller for a Frantz Great American Game, and I have a game with no roller.
But, sadly, the new one is too big, must be different edition....
The dealer also threw in some plastic player game pieces. They are two teams, red and green, flat plastic,
each with the position named. Can anybody help with the game?
Also - Regarding the Trojan Baseball Bagatelle game that was discussed -I saw the same game, it had
the same springy thingy to launch the balls. So, indeed, that was the way they were made. Sorry to ramble...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5440 Tue Aug 4, 2009 8:35 pm
"malsman250" <malsman250(at)neo.rr.com>
Re: re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

Butch and All - Since you (and others)asked, I will ramble a bit farther. I'll address your comments in order...

I was able to attend because I live in easy driving distance of Cleveland - I knew there would be an advantage
eventually....

The pick-ups were good. The Psychic Baseball is in excellent shape, the Swat Baseball is OK, and the Gustafson
is pretty rough. But the price of $40 for the lot seemed ok, especially since he threw in the roller and the
game pieces. I probably should have gone for the Bambino game, even though it was pretty rough. This dealer
had a box of about 15 games, unfortunately I had spent too much money on Marx toys at another booth.
Strange that I spent my money on toys and games at a baseball card show.

There were some of the high end games there, mostly at high end prices. Not a huge number, but if you looked
they were around.

The roller came with the frame pieces, but not the field part. The frame is deeper than my Frantz.
The roller housing is silver, rather than painted. The eight situations on the housing are the same as the Frantz,
but worded different - "Bases Empty" rather than "Bases Clear Batter Up," for example. The roller is too wide and
too big around to go into my Frantz housing. I was so excited when I saw it, I failed to notice these little details.

I have attached a photo of the game pieces (I assumed they were game pieces from the context).
They would seem to be 60s vintage, maybe.

I was startled to see the Trojan bagatelle. I told the vendor that his game had been a topic of substantial
conversation. He just looked at me strangely....

---- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya Bill, thanks very much for that report! We were wondering if anyone had attended -- a couple of us
> were close to going there ourselves.
> Very cool pick-ups on the three games, and we hope they're in decent condition and that you got them
> at a reasonable price. Gotta wonder what the games were that you left behind... Did you see any real
> high-end games (19th-century, McLoughlin, &c') on the tables?
> Strange that the Frantz roller doesn't fit your other Frantz game. As far as we know, they're all pretty much
> identical in terms of nuts and bolts and size. Is it possible the roller actually belongs to the circa 1919
> Evan Reed version (which we had assumed was also identical in size and fittings), or even to the 1940s
> Principal or 1960s Hasbro versions?
> We'll take a look for the red and green flats, but more information or a picture would likely help get us
> to an answer more quickly. Off the tops of our heads, the Bobby Shantz game? We don't have our photo files
> (or much of anything else) at hand while we're at this computer...
> Fascinating news on the Trojan bagatelle! What are the odds of a game that obscure surfacing twice within
> a couple of weeks! Thanks for noticing the launch mechanism, that's important information for the database.
> Please feel free to ramble on further!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5441 Wed Aug 5, 2009 6:35 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Hall a Fame BB Game

http://www.redbf.net/A60/DSC01539.JPG

Has anyone ever seen this game? Manufactured by Barrett Gameboard Co., Evanston, IL.

http://www.redbf.net/A60/DSC01540.JPG

I'm pretty sure ya saw it on ebay - paid 25 bucks.

The actual game is metal and in pretty good shape - haven't tried to play it yet. I just can't resist games!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5442 Thu Aug 6, 2009 1:46 pm
"chabot652002" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com>
Recent history and popularity of the major games

Hi everybody,
A subject on which i don't know much (may be because i am in Canada), is about the popularity of
the various games offering complete cards seasons (APBA, Strat-o, PTP, Replay, Statis, BB Classics etc...).

Does anyone knows how it went in the 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's and now?

Are there more APBA or Strat players? How can we verify this? I know that PTP/Dynasty became very important
when it was marketed.

Are there people who buy each year the complete sets for more than one game?

So if anyone can write about this, i think i am not the only one who would like to learn about it.

This is not about which game is the best but which game had and has more fans... are there reasons
other than the mechanics (like marketing, availability, price, customer service)?

Thanks
Jacques
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5443 Thu Aug 6, 2009 2:03 pm
"Beckner, Derrick" <dgb100(at)psu.edu> pokingwithstick
Re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

It seemed in the 90s onward Strat was king, but before that APBA was probably neck and neck. Seemed like
Statis Pro made a pretty good showing when it was being marketed by Avalon Hill/Sports Illustrated.

--- "chabot652002" wrote:
> ... A subject on which i don't know much (may be because i am in Canada), is about the popularity of
> the various games offering complete cards seasons (APBA, Strat-o, PTP, Replay, Statis, BB Classics etc...).
> Does anyone knows how it went in the 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's and now?
> Are there more APBA or Strat players? How can we verify this? I know that PTP/Dynasty became
> very important when it was marketed. Are there people who buy each year the complete sets for more than
> one game? So if anyone can write about this, i think i am not the only one who would like to learn about it....
> Thanks ...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5444 Fri Aug 7, 2009 12:37 am
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Ethan Allen

Hi guys
I just wanted to share with ya a letter written by Ethan Allen that I picked up on ebay -
my connection with him is from his games rather than cards in this instance.

Here's the letter - it's when he retired from Yale University and he references how - among other things -
he'll concentrate on his game production.

I had read somewhere that the original game cost like a buck .25 and that a big check for him in royalty for
the year was 5K - compare that with todays players and what they would demand for their contribution or likeness?

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1247000527

I consider these kinds of things - like letters - companion pieces to my game collecting.
Not sure if there's any interest in this but thought I would share.

Thanx for viewing,
mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5445 Fri Aug 7, 2009 3:18 pm
"slofstrom639" <slofstrom639(at)yahoo.com>
1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game

I have a 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game. Can anyone help me find out the value?
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5446 Fri Aug 7, 2009 4:57 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Ba-boom! Expect some delays...

Hiya fellers! After two and a half days, and almost three hundred bucks in repairs and upgrades, we are
back on-line in the front office, which gets us underfoot from Win's wife. We're freshly reminded that fast,
capable, courteous computer tech support is as vital these days (and as lucky to find) as a fast, capable,
courteous auto mechanic or plumber...
We should be caught up here in the Forum momentarily, and shortly thereafter with several items sent to us
off-list via Butch and the webmaster's e-mail... Patience...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "butch7999" wrote:
<< Hiya fellers! An interesting afternoon here at the front office, where a massive lightning strike hit
and did something weird to the modem of our main computer.... The upshot is that we're going to have to
resort to using another computer at another location for at least the next few days, so it may take even
longer than usual to get some messages posted. Apologies for the inconvenience.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5447 Fri Aug 7, 2009 5:57 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Dice-Ball Board Game (Educational Toy Company) Kitchener Ontario

Hello again Warren, thanks very much indeed for those photos! Fellers, Warren was good enough to send to us,
off-list, a dozen pics of his game, and a remarkable thing it is. It looks like there's a little wear to the seam of
what we take to be a folding board (Warren, correct us on anything we've got wrong here), which would be
20x10" folded closed, 20" square open, some aging in the spine of the instruction booklet, which looks to be
about 10x6", and as Warren noted is his off-list note to us, the extremely peculiar large transparent die has
fogged a bit over the years. But these are all pretty minor elements in the game's overall condition, which is
really quite nice and wouldn't deter any collector for a second.

It is, as we said, a completely new one on us, which is a bit maddening since games of this sort from this era
are really right up our alley (we'd put it, strictly at a guess, as early- to mid-1930s). We've never seen a
play mechanic exactly like it in any other game (the large transparent die containing two smaller dice of
two different colors), although it does work out something like the system in *Strat-O-Matic* and a couple
of others that employ three dice of different sizes and colors.

