Christian Nudist Resort-My thoughts

Christian Nudist Resort-My thoughts

Willbtan
Willbtan

October 28th, 2006, 2:39 pm #1

The recent attempt by Boyd and others to establish a Christian Nudist Community reminded me of thoughts I have had on this subject. So these comments are not directed entirely at this attempt, but rather the idea in general.
In Genesis 1:28 after God had created man and woman, He said:"Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it..." From the beginning, God had an ultimate purpose for man and that was to fill the earth with people who worship Him.
In Genesis 11 we find the account of the Tower of Babel. In verse 3 it says: "Then they said to one another, ""Come,let us make bricks and bake them thoroughly."" They had brick of stone, and they had asphalt for mortar. And they said, "Come,let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth."
The problem here is that God wanted the whole earth to know Him and worship Him, but this group found a place they liked and wanted to stay. By using baked bricks, they were intent on a long stay. This did not please God. They built their tower as their way of reaching God and heaven, this did not please God. So God confused them, by giving them different languages. They could no longer communicate with each other, and the result was that God scattered them, v8, "So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city." God had man back on track for His purpose, to fill the earth with believers who worship Him.
I know that it is not easy living in this world. So much evil and hatred. Believers face a tough time when we try to live out our faith in a sin sick world. We have a trend, where Christian families are taking their children out of public school to home school, or go to a Christian school. I don't believe that it is God's intention for us to withdraw from the world, but go to the world with the Gospel of Christ. How will the world know unless someone tells and live their lives before the world?
If we start a Christian nudist resort, I am sure many Christian Naturists, would be attracted. I would be attracted to a place where I could be nude most of the time and in fellowship with other nude believers. But think about where the residents would come from: Florida, Michigan, California, other countries,for example. Now we have taken a Christian witness from many places and put them behind walls together. Are we not then like the people at the Tower of Babel?
Finally, when Jesus was about to ascend to heaven, His last words were,Acts 1:8, "But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."
Quote
Share

Joined: July 19th, 2004, 1:25 am

October 28th, 2006, 4:56 pm #2


Excellent post! Interestingly, I wrote the following yesterday, planning to post it here ASAP (which happens to be now).

Hello friends,

Earlier, there was some discussion about the Lord answering our prayers versus those praying against us. Since Natura isn't going to happen now, what would you say about that? Would you say that the Lord answered their prayers and not ours, and if so, what does that mean?

One thing that concerns me is, it seems as though every major endeavor like this seems to fail. I first thought about how NLI repeatedly tried to do various things but never had the success they wanted, and now we have these failed plans.

So, although I have no doubt about my beliefs or practices concerning nudity, I'm wondered where God is in all of this. Is He really for naturism, or is He against it? Is the enemy just getting the victory each time, or what? Is our timing off? Is He trying to point us in another direction? Maybe He doesn't want resorts, clubs, etc. specifically for or about Christians, but He wants us mixing and mingling with those who need Him. Who knows? So many questions.

I think He is definitely in Christian naturism. Just look at how our numbers keep growing. I just find myself wondering about our situation. And I admit, I kind of got started on this by wondering why my wife and I cannot seem to reconcile our differences. I mean, God is capable of helping us doing that, but it hasn't happened. He's capable of changing either one of our minds or both, but He hasn't. So, as Christian naturists, including myself, struggle to move forward, often unsuccessfully, I find myself wondering, what the Lord is trying to accomplish? I know He ultimately wants to develop our character and our relationship with Him, but beyond that, what's up?

As I told one friend, I personally care less how society or fellow believers see us, and more about whether I'm staying in step with the Lord or not, because staying in step with Him is the most important thing. Maybe I'm merely expressing my personal struggle to find my way and my place, but I do see how Christian naturism struggles similarly in general.



Greg C
http://www.geocities.com/greg_pc/
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

October 28th, 2006, 7:40 pm #3

Greg and Willbetan,

You and many of us have had these exact same concerns.

One brought up the validity of having a resort, comparing it to the Tower of Babel.

First of all, we were not building this to draw ourselves closer to heaven, trying to build a special name for ourselves, in place of God. Many towers were made since then, most to other gods.

What were we trying to do? Establish not only a home resort, but a place where we can allow Christian naturists to be Christian. We were not going to isolationists, cutting ourselves off from the world. No man is an island, no man stands alone.

We were going to be witnesses in the community and an outreach to those who need special services. We were not going to shut ourselves off and thumb our noses to the world. God would not stand for that. The last thing we needed to do was to look "cultish".