Another intriguing element is the game's logo -- the word(s) "Dice-Ball" squeezed between the seams of a baseball,
nearly identical to the logo used for Ray-Fair's 1930s *Dice-Ball,* although this is clearly an entirely different game,
unrelated to the Ray-Fair play mechanic (two six-sided dice with two different results on each face).

Warren, you asked about market value, and obviously, now, that's almost impossible to state, since we have
no track record of sales for examples of this game. As an unofficial, off-the-cuff appraisal, though, based only
on sales for relatively scarce generic games of similar size, in similar condition, from the same era, we'd expect
something around, oh, maybe $50.-$60. or so, maybe a bit less, maybe a little more. We've seen comparable
things go for anywhere from ten bucks to $120., but we'd venture that $50.-$60. would be about fair. We would
caution you to be very wary of any offers you might receive for it if you decide you're interested in selling it.
Unless you want to sell it to *us,* because, gosh, you can trust us!

Have you gotten around to playing it yet with your Brooklyn pal? How did that go?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Warren" wrote:
<< I aquired this old game on the weekend at an estate sale and can not find the same game listed anywhere,
although there are some with similar names. Appears to be from 30's /??. I have 8 pictures on file....
... Neat old game, I am going to try it out later today with a brooklyn fan, and see if I can beat him.
would appreciate any info regarding scarcity or value. I can email pics. Thanks
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5448 Fri Aug 7, 2009 6:26 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

Hi again Mike, thanks for the additional details on your visit to the National! We'd say that was actually
a terrific deal you got on the three vintage games plus the orphan game pieces -- the 1927 Psychic alone,
in excellent shape, has occasionally topped $100. (average near $70.), while we've seen the Gustafson
flirt with $100. (average in rough shape around $20.) and the Swat (presumably the 1948 Milton Bradley game)
sometimes tops $50. (although it averages about $10.-$15. in lesser condition). So we don't think $100. for
the bunch would have been a terrible price, and $40. was major bargain.

We saw a pic of the box for a *Bambino* over at Net54 -- was that the same *Bambino* you were looking at?
The box was water-damaged wreckage, but we've never seen a box for any of the several "Bambino" games.
Do you know which version went with that?

The "silver housing" for what you think is the Frantz (or Hustler) game is a tip-off for us that what you have
instead is maybe the roller and housing for Pricipal Die & Stamping's 1949 remake of the *Great American.*
We've never seen a Frantz or Hustler version with a silver housing, but Principal's game was always silver.

The pics you sent of the game pieces were pretty blurry -- thanks for sending anyway -- but we can see enough
to tell you that our shot in the dark hit the target. Those are indeed from *Bobby Shantz's Baseball Game,*
a 1954 product of Realistic Games Mfg.

The vendor with the Trojan bagatelle may have been too dull to appreciate your comment on what he had there,
but we're not! Thanks heaps, Mike, for the report.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "malsman250" wrote:
<< Butch and All - Since you (and others)asked, I will ramble a bit farther. I'll address your comments in order....
.... The pick-ups were good. The Psychic Baseball is in excellent shape, the Swat Baseball is OK, and the Gustafson
is pretty rough. But the price of $40 for the lot seemed ok, especially since he threw in the roller and the
game pieces. I probably should have gone for the Bambino game, even though it was pretty rough....
The roller came with the frame pieces, but not the field part. The frame is deeper than my Frantz. The
roller housing is silver, rather than painted. The eight situations on the housing are the same as the Frantz,
but worded different - "Bases Empty" rather than "Bases Clear Batter Up," for example. The roller is too wide and
too big around to go into my Frantz housing. I was so excited when I saw it, I failed to notice these little details.
I have attached a photo of the game pieces.... They would seem to be 60s vintage, maybe.
I was startled to see the Trojan bagatelle. I told the vendor that his game had been a topic of substantial
conversation. He just looked at me strangely....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5449 Fri Aug 7, 2009 6:41 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Hall a Fame BB Game

Hey there Mike! Thanks for word on that pick-up -- no, we missed that eBay action and yes, you got
a very good deal on it. We're quite familiar with the game, even though it's a bit scarce and sales are rare.
The only two we've seen move on-line went for $100. and $50. (plus a hefty S&H for that big package), both
in outstanding condition -- although oddly, two others in similarly nice shape we saw on eBay in years past
failed to draw any bids at all with a starting price less than $40. Very nice acquisition -- congrats!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< http://www.redbf.net/A60/DSC01539.JPG
Has anyone ever seen this game? Manufactured by Barrett Gameboard Co., Evanston, IL.
http://www.redbf.net/A60/DSC01540.JPG
I'm pretty sure ya saw it on ebay - paid 25 bucks.
The actual game is metal and in pretty good shape - haven't tried to play it yet. I just can't resist games!
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5450 Fri Aug 7, 2009 11:51 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

Hiya Jacques, always good to hear from ya! A fair question you pose, but unfortunately all we can offer in reply
is guesswork and general impressions, and no hard facts.

*Ethan Allen's All-Star Baseball* obviously had the MLB-sim field all to itself throughout the 1940s, and
it probably took a while for *APBA* to come close in terms of popularity and sales after debuting in 1951.
*Big League Manager* and Negamco *Major League Baseball* probably made a small dent in sales for both
predecessors games starting in the late '50s but surely never quite caught up to either "ASB" or *APBA.*
*Strat-O-Matic,* we'd guess, likely moved quickly into the third spot in the 1960s and probably overtook ASB
for second in the 1970s. *Statis Pro,* as Derrick pointed out, and the Sports Illustrated games probably
made a good run at third behind *APBA* and Strat later in the '70s, and we'd expect Strat took over as
Number One sometime in the 1980s.
BLM, the SherCo series, *Replay,* and of course *Pursue the Pennant*/*Dynasty League* have all had
some significant measure of continuing success in the MLB-sim arena.

As for actual sales figures, only the companies themselves (unlikely to reveal any accurate information) and
possibly the Toy Manufacturers Association would have the real answers. We're just going by the amount of
advertising we've seen, the proportion of fans/gamers each of the games we've mentioned seems to have,
and the number of those games we see offered and selling on the second-hand market. If anyone actually
has some reliable hard numbers, we'd be very interested to know.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "chabot652002" wrote:
<< ... A subject on which i don't know much (may be because i am in Canada), is about the popularity of
the various games offering complete cards seasons (APBA, Strat-o, PTP, Replay, Statis, BB Classics etc...).
Does anyone knows how it went in the 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's and now? ... Thanks ...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5451 Fri Aug 7, 2009 11:54 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Hall a Fame BB Game

Thanx for the info Butch.

I picked up a game in only fair condition but it was 20 bucks; I've never seen it before -
Big League Baseball Game - no manufact. or date on it.

http://i.ebayimg.com/12/!B(,v2WQ!mk~$(K ... g~~_12.JPG

One of the spinners is partially torn - but still nice overall.
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey there Mike! Thanks for word on that pick-up -- no, we missed that eBay action and yes, you got
> a very good deal on it. We're quite familiar with the game, even though it's a bit scarce and sales are rare....
> ... Very nice acquisition -- congrats!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5452 Sat Aug 8, 2009 12:38 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game

Hello slofstrom, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Apologies for our delay in replying.
Bear in mind that if you're putting that item up for sale, you can't advertise it here in the Forum for
another ninety days.

That said, we wish you could give you a more definitive answer than what we can provide.
Prices for *APBA* games featuring complete season card sets have been wildly all over the map --
and while we have final sale and auction prices for hundreds of *APBA* games and sets, we've seen
only a few authentic original 1950s sets sell over the years, so we'd be working from a very small and
therefore unreliable statistical sample. What we can tell you is that 1950s and 1960s *APBA* games
with complete card sets, and just the card sets from those years without any other game equipment,
have ranged from as little as around $10. to well over $1,000. -- often for the same season edition and
in comparable condition. The only original 1955 set we've seen sell was toward the higher end of that range,
so -- while noting that it may have been a fluke figure because of a bidding war -- good luck with it there!

We'd also ask whether you're sure it's an original 1955 card set (made in 1956), or a reprint set
made since the 1980s. Not that reprint sets don't often do extremely well -- we've seen several
top the $200. mark and then some. Check, too, whether it's a complete set -- at least twenty
player cards for each of the sixteen teams. Condition will also play a significant role in any price
realized -- crisp white cards, obviously, much more appealing than dog-eared yellowed cards.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "slofstrom639" wrote:
<< I have a 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game. Can anyone help me find out the value?
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5453 Sat Aug 8, 2009 12:28 am
"mark zentkovich" <mzentko(at)earthlink.net>
1978 sports illustrated/avalon hill baseball game parts available

I bought this game for the cards (about 100 old timers)

I have the other parts in nice condition if anyone wants to trade for any of them..
markz
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5454 Sat Aug 8, 2009 12:53 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Ethan Allen

Hey Mike, very interesting acquisition! You're aware of our affilated CadacoASB forum over at
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cad ... eballGame/ , no? Mind if we share the pic
of that letter with our friends over there as well? (Many of them are already here at this Forum.)

Agreed, for sure, stuff like that adds an extra dimension to the games themselves. One of the lesser items
in our collections here in the front office includes correspondence from the designers to Hank Aaron, seeking
his endorsement of the game (evidently it had already been discussed with him in earlier exchanges).
Unfortunately, we don't have any replies from Aaron included with that...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< Hi guys
I just wanted to share with ya a letter written by Ethan Allen that I picked up on ebay - my connection
with him is from his games rather than cards in this instance. Here's the letter - it's when he retired from
Yale University and he references how - among other things - he'll concentrate on his game production....
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1247000527
I consider these kinds of things - like letters - companion pieces to my game collecting.
Not sure if there's any interest in this but thought I would share. Thanx for viewing...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5455 Sat Aug 8, 2009 12:15 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Big League Base Ball Game (was: Re: Hall a Fame BB Game)

Hey Mike, another nice pick-up there. We're a little surprised you're unfamiliar with that one --
it's something of a classic and fairly plentiful (although we're slightly ashamed to say none of us actually
own one ourselves): *Big League Base Ball Game,* the 1940 number by Selchow & Righter. There must be
a bit of paperwork missing from the box or instructions that's making identification difficult. You might be
interested to know that, despite the different title, it's really the fourth of seven different editions (1917 - 1964)
of *Home Team Baseball Game.* Your price might have been a tad high, but we'd be arguing nickels --
twenty clams isn't a lot for any vintage game in decent shape. Congrats again! Say, mind if we ask
how many games currently constitute your collection?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< Thanx for the info Butch. I picked up a game in only fair condition but it was 20 bucks; I've never seen it
before - Big League Baseball Game - no manufact. or date on it.
http://i.ebayimg.com/12/!B(,v2WQ!mk~$(K ... g~~_12.JPG
One of the spinners is partially torn - but still nice overall.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5456 Sat Aug 8, 2009 6:51 am
"malsman250" <malsman250(at)neo.rr.com>
Re: re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

Butch - I think you have merged two different guys together. I'm Bill, the guy from the National.
Mike, with his Big League Baseball pick-up, is somebody else - but, oddly enough, I found this same game
about a year ago and you answered the same question. It really isn't identified very well.

Anyway, regarding my questions - My Bambino wasn't the box, it was the actual game - but it was
pretty awful beat up. If I had seen them both, maybe I would have put them together.

Thanks for the help on the housing - I had never seen that one before. Also, thanks for the information
on the Shantz pieces. If anyone out there can use the housing or is missing some of the Shantz pieces,
let me know.

---- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hi again Mike, thanks for the additional details on your visit to the National! We'd say that was actually
> a terrific deal you got on the three vintage games plus the orphan game pieces ...
> We saw a pic of the box for a *Bambino* over at Net54 -- was that the same *Bambino* you were looking at?
> The box was water-damaged wreckage, but we've never seen a box for any of the several "Bambino" games.
> Do you know which version went with that?
> The "silver housing" for what you think is the Frantz (or Hustler) game is a tip-off for us that what you have
> instead is maybe the roller and housing for Principal Die & Stamping's 1949 remake of the *Great American.*
> We've never seen a Frantz or Hustler version with a silver housing, but Principal's game was always silver.
> The pics you sent of the game pieces... we can see enough to tell you that our shot in the dark hit the target.
> Those are indeed from *Bobby Shantz's Baseball Game,* a 1954 product of Realistic Games Mfg.
> The vendor with the Trojan bagatelle may have been too dull to appreciate your comment on what he had there,
> but we're not! Thanks heaps, Mike, for the report.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5457 Sat Aug 8, 2009 2:14 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

Bill, hey, our apologies! We know darn well who you are (well, inasmuch as we know anybody without a face
from an internet forum) and we knew who we were replying to, we just misspoke / mistyped your name.
Don't be insulted -- we often call any one of our grandkids by another grandkid's name. Or maybe we're just
making it easy on ourselves by calling anybody and everybody "Mike"... saves space in our tiny brains.
There are enough Mikes in this group that odds are we'll be right almost half the time...
:-)
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "malsman250" wrote:
<< Butch - I think you have merged two different guys together. I'm Bill, the guy from the National.
Mike, with his Big League Baseball pick-up, is somebody else - but, oddly enough, I found this same game
about a year ago and you answered the same question. It really isn't identified very well....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5458 Sat Aug 8, 2009 10:22 am
"Sandy Lofstrom" <slofstrom639(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game

thank you for getting back to me. I have some pictures attached and I've gone through all the cards.
The game edition is 1955 and the set of cards are from 1954. It appears that I am missing 4 cards from
the American League. The game is from an estate that we have inherited and it seems to be in very good shape
overall. Let me know if you have any problems with the pictures. They tell more than I can in words.
Kind Regards,

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... we wish you could give you a more definitive answer than what we can provide. Prices for *APBA* games
> featuring complete season card sets have been wildly all over the map -- and while we have final sale and
> auction prices for hundreds of *APBA* games and sets, we've seen only a few authentic original 1950s sets
> sell over the years.... We'd also ask whether you're sure it's an original 1955 card set (made in 1956),
> or a reprint set made since the 1980s.... Check, too, whether it's a complete set -- at least twenty player cards
> for each of the sixteen teams. Condition will also play a significant role in any price realized -- crisp white cards,
> obviously, much more appealing than dog-eared yellowed cards.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5459 Sat Aug 8, 2009 2:33 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game

Hi again Sandy, thanks for the follow-up! We're not sure how much further help pics would be in estimating
a price on your game, but we'd be keen on seeing a 1955 box and we'd appreciate your sending a shot of that
along to us. One good close-up of any one card in typical condition would be useful too (it would confirm
whether it's a 1955 original or a more recent reprint).

You'll have to send those to us off-list, however, as Yahoo Groups software strips any and all attachments
sent to the Forum / e-list (thus that little "Non-text portions of this message have been removed" tagline
you often see at the end of messages here). If you like, send pics to webmaster Butch [ Butch7999(at)aol.com ].
Thanks!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Sandy Lofstrom" wrote:
<< thank you for getting back to me. I have some pictures attached and I've gone through all the cards.
The game edition is 1955 and the set of cards are from 1954. It... seems to be in very good shape overall.
Let me know if you have any problems with the pictures. They tell more than I can in words....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5460 Sat Aug 8, 2009 4:10 pm
"malsman250" <malsman250(at)neo.rr.com>
Re: re: Some observations from the Sports Collectors National

No problem, Mike!