However, that plan has not failed. It may not be in Belton, then again, we have not ruled out Belton 100%.

We have new plans that will start us off with a "non-landed" club type environment leading to a landed club with a wider and stronger support than we had.

Our first ministry is to the people of the naturist community, specifically the Christains here. Next, is to support these Christian naturists in their clothed community. We end up by our support and example, reach the non-Christian naturists, whome we wanted to reach in the first place.

We also support and reach out to our clothed bretheren in our churches and communities.

There was a lot more to this Belton community than the average public knew. We were just trying to get the ground work done so we can get our foot into an area like this.

Greg's question and concern was, is God really supporting our naturism in the first place?

Often God works with us in strange ways. God answers prayers according to your faith. God is not worked up over whether one person is a naturist and the other is not. What God is concerned with is how we react to it.

It does seem that the naturist always has to "give in" to the demands of the misunderstanding person. They seem to have the physical law on their side and they have no problem whatsoever making demands that are literally, relationally destructive.

When people do not want to reason, fear is the first thing that shows up. Of course, you cannot tell that to this person, any more than you can tell that to Adam and Eve, who felt justified. "Of course we are afraid, we are supposed to be!, You should be too" is the expected answer.

God's reasoning and mans reasoning is not just two worlds apart, they are in opposite universes!

So we plan to start something different, and hopefully, carry out our plans in the mean time to create that nice resort we all want. But will that resort be only for Christians? No, of course not. First, we are reaching out to the world, and second, we need the financial support of others as well.

So keep with us, join us, pray for us, or do all the above. But we will not be ignored.

BTW, I am working on getting the CNC (Christian Nudist Convocation) started back up again!




Boyd Allen
"May the Lord protect our nudity from the sight of those who will not benefit, and may he allow us to be seen by those who will."

Quote
Like
Share

Michael
Michael

October 29th, 2006, 1:02 am #4

It is sad that all the hopes for the resort at Belton did not go forward as desired. I do know that other naturist clubs/resorts also face exactly the same hostility from the commuity. I happen to be a member of one such club that has been locked in legal battles for years with the county. This has radically deminished all the potential that could have otherwise been realized.

I am not convinced that hostility toward naturism is in some way God's judgment against naturism, or any particular location for a club. I'm not convinced that the opposition from other Christians is anything more than kneejerk reactions. I would note the words of wisdom from the great theologian, Garth Brooks, "Thank God for unanswered prayers." Who knows? I'm not convinced that the opposition of a spouse says anything from God about the appropriateness of naturism. He does however, care a lot about spouses honoring each other in the bond of love.

As I recall, Jesus offended his audience by noting that their fathers had killed the prophets. I also note that Jesus was killed as were most of the apostles, not to mention over two hundred years of intermittent persecution by Rome. That there was opposition isn't proof of God's disfavor in any of these cases. I do suspect that those involved got sick and tired of all the harrassment, but they kept going. Didn't Jesus warn us about this?

I would say that if there is anything to learn it's that you shouldn't try to locate right next to a town, but that's no guarantee either. Given the nature of the South--and a lot of other places, being upfront about your purpose does not gain you any favor at all. I hope the non-landed approach succeeds in gaining the numbers you need to try again. Michael
Quote
Share

Jon-Marc
Jon-Marc

October 29th, 2006, 1:27 am #5

The recent attempt by Boyd and others to establish a Christian Nudist Community reminded me of thoughts I have had on this subject. So these comments are not directed entirely at this attempt, but rather the idea in general.
In Genesis 1:28 after God had created man and woman, He said:"Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it..." From the beginning, God had an ultimate purpose for man and that was to fill the earth with people who worship Him.
In Genesis 11 we find the account of the Tower of Babel. In verse 3 it says: "Then they said to one another, ""Come,let us make bricks and bake them thoroughly."" They had brick of stone, and they had asphalt for mortar. And they said, "Come,let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth."
The problem here is that God wanted the whole earth to know Him and worship Him, but this group found a place they liked and wanted to stay. By using baked bricks, they were intent on a long stay. This did not please God. They built their tower as their way of reaching God and heaven, this did not please God. So God confused them, by giving them different languages. They could no longer communicate with each other, and the result was that God scattered them, v8, "So the Lord scattered them abroad from there over the face of all the earth, and they ceased building the city." God had man back on track for His purpose, to fill the earth with believers who worship Him.
I know that it is not easy living in this world. So much evil and hatred. Believers face a tough time when we try to live out our faith in a sin sick world. We have a trend, where Christian families are taking their children out of public school to home school, or go to a Christian school. I don't believe that it is God's intention for us to withdraw from the world, but go to the world with the Gospel of Christ. How will the world know unless someone tells and live their lives before the world?
If we start a Christian nudist resort, I am sure many Christian Naturists, would be attracted. I would be attracted to a place where I could be nude most of the time and in fellowship with other nude believers. But think about where the residents would come from: Florida, Michigan, California, other countries,for example. Now we have taken a Christian witness from many places and put them behind walls together. Are we not then like the people at the Tower of Babel?
Finally, when Jesus was about to ascend to heaven, His last words were,Acts 1:8, "But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth."
I do not believe that God has anything against a Christian naturist community. There are so few Christian naturists compared to all of the naturists that I stay mostly by myself since I have nothing in common with most other naturists. It would be great to live in a community where I can actually talk about the Bible and not hear the name of God and Jesus Christ as cuss words as I do here. Even those who are willing to talk about God and the Bible can't seem to refrain from using profanity.