---- "butch7999" wrote:
> Bill, hey, our apologies! We know darn well who you are (well, inasmuch as we know anybody without a face
> from an internet forum) and we knew who we were replying to, we just misspoke / mistyped your name.
> Don't be insulted -- we often call any one of our grandkids by another grandkid's name. Or maybe we're just
> making it easy on ourselves by calling anybody and everybody "Mike"... saves space in our tiny brains.
> There are enough Mikes in this group that odds are we'll be right almost half the time...
> :-)
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5461 Sat Aug 8, 2009 4:52 pm
"michael rothstein" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com> mikestone193
Re: re: Big League Base Ball Game (was: Re: Hall a Fame BB Game)

Hi Butch
I'm really new to the baseball game thing - I started in 2004/5 due to ebay. And not having any real reference
or people like yourself to talk with - I was all alone. Most of my friends are card collectors and have no interest
in games other than me bugging them to look at them!
I'm not sure how many I have now - I'm in the process of organizing my side of the closet - about 40.
I hadn't seen that game before - that I recollect - and that's why I picked it up - considering what it cost me
just to eat out for lunch with my wife - I figure 20 bucks aint gonna kill me.
In the future, I would like to share the ones I have. National league ball game is the oldest game of mine:

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249764544

I'm sure glad I found this web and being partnered with all you guys! it's a privelege.
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey Mike, another nice pick-up there. We're a little surprised you're unfamiliar with that one --
> it's something of a classic and fairly plentiful (although we're slightly ashamed to say none of us actually
> own one ourselves): *Big League Base Ball Game,* the 1940 number by Selchow & Righter.... Your price
> might have been a tad high, but we'd be arguing nickels -- twenty clams isn't a lot for any vintage game
> in decent shape. Congrats again! Say, mind if we ask how many games currently constitute your collection?
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5462 Sat Aug 8, 2009 4:56 pm
"michael rothstein" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com> mikestone193
Re: re: Ethan Allen

Thanx Butch
Anything I put here can be shared anyplace - it's totally OK.
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey Mike, very interesting acquisition! You're aware of our affilated CadacoASB forum over at
> http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cad ... eballGame/
> , no? Mind if we share the pic of that letter with our friends over there as well?
> (Many of them are already here at this Forum.)
> Agreed, for sure, stuff like that adds an extra dimension to the games themselves....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5463 Sat Aug 8, 2009 7:06 pm
"jacques chabot" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
Re: re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

Hi Butch,
Thanks for this very complete answer. This is a subject that really interest me.
I didn't know that ASB was so popular. In fact it was the first game my father ordered in the early 60's or
late 50's... and actually the first game i played.

Then we got APBA and in 1969 Strat-O. Three games i still play!!

Would be curious to read more answers if others know about it. But of course we will never know the exact answer
since every company has it's own sales stats.

Thanks also to Derrick for his answer.

Will be back with more silly questions!!
Jacques

--- "Butch7999" wrote:
> Hiya Jacques, always good to hear from ya! A fair question you pose, but unfortunately all we can offer in reply
> is guesswork and general impressions, and no hard facts. *Ethan Allen's All-Star Baseball* obviously had the
> MLB-sim field all to itself throughout the 1940s, and it probably took a while for *APBA* to come close in terms of
> popularity and sales ... *Strat-O-Matic,* we'd guess, likely moved quickly into the third spot in the 1960s and
> probably overtook ASB for second in the 1970s....
> ... As for actual sales figures, only the companies themselves (unlikely to reveal any accurate information) and
> possibly the Toy Manufacturers Association would have the real answers. We're just going by the amount of
> advertising we've seen, the proportion of fans/gamers each of the games we've mentioned seems to have, and
> the number of those games we see offered and selling on the second-hand market. If anyone actually has some
> reliable hard numbers, we'd be very interested to know.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5464 Sat Aug 8, 2009 8:24 pm
"Willie Drye" <dryemorr(at)mchsi.com> beaucat001
Re: re: 1955 edition of the APBA Major League Baseball Game

Hi Sandy:
Can't offer anything specific about the 1955 ABPA baseball game. But I've seen a couple of
1950s APBA football games on eBay, and they brought something just under $300. Have also seen
APBA football card sets from that era fetch a healthy price on eBay.
My seat-of-the-pants guess is that an APBA baseball game from that era would probably bring a little more
than the football game, especially if it's in good shape. I think the baseball game was more popular than
the football game, and for that reason the baseball game would probably be worth a little more. The fact that
you're missing four AL cards would have some effect, but I could not begin to calculate how much.
If the cards were for Mantle, Williams, or any of the Yankee stars, the effect would be greater, I'm sure.

This is all speculation, of course. But I would be interested to know what your game brings if you sell it.
Best,
Willie Drye

--- "Sandy Lofstrom" wrote:
> thank you for getting back to me. I have some pictures attached and I've gone through all the cards.
> The game edition is 1955 and the set of cards are from 1954. It appears that I am missing 4 cards from
> the American League. The game... seems to be in very good shape overall....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5465 Mon Aug 10, 2009 5:54 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Baseball Games by Mark Cooper

I got the book in the mail today - very reasonably priced and worth every penny - thanx Butch for the reference!

Now - I know this is bragging - but hey - that's part of the fun of collecting!
This is by far my best pickup in the 4-5 yrs of collecting board games - Butch saw the game
when I posted it at net54 but for those who don't go there - I wanted to post it here.

What makes it so great? It's the boxed early edition of the game AND it looks as good as the day it was made!

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249940859

all of the game parts are still 'closed' in the envelope - tho the game is dated back to 1928 -
this one was made 1930 or later since scotch tape was invented in 1930.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249940923

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941020

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941062

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941110

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941136

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941175

Thanx for taking the time to view - I know this is prideful - but this game gets me excited every time I look at it.

Last - some of the early games in the book are just plain incredible!!!!!
mike
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5466 Mon Aug 10, 2009 11:18 am
"lonirayc" <lonirayc(at)yahoo.com>
Re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

According to a "USA Today" article, APBA has sold over 600,000 units of it's board game,
Strat over 1 million. APBA led in sales up intil the mid-eighties when Strat took the lead for good.
These figures appear to be refering only to each companies baseball games.

It's interesting to read in the book "Strat-O-Matic Fanatics" by Glen Guzzo, that Hal Richmond,
Strat owner and creater, wasn't really too concerned with the rival APBA game. He was more concerned
with the (early 1970's) Sports Illustrated Baseball game which featured something Strat did not: separate
batting performances against lefty and righty pitchers. Strat responded by creating an advanced game
that included that feature and a lot more.
Lon

--- "jacques chabot" wrote:
> ... Would be curious to read more answers if others know about it. But of course we will
> never know the exact answer since every company has it's own sales stats....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5467 Tue Aug 11, 2009 8:16 am
"Beckner, Derrick" <dgb100(at)psu.edu>
Re: re: Recent history and popularity of the major games pokingwithstick

I suspect he was afraid of the massive marketing campaign Sports Illustrated embarked on for a few years.
One full-page, full-color add in a single S.I. probably hit more eyes than all the Strat-O-Matic ads printed
in a year.

--- "lonirayc" wrote:
> According to a "USA Today" article, APBA has sold over 600,000 units of it's board game,
> Strat over 1 million. APBA led in sales up intil the mid-eighties when Strat took the lead for good....
> ... It's interesting to read in the book "Strat-O-Matic Fanatics" by Glen Guzzo, that Hal Richmond,
> Strat owner and creater, wasn't really too concerned with the rival APBA game. He was more concerned
> with the (early 1970's) Sports Illustrated Baseball game which featured something Strat did not: separate
> batting performances against lefty and righty pitchers....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5468 Tue Aug 11, 2009 6:28 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

Lon, thanks for passing that information along! Shoulda thought of it ourselves, since it's a fairly recent article
-- here's the link for anyone else interested:
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball ... htm?csp=34

Derrick, thanks also for those insights! Couldn't diagree with that assessment.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "Beckner, Derrick" wrote:
<< I suspect he was afraid of the massive marketing campaign Sports Illustrated embarked on for a few years.
One full-page, full-color add in a single S.I. probably hit more eyes than all the Strat-O-Matic ads printed in a year.
>
> --- "lonirayc" wrote:
> > According to a "USA Today" article, APBA has sold over 600,000 units of it's board game,
> > Strat over 1 million.... It's interesting to read in the book "Strat-O-Matic Fanatics" by Glen Guzzo,
> > that Hal Richmond, Strat owner and creater, wasn't really too concerned with the rival APBA game.
> > He was more concerned with the (early 1970's) Sports Illustrated Baseball game....
> >
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5469 Tue Aug 11, 2009 6:50 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Danny MacFayden's Stove League (was: Re: Baseball Games by Mark Cooper)

Mike, thanks for sharing those pics! Nothing shameful about a little bragging there -- that game's a beaut,
and we really do wish more of the fellas here would post pics of the favorites in their own collections.

That MacFayden, for folks on board who may be unfamiliar with the game, is whatcha might call
a "condition rarity" -- MacFaydens in general aren't *terribly* hard to find, since it had a very long
production run, 1927 into the 1940s -- but they're almost always found in wretchedly miserable shape.
Yours does look store-shelf fresh. Nice catch on the Scotch tape as evidence for putting a "no-older-than" date
to that edition, by the way -- we guesstimated it as a mid-1930s edition -- although it's possible the "newer" tape
was applied to a 1927-1930 version, no? So maybe we're all underestimating its age. Although the attire shown
on the illustrated fans still has us thinking mid-to-late '30s...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< ... Now - I know this is bragging - but hey - that's part of the fun of collecting!
This is by far my best pickup in the 4-5 yrs of collecting board games - Butch saw the game
when I posted it at net54 but for those who don't go there - I wanted to post it here.
What makes it so great? It's the boxed early edition of the game AND it looks as good as the day it was made!
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249940859
all of the game parts are still 'closed' in the envelope - tho the game is dated back to 1928 -
this one was made 1930 or later since scotch tape was invented in 1930.
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249940923
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941020
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941062
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941110
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941136
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y202/s ... 1249941175
....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5470 Tue Aug 11, 2009 6:50 pm
"jacques chabot" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
Re: re: Recent history and popularity of the major games

Thanks Butch,
Exactly the kind of document i was looking for!
Jacques

--- "Butch7999" wrote:
> Lon, thanks for passing that information along! Shoulda thought of it ourselves, since it's a fairly recent article
> -- here's the link for anyone else interested:
> http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball ... htm?csp=34
> Derrick, thanks also for those insights! Couldn't diagree with that assessment.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5471 Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:03 pm
meeker1996 <emeek19(at)aol.com>
Willie Mays, Gil Hodges, and more (was: Re: Ethan Allen)

Hey Butch,
Back in the early 70's, there was a small ad in Street & Smith's baseball called Willie Mays Baseball.?
The pic in ad seem familiar to the Negamco baseball game, ad familiar too, but with the Willie Mays
endorsement.? Can you or anyone shed some light on this??

Great site and great set of posts from everyone.? My first baseball game that I actually cut my teeth on
was Gil Hodges Baseball.? I do recall owning for a short while, the Milton Bradley Baseball game where
players had cards and it was a face to face game, not like the small card game that came out a few years
later.? I played Gil Hodges until I discovered APBA in 77 then later Extra Innings.

Thanks for letting me ramble.
Edward R. Meek

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Hey Mike, very interesting acquisition! You're aware of our affilated CadacoASB forum over at
> http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/Cad ... eballGame/
> ... Agreed, for sure, stuff like that adds an extra dimension to the games themselves....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5472 Tue Aug 11, 2009 10:38 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Danny MacFayden's Stove League (was: Re: Baseball Games by Mark Cooper)

{quote}Butch:
"although it's possible the "newer" tape was applied to a 1927-1930 version, no? So maybe we're all
underestimating its age. Although the attire shown on the illustrated fans still has us thinking mid-to-late '30s..."

Hi Butch
first thanx for the kind words!

yes, it's always possible that the same game was being made thru the early 'scotch tape' era
and to be honest - since this isn't like sportscards, it probably doesn't matter - if we're talking about value?

the value in this game -- as you've stated - is in the condition rarity. the game was probably left in a drawer
or closet and didn't see daylite, sunlite, moonlite or israelite!

and last - and this is a hobby bias - i like bb cards but unless ya put them in a holder - it's best not to handle them
and play with them; these games can be played - held in ones hand - talk about them; imagine what the kids were
doing during this time; discuss the difference between today and what it was like to be a kid in 1955.
we played these games on any rainy day - at someone's house/apt - drank yoo hoo and listened to early rock
on the radio or better yet; a bb game!
was my childhood 'better' than kids today? of course not - only different with respect to the technology and times.

Sorry for the length!
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Mike, thanks for sharing those pics! Nothing shameful about a little bragging there -- that game's a beaut,
> and we really do wish more of the fellas here would post pics of the favorites in their own collections.
> That MacFayden, for folks on board who may be unfamiliar with the game, is whatcha might call
> a "condition rarity" -- MacFaydens in general aren't *terribly* hard to find... but they're almost always found
> in wretchedly miserable shape. Yours does look store-shelf fresh. Nice catch on the Scotch tape as evidence
> for putting a "no-older-than" date to that edition... although it's possible the "newer" tape was applied to
> a 1927-1930 version, no? So maybe we're all underestimating its age....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5473 Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:27 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Willie Mays, Gil Hodges, and more (was: Re: Ethan Allen)

Hi Ed, thanks for the question and comments! By all means, sir, ramble on!

Regarding the Willie Mays game, the ad you saw -- you don't still have it, do you? We'd really like to see it --
must have been for *Willie Mays Baseball Game,* manufactured in about 1969 by two different companies.
This one -- or really these two, since despite the same title and nearly identical graphics on the box lids,
the two companies' games were markedly different in terms of gameplay -- was a major mystery for us
when this forum first went on-line, as the game is a bit of a rarity. Fortunately, a couple of members
own examples of it, and the information they provided is a perfect demonstration of why we put this thing up
in the first place (thanks once more John and, especially, Steve).

If your recollection of when you saw the ad is correct, one of the two 1969ish Mays games must have been
the subject, although it might be a little surprising that either company (Professional Education Products, and
Preferred Games Inc, both small indies -- ponied up the dough to advertise in Street & Smith. If you saw the ad
just a few years earlier, the game in question might be *Willie Mays Push Button Baseball,* a circa 1966 effort
by Eldon Champion Games. Eldon -- we remember having their slotcar sets as kids -- were a little more
well-heeled as a toy and game manufacturer and had more of an advertising budget. Oddly, though,
the Eldon game today seems even more difficult to find than the Mays boardgames from those two indies.

Thanks for the reminiscences about *Gil Hodges' Pennant Fever,* which is still well regarded by many gamers
and collectors. We'll take this opportunity to mention again that our search for the creators of that game at RGI
sputtered out, so if anyone who's joined since that was last discussed in here knows anything about the design team
at Research Games, please speak up!

Milton Bradley's *Official Baseball Card Game,* though, is a "face to face" game too, no? --
different, but not *too* different, than their larger *Official Baseball Game*?

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "emeek19" wrote:
<< ... Back in the early 70's, there was a small ad in Street & Smith's baseball called Willie Mays Baseball.?
The pic in ad seem familiar to the Negamco baseball game, ad familiar too, but with the Willie Mays
endorsement.? Can you or anyone shed some light on this?? Great site and great set of posts from everyone.?
My first baseball game that I actually cut my teeth on was Gil Hodges Baseball.? I do recall owning for
a short while, the Milton Bradley Baseball game where players had cards and it was a face to face game,
not like the small card game that came out a few years later.? ...Thanks for letting me ramble.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5474 Wed Aug 12, 2009 12:54 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: Danny MacFayden's Stove League

Hey there Mike, thanks very much for the comments! Just to be, well, clear, so to speak, what we were
trying to say about the Scotch tape thing is that one could take an old game of uncertain vintage, and
years later, apply Scotch tape or ballpoint pen to it (vandalism! Fie upon it!), and mistakenly think
the original issue of the game must have been contemporary with those things, even though the tape
or the ballpoint weren't invented until decades later. So while the graphics on your MacFayden *suggest*
mid- or late 1930s to us, the presence of post-1930 tape doesn't itself rule out that the game is a pre-1930
edition, because it could have been applied much later down the road.