It's a language that I consider very immature and something that only people with weak minds and limited vocabulary need. I quit using profanity when I was 16 and outgrew it mentally and emotionally.

My belief is that God has a place for you where you won't have the opposition. It will happen if it's His will as I believe it is. Of course, that could just be wishful thinking. Just because Natura failed here and in Belton doesn't mean God isn't in it. It just possibly means that He has something else planned. Patience and pray are in order.
Quote
Share

Joined: July 19th, 2004, 1:25 am

October 29th, 2006, 1:30 am #6

Greg and Willbetan,

You and many of us have had these exact same concerns.

One brought up the validity of having a resort, comparing it to the Tower of Babel.

First of all, we were not building this to draw ourselves closer to heaven, trying to build a special name for ourselves, in place of God. Many towers were made since then, most to other gods.

What were we trying to do? Establish not only a home resort, but a place where we can allow Christian naturists to be Christian. We were not going to isolationists, cutting ourselves off from the world. No man is an island, no man stands alone.

We were going to be witnesses in the community and an outreach to those who need special services. We were not going to shut ourselves off and thumb our noses to the world. God would not stand for that. The last thing we needed to do was to look "cultish".

However, that plan has not failed. It may not be in Belton, then again, we have not ruled out Belton 100%.

We have new plans that will start us off with a "non-landed" club type environment leading to a landed club with a wider and stronger support than we had.

Our first ministry is to the people of the naturist community, specifically the Christains here. Next, is to support these Christian naturists in their clothed community. We end up by our support and example, reach the non-Christian naturists, whome we wanted to reach in the first place.

We also support and reach out to our clothed bretheren in our churches and communities.

There was a lot more to this Belton community than the average public knew. We were just trying to get the ground work done so we can get our foot into an area like this.

Greg's question and concern was, is God really supporting our naturism in the first place?

Often God works with us in strange ways. God answers prayers according to your faith. God is not worked up over whether one person is a naturist and the other is not. What God is concerned with is how we react to it.

It does seem that the naturist always has to "give in" to the demands of the misunderstanding person. They seem to have the physical law on their side and they have no problem whatsoever making demands that are literally, relationally destructive.

When people do not want to reason, fear is the first thing that shows up. Of course, you cannot tell that to this person, any more than you can tell that to Adam and Eve, who felt justified. "Of course we are afraid, we are supposed to be!, You should be too" is the expected answer.

God's reasoning and mans reasoning is not just two worlds apart, they are in opposite universes!

So we plan to start something different, and hopefully, carry out our plans in the mean time to create that nice resort we all want. But will that resort be only for Christians? No, of course not. First, we are reaching out to the world, and second, we need the financial support of others as well.

So keep with us, join us, pray for us, or do all the above. But we will not be ignored.

BTW, I am working on getting the CNC (Christian Nudist Convocation) started back up again!




Boyd Allen
"May the Lord protect our nudity from the sight of those who will not benefit, and may he allow us to be seen by those who will."

All of this is good discussion. What I offered was in no way saying that I doubted God's involvement, but it was mostly meant to be rhetorical, going to extremes, considering every possibility, all to get us thinking. I admit, I have had my doubts in the past, but it was mostly a result of frustation, dealing with a wife who totally misunderstands and doesn't even want to understand.

Anyway, the bottom line is that we stay in step with where the Lord is leading, regardless what happens, what others think, say or do. And that is where I question. If not "here" (wherever that is), then where, Lord? If not in this way, then how? Etc. This has been a real challenge for me personally, given my situation, especially my desire to do more, but being unable to because of circumstances beyond my control.