Anyway! Great comments on the "personal histories" of individual games. Those are thoughts that are
always with us every time we acquire an antique game here -- who used to own this? Where did that kid
in 1950, or 1935, or 1920, play it -- on a tenement stoop, on the kitchen table of a farmhouse, on a
neighborhood front porch, in the parlor of a mansion? Did he play it by himself, with his pals, his dad,
his brothers? Did he form a league? Keep stats? How did that much-loved game of someone's youth
get shelved, relegated to an attic or basement, forgotten, and get away to the second-hand market?
We always wonder.

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "mikestone193" wrote:
<< ... yes, it's always possible that the same game was being made thru the early 'scotch tape' era and
to be honest - since this isn't like sportscards, it probably doesn't matter - if we're talking about value?
the value in this game -- as you've stated - is in the condition rarity....
... i like bb cards but unless ya put them in a holder - it's best not to handle them and play with them;
these games can be played - held in ones hand - talk about them; imagine what the kids were doing
during this time; discuss the difference between today and what it was like to be a kid in 1955....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5475 Wed Aug 12, 2009 9:45 am
"Dan" <dannysclayton(at)gmail.com>
Hello All!

I want to say Thank You for a wonderful group and I have a question to ask. I play APBA baseball
and was wondering if anyone has heard of someone offering individual cards from previous seasons for sale
as opposed to having to buy the entire season's worth of cards, which easily runs above fifty dollars.
I did see once on ebay a Nolan Ryan card and I purchased it immediately but five days later I got a refund
and an email saying that the person died and family members where taking care of his business and couldn't
find the card to mail me. Needless to say, that being the only thing I have seen, I am pretty disappointed.
Would love to hear any ideas or suggestions. Thanks!
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5476 Wed Aug 12, 2009 1:23 pm
"michael rothstein" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com> mikestone193
Re: re: Danny MacFayden's Stove League

Thanx again Butch.
On the tape thing - I understand what you're saying.

Now, if someone applied tape later - which is possible - then the envelope would most likely be
previously 'stapled' together - I've picked up games with rust markes around the holes from
the manufact. stapling it together.

Just a thought - though one can't rule out anything.

Joining this forum is the best! I can't believe I have home!
mike

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> ... Just to be, well, clear, so to speak, what we were trying to say about the Scotch tape thing is that
> one could take an old game of uncertain vintage, and years later, apply Scotch tape or ballpoint pen to it
> (vandalism! Fie upon it!), and mistakenly think the original issue of the game must have been contemporary
> with those things, even though the tape or the ballpoint weren't invented until decades later. So while the
> graphics on your MacFayden *suggest* mid- or late 1930s to us, the presence of post-1930 tape doesn't itself
> rule out that the game is a pre-1930 edition, because it could have been applied much later down the road.
> Anyway! Great comments on the "personal histories" of individual games....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5477 Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:41 pm
"Tom Stillman" <giantsfan_94121(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA cards (was: Re: Hello All!)

Hi Dan,
Welcome to the group.

I have seen individual APBA cards offered for sale. People seeing my house would disagree
but I tend to be somewhat organized and I personally could not comprehend the idea of someone
breaking up a team set to sell one card as it would ruin the rest of the set and who's going to buy
a Guy Sularz card if Will Clark has been sold from the set.

I seem to recall individual cards offered in the old "APBA Journal" and in sports collectors magazines.
I have not noticed it on eBay but it certainly is possible.

Tom Stillman

--- "Dan" wrote:
> I want to say Thank You for a wonderful group and I have a question to ask. I play APBA baseball and
> was wondering if anyone has heard of someone offering individual cards from previous seasons for sale
> as opposed to having to buy the entire season's worth of cards, which easily runs above fifty dollars.
> ... Would love to hear any ideas or suggestions. Thanks!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5478 Wed Aug 12, 2009 6:44 pm
"Fred McShea" <fmcshea(at)comcast.net>
Re: APBA cards (was: Re: Hello All!)

Dan, I suggest that you contact Jack ("The Cardfather") Kohn, as he specializes in helping folks replace
individual APBA baseball cards and/or teams. Jack can be reached at Cardfather66(at)aol.com, and
I have copied him here so that he'll be expecting to hear from you.

BTW: Jack's fees for his cards are extremely reasonable. I recently made a purchase from him
that got me a rare card that I needed to fill out a season set.
Good luck!
Fred

--- "Dan" wrote:
> I want to say Thank You for a wonderful group and I have a question to ask. I play APBA baseball and
> was wondering if anyone has heard of someone offering individual cards from previous seasons for sale
> as opposed to having to buy the entire season's worth of cards, which easily runs above fifty dollars.
> ... Would love to hear any ideas or suggestions. Thanks!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5479 Thu Aug 13, 2009 8:45 am
"Jerome, David R." <David.Jerome(at)us.ngrid.com>
Re: Strat cards (was: Re: APBA cards)

Hi,
Anyone know who might sell indidual team sets of strat-o-matic cards other tan moonlightgraham?
Thanks,
david

--- "Fred McShea" wrote:
> Dan, I suggest that you contact Jack ("The Cardfather") Kohn, as he specializes in helping folks replace
> individual APBA baseball cards and/or teams....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5480 Thu Aug 13, 2009 10:32 pm
"precinct9" <precinct9(at)yahoo.com>
APBA

Hey guys I am a new member and I just received my first game in the mail today after reading about
the tournament in the Sunday NY Times. I am looking for a little help getting started. Any advice or
any assistance on-line to assure that I am playing correctly. Specifically I just need clarification with
the red white roll and the coorresponding black number and the move based on the two matching
red numbers on the players card.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5481 Fri Aug 14, 2009 12:08 am
"Dom" <NYAPBA(at)yahoo.com>
Re: APBA

Precint9,
Do you live in NY? If you do, contact me at NYAPBA(at)yahoo.com

I live in NY and can give you some guidance in your new venture.
DOM

--- "precinct9" wrote:
> Hey guys I am a new member and I just received my first game in the mail today after reading about
> the tournament in the Sunday NY Times. I am looking for a little help getting started. Any advice or
> any assistance on-line to assure that I am playing correctly....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5482 Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:44 am
"Willie Drye" <dryemorr(at)mchsi.com> beaucat001
Re: APBA

If I understand you correctly, you're trying to understand how to interpret and use the dice roll
in the APBA baseball game.

In APBA, the number from the dice roll is combined instead of added together. You have a large white die
and a smaller red die. When you roll the dice, you read the number from the white die as 10s, and the red die
as 1s. So if you roll, for example, six on the white die and a six on the red die, the number is 66. You then go
to the player's card for the batter, and look at the number 66 on his card. If the player is a power hitter, the
number you'll usually see is 1. You then go to the play board and look under result 1, which will say "Home run."

In another situation, say there's a runner on first. You roll the dice and come up with a 1 on the white die and
a 2 on the red die. You read that as 12. On the player card, you go to 12 and find 25. Then go to the play result
chart for Runner on first, and the result for 25 is "Double play."

Sometimes, players have two columns of numbers on their cards. You usually ignore the second column.
But it does come into play occasionally. On some cards -- usually when you roll 11, 33 or 66 -- you'll find 0
on the player's card. When this happens, you roll the die again, only this time you use the number from the
second column. So it would work like this -- you roll 66 for the batter, and at 66 you find 0. So you roll again.
This time you roll 25. You go to 25 on the card, look in the second column, and you find 6. You look at
the appropriate result chart, and see "Double."

I'll be glad to clarify this if it's not clear to you, although I won't be able to answer until Sunday night,
I'm headed out of town for the weekend.

Hope this helps.

--- "precinct9" wrote:
> Hey guys I am a new member and I just received my first game in the mail today after reading about
> the tournament in the Sunday NY Times. I am looking for a little help getting started. Any advice or
> any assistance on-line to assure that I am playing correctly. Specifically I just need clarification with
> the red white roll and the coorresponding black number and the move based on the two matching
> red numbers on the players card.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5483 Fri Aug 14, 2009 8:48 am
"jacques chabot" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
Re: Strat-o teams and sets available

Hi David,
I still have some teams available (cheap). It depends of your wish list. You can contact me off-forum to
tell me what team you are looking for. I am planning to put them on Ebay but i don't have much time these days.

If anyone is interested i also have some complete series to sell (1993 to 1998, 2002 to 2007).

I discovered that i prefer to replay from 1969 to 1992. I didn't quite like the idea of adding more teams in 1993...
and since i was mostly gone in Europe and in the Near East in those days, these are years that are almost
unknown to me (mid 1990's).
Jacques

--- "David.Jerome" wrote:
> Hi,
> Anyone know who might sell indidual team sets of strat-o-matic cards other tan moonlightgraham?
> Thanks...
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5484 Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:50 am
"capecodcubs" <wyosoxfan(at)comcast.net
Re: APBA

Sounds like you are playing it correctly. You'll pick up speed fairly quickly. The APBA community is pretty strong,
there is a large forum on Delphi at "APBA Between the lines" that you can get to here:
http://forums.delphiforums.com/apbabtl/start

Feel free to shoot me an e-mail if you have any other questions.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5485 Fri Aug 14, 2009 6:53 pm
"Jim Price" <precinct9(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA

Thanks Willie
I have the opposite rules. The red die is 10's and the white are 1's.
Jimmy

--- "Willie Drye" wrote:
> If I understand you correctly, you're trying to understand how to interpret and use the dice roll
> in the APBA baseball game. In APBA, the number from the dice roll is combined instead of added together.
> You have a large white die and a smaller red die. When you roll the dice, you read the number from
> the white die as 10s, and the red die as 1s....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5486 Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:58 am
"Danny Clayton: <dannysclayton(at)gmail.com>
Re: re: APBA cards (was: Re: Hello All!)

Thank You Fred! I will be emailing Jack in a minute!

--- "Fred McShea" wrote:
> Dan, I suggest that you contact Jack ("The Cardfather") Kohn, as he specializes in helping folks replace
> individual APBA baseball cards and/or teams. Jack can be reached at Cardfather66(at)aol.com, and
> I have copied him here so that he'll be expecting to hear from you.... Good luck!
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5487 Sat Aug 15, 2009 10:01 am
"Dom" <NYAPBA(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: APBA

You are correct Jimmy.
The red is the first number that you read. So red 2 white 5 is read as 25 (twenty-five).
DOM

--- "Jim Price" wrote:
> Thanks Willie
> I have the opposite rules. The red die is 10's and the white are 1's.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5488 Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:59 pm
"urbanshockerrules" <1969mets(at)gmail.com>
1911 Detroit News "supplement"

Just picked this up. It was being sold as an advertisement for a baseball game, but it is, in fact,
the game itself. A page from a 1911 Sunday magazine supplement in the Detroit News Tribune,
the rather insane game is played by swinging a key suspended on a cord hanging from above
at tacks placed on the page, i.e. game board. It's about 24" x 18".

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w150 ... newsbb.jpg
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5489 Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:18 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1911 Detroit News "supplement"

Absolutely sensational find, Joe, congratulations on that and thanks for sharing! Fellers, we've added
a photo of the piece to the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album of our "Photos" section, in addition to the link
provided in the original post.

As a few of you may recognize, that's an entirely new discovery, a heretofore uncatalogued game,
the only existing example of which we're aware. Lovely graphics with the red-clad leaping fielder and
the kids in period garb! Nice condition, too, the one ragged edge easily concealed with some skillful matting
if you go that route. And if you don't mind us mentioning, a sweet price for that rarity -- thanks in part, we think,
to the vendor's careless description. As Joe suggested, method of play foreshadowed early-1970s versions of
*Skittle Baseball* by Aurora (the one with Don "Maxwell Smart" Adams) and Marx.

We're triply envious in that we overlooked that auction ourselves, and in that our search for the *Buffalo News*
edition of the 1896 newspaper baseball game supplement, *Will Our Boys Win,* dead-ended even right here
in Buffalo. Great pick-up!

("Urban Shocker... aaoooohh!")
B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "urbanshockerrules" wrote:
<< Just picked this up. It was being sold as an advertisement for a baseball game, but it is, in fact,
the game itself. A page from a 1911 Sunday magazine supplement in the Detroit News Tribune,
the rather insane game is played by swinging a key suspended on a cord hanging from above at tacks
placed on the page, i.e. game board. It's about 24" x 18".
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5490 Thu Aug 20, 2009 9:22 pm
"mikestone193" <mesablanca1110(at)yahoo.com>
Re: 1911 Detroit News "supplement"

Congratulations on a sweet pickup!

I would've thought this was an "ad" for the game. Butch has alluded to the idea of framing it -
I agree - it would really nice on my wall!

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Absolutely sensational find, Joe, congratulations on that and thanks for sharing! Fellers, we've added
> a photo of the piece to the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album of our "Photos" section, in addition to the link provided
> in the original post. As a few of you may recognize, that's an entirely new discovery, a heretofore uncatalogued
> game, the only existing example of which we're aware. Lovely graphics with the red-clad leaping fielder and
> the kids in period garb! Nice condition, too, the one ragged edge easily concealed with some skillful matting
> if you go that route....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5491 Fri Aug 21, 2009 2:37 am
"Bob Reynolds" <b.rain55(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: 1911 Detroit News "supplement"

I'm interested. tell me more about the pic.... size....etc....If you can send a pic of it..
and what you are looking for....price-whys.... I might take it. I love stuff like that.
The older looking...the better. I'm a big Tiger fan. I'd love to see what you have there.

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Absolutely sensational find, Joe, congratulations on that and thanks for sharing! Fellers, we've added
> a photo of the piece to the "Wha'd Ya Get?" album of our "Photos" section, in addition to the link provided
> in the original post. As a few of you may recognize, that's an entirely new discovery, a heretofore uncatalogued
> game, the only existing example of which we're aware.....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5492 Fri Aug 21, 2009 2:58 am
"Bob Reynolds" <b.rain55(at)yahoo.com>
Re: re: 1911 Detroit News "supplement"

I prefer to frame it and put it on the wall. Hope I hear from you soon.

--- "Bob Reynolds" wrote:
> I'm interested. tell me more about the pic.... size....etc. ...If you can send a pic of it..
> and what you are looking for....price- whys.... I might take it. I love stuff like that.
> The older looking...the better. I'm a big Tiger fan. I'd love to see what you have there.
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5493 Fri Aug 21, 2009 3:24 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1911 Detroit News "supplement"

Hi Bob, thanks for the inquiry! No secret that the front-office guys here love the ancient stuff too...
If I know Urban Shocker, though, he's more keen on having that piece in his collection than in selling it,
but I won't presume to speak for him.
At any rate, photos of the game, as mentioned both in Wednesday's original post and in our Thursday reply,
can be found at the link in the original message and in the "Wha'd Ya Get?" folder of the Forum's "Photos"
section -- and again, as noted, it's about 24x18", with a ruler alongside in one pic as verification.
-- Butch

--- "Bob Reynolds" wrote:
<< I'm interested. tell me more about the pic.... size....etc....If you can send a pic of it..
and what you are looking for....price-whys.... I might take it. I love stuff like that.
The older looking...the better. I'm a big Tiger fan. I'd love to see what you have there.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5494 Sun Aug 23, 2009 11:29 pm
"r.hodges67" <r.hodges67(at)yahoo.com>
1920's boardgame - Major League Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme

I own a baseball board game from the 1920's called Major Leage Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme.
I am having a tough time determining market value as I have yet to see a complete game set in the market -
the only thing I have seen in the market is some of the individual players. I have the gameboard, playing
schedule for the team in the field postcard, playing schedule for the team at bat postcard, The Indoor Game
Supreme instruction booklet, The Indoor Game Supreme reviews booklet, three dice, extra player update labels
and 16 baseball teams & players in the original envelopes. (I have a complete list of players). There are 8 teams
from American League; The Boston Red Sox, The Chicago White Sox, The Cleveland Indians, The Detroit Tigers,
The New York Yankees, The Philadelphia Athletics, The St. Louis Browns and The Washington Senators.
National League; The Boston Braves, The Brooklyn Robins, The Chicago Cubs, The Cleveland Reds, The New York
Giants, The Philadelphia Quakers, The Pittsburgh Pirates and The St. Louis Cardinals.
The set includes Ruth & Gehrig. Have you seen anything like this in the market? Any idea as to it's value?
Appreciate any info you can provide.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5495 Tue Aug 25, 2009 7:38 pm
"chabot652002" <chabot65(at)hotmail.com> chabot652002
A very good game that is played with baseball cards

Hello everybody,
While watching the baseball games auctions currently on Ebay, i just noticed that there is an interesting game
available that is played with baseball cards (any kind of baseball card from any year).

It's called "Baseball card game" and it was made by SLJ in 1991.
I have tested about ten games that one can play with baseball cards and this one is the best.

I guess it will sell for a couple of bucks. So anyone interested should check this link.
Of course i am not the seller and don't know him and i won't bid since i already have it!

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?Vi ... K:MEWAX:IT

Jacques
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5496 Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:54 pm
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1920's boardgame - Major League Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme

Hello r.h., welcome to the group and thanks for your questions! You've come to the right place --
if someone on board here doesn't have the answers you need, ain't nobody nowhere else does.
We might have something on your game right here in the front office, but we're shorthanded this week --
be patient, though, we may have something for you in another day or two once the entire staff returns from
various vacations and scouting trips. What we can say in the meantime is that you've got a very cool item
on your hands there. Just so we're sure we're discussing the exact same 1920s *Major League Ball* --
several games have nearly identical titles -- can you name the manufacturer for us?

--- "r.hodges67" wrote:
<< I own a baseball board game from the 1920's called Major Leage Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme.
I am having a tough time determining market value as I have yet to see a complete game set in the market -
the only thing I have seen in the market is some of the individual players. I have the gameboard, playing
schedule for the team in the field postcard, playing schedule for the team at bat postcard... instruction booklet
... reviews booklet, three dice, extra player update labels and 16 baseball teams & players in the original
envelopes.... There are 8 teams from American League... National League... Have you seen anything like this
in the market? Any idea as to it's value? Appreciate any info you can provide....
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5497 Wed Aug 26, 2009 3:37 pm
"jose59g" <dmfjg(at)aol.com>
1968 topps baseball game set

hello all,
i own the '68 topps baseball game set(33 cards). i'm wondering if anyone is familiar with the game instructions?
thanx,
jose'
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5498 Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:18 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1920's boardgame - Major League Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme

Hi again r.h. -- the front office crew has reassembled, but we're still waiting for some confirmation from you
as to whether the game you have is indeed the game we think you have. We're assuming that what you've
got there is *Major League Ball* by National Game Makers, which is of course a very scarce piece. As you
suggested, quite a number of the individual die-cut player figures from that game -- assuming we're talking
about the same game -- did come up at auction last November, with most of those going off between $10. and
$15. apiece, a couple going substantially higher.

The only relatively complete example of the game we've seen sold in an REA auction a little over three years ago,
but it's nearly impossible to put a price on the game based on that auction -- it was grouped with four other
very tough games, including a complete "blue Lajoie" edition of Parker Brothers' *National-American Base Ball
Game
,* which alone surely accounted for at least $400.-$500. of the lot's nonetheless exorbitant $2100. hammer
price, and the extremely scarce "Tim Jordan" card game. The gameboard / playing field alone, in somewhat
rough shape, earned only $36. on eBay last summer. We'd expect a relatively complete *Major League Ball*
in nice condition to do significantly better than the sum of those separate parts.

Let us know for sure if we're discussing the game you have or if we're barking up the wrong tree -- and
in either case, we'd really appreciate seeing some photos of what you've got there. Send those along,
if you can, to webmaster Butch [ Butch7999(at)aol.com ].

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "r.hodges67" wrote:
<< I own a baseball board game from the 1920's called Major Leage Ball - The Indoor Game Supreme.
I am having a tough time determining market value as I have yet to see a complete game set in the market
- the only thing I have seen in the market is some of the individual players.... Have you seen anything like this
in the market? Any idea as to it's value? Appreciate any info you can provide.
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5499 Fri Aug 28, 2009 12:42 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: 1968 topps baseball game set

Howdy Jose, thanks for the question! Hopefully a more authoritaive voice will chime in on this one, but
we've always assumed the '68 Topps set is a simple draw game -- shuffle the cards, place 'em face down,
draw the cards one at a time until half an inning is completed, then shuffle the whole deck again and
start another half-inning. If there's more to it than that, we'd like to know...

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "jose59g" wrote:
<< hello all, i own the '68 topps baseball game set(33 cards).
i'm wondering if anyone is familiar with the game instructions? thanx...
>>
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5500 Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:24 pm
"jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.net>
"Be A Manager" question, can anyone help?

Hi
As a kid my brothers and I played a game called "Be A Manager" I believe the game was published by
Simon Marder? This game was circa 1966 and contained the national league teams only. Is there anyone out there
with knowledge of this game or where I can get my hands on a complete copy? I would greatly appreciate it.
Thanks,
Jim
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5501 Sun Aug 30, 2009 12:10 am
"butch7999" <Butch7999(at)aol.com>
Re: "Be A Manager" question, can anyone help?

Howdy Jim, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Well, good news and bad news for ya --
the game is out there to be had, but it's one of the most in-demand items you could look for and you'll
probably have to pay a very pretty penny to re-obtain one.

For the record -- your memory is good, you have the title correct and the game was designed by Si Marder,
but it was actually produced by Bamco, in 1967, with both National and American League card sets available
in separate editions. Reportedly, updated card sets were produced in 1969 and 1971 as well.

*Be A Manager* shows up on eBay about twice a year on average. Prepare now for sticker shock:
the average price over the last several years has been well over $300., and that price seems to be escalating.
The last three complete examples we've seen there, all in 2008, went for $330., $566., and $671. An example
in rather rough condition and missing a couple dozen of the original 200 cards did sell for "just" $120. at
Lelands last year. We may have missed a sale or auction or two over the past few months, so we welcome
any updated prices the other members here can contribute.

We know that several members of this group are lucky owners of the game, but we couldn't say whether
any of them would be willing to part with it. They can contact you off-list if they wish. Anything else
you need to know, just ask!

B, K, & W
Baseball Games
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/

--- "jim_whitty123" wrote:
<< ... As a kid my brothers and I played a game called "Be A Manager" I believe the game was published by
Simon Marder? This game was circa 1966 and contained the national league teams only. Is there anyone out there
with knowledge of this game or where I can get my hands on a complete copy? I would greatly appreciate it....
>>
_______________________________________________

To reply to a message or post a new message at Baseballgames,
visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/baseballgames/
on the web and click on "Post" in the lefthand menu, or simply
send your e-mail to baseballgames(at)yahoogroups.com
_______________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Message #5502 Sun Aug 30, 2009 11:16 pm
"jim_whitty123" <jimwhitty(at)comcast.net>
Re: re: "Be A Manager" question, can anyone help?

Thanks for the info Butch. I appreciate your help.
Jim

--- "butch7999" wrote:
> Howdy Jim, welcome to the group and thanks for your question! Well, good news and bad news for ya --
> the game is out there to be had, but it's one of the most in-demand items you could look for and you'll
> probably have to pay a very pretty penny to re-obtain one. For the record... it was actually produced by
> Bamco, in 1967, with both National and American League card sets available in separate editions....
> *Be A Manager* shows up on eBay about twice a year on average. Prepare now for sticker shock: the
> average price over the last several years has been well over $300., and that price seems to be escalating....
>
________________________________________________________________________________________________
Like
Share