Greg C
http://www.geocities.com/greg_pc/
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

October 29th, 2006, 10:53 am #7

It is sad that all the hopes for the resort at Belton did not go forward as desired. I do know that other naturist clubs/resorts also face exactly the same hostility from the commuity. I happen to be a member of one such club that has been locked in legal battles for years with the county. This has radically deminished all the potential that could have otherwise been realized.

I am not convinced that hostility toward naturism is in some way God's judgment against naturism, or any particular location for a club. I'm not convinced that the opposition from other Christians is anything more than kneejerk reactions. I would note the words of wisdom from the great theologian, Garth Brooks, "Thank God for unanswered prayers." Who knows? I'm not convinced that the opposition of a spouse says anything from God about the appropriateness of naturism. He does however, care a lot about spouses honoring each other in the bond of love.

As I recall, Jesus offended his audience by noting that their fathers had killed the prophets. I also note that Jesus was killed as were most of the apostles, not to mention over two hundred years of intermittent persecution by Rome. That there was opposition isn't proof of God's disfavor in any of these cases. I do suspect that those involved got sick and tired of all the harrassment, but they kept going. Didn't Jesus warn us about this?

I would say that if there is anything to learn it's that you shouldn't try to locate right next to a town, but that's no guarantee either. Given the nature of the South--and a lot of other places, being upfront about your purpose does not gain you any favor at all. I hope the non-landed approach succeeds in gaining the numbers you need to try again. Michael
Great analogy that we will face persecutions.

But funny thing is, it wasn't the county or the people who stopped it! In fact, the last encounter with the public was hardly an encounter at all. It was very disappointing to the news media because a "Geralto" type fiasco didnt' flair up, it was not only peaceful, but a great QA session that ended with everyone satisfied!

So what hit the fan? Bill Martin pulled out because of disagreements with the team that was asked to carry it out! Period. He was dogged by his accusers in Florida that got us mixed up in their dog fight because he was associated with us. We asked them to back out and leave us alone because Bill was only an advisor, not a member of the board! Bill got mad and told us that he wants to be a member of the board even though he told others as well as us that he was only an advisor. With all this mix up, back and forth frustration, we told him if he keeps threatening to take his money out, then by all means, do so.

So it was the naturist community that dragged us down, not the clothed community! We knew we were going to get opposition from the county, city and or people. But not within!

Bill pulled his money and his support out within two days after we got this great news! We cut ties with him, and we'll do it again, only this time with lessons learned.

However, we discussed this amongst ourselves and decided that God may very well have answered out prayers about this as well. We asked that it was God's will that we be down there. I specifically asked "If it is not your will that we be down there, then please pull us out quickly, not let us spend all this money and time". And he did. Did it hurt? You bet. Poor "happy2beadam" and his wife were disappointed no end. I told him, "Good thing you didn't go down to see the property, you would have been bawling your eyes out!"

But we move forward with more determination than ever. Gods will be done!

So lets not continue to cry over this or to feel we have been "persecuted". Of course we'll be persecuted, we expected that. But it will be done.

In a week, we'll probably have a whole new outline and plan come to focus and when it happens, it will be fast! And it will probably be slow too, since God likes to take his time (If a day is like a thousand years, look out when God says "allow me a day to get it done")


Boyd Allen
"May the Lord protect our nudity from the sight of those who will not benefit, and may he allow us to be seen by those who will."

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

October 29th, 2006, 10:56 am #8

All of this is good discussion. What I offered was in no way saying that I doubted God's involvement, but it was mostly meant to be rhetorical, going to extremes, considering every possibility, all to get us thinking. I admit, I have had my doubts in the past, but it was mostly a result of frustation, dealing with a wife who totally misunderstands and doesn't even want to understand.

Anyway, the bottom line is that we stay in step with where the Lord is leading, regardless what happens, what others think, say or do. And that is where I question. If not "here" (wherever that is), then where, Lord? If not in this way, then how? Etc. This has been a real challenge for me personally, given my situation, especially my desire to do more, but being unable to because of circumstances beyond my control.


Greg C
http://www.geocities.com/greg_pc/
Greg, I fully appreciate and understand your situation! I feel that so much, it's a bit scary at times.

But Gwin is beginning to see the light, and I am sure that if you continue to LOVE your wife, be patient and kind, she will at least understand your situation as well.

"Love your wife as God loved the church."


Boyd Allen
"May the Lord protect our nudity from the sight of those who will not benefit, and may he allow us to be seen by those who will."

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

October 29th, 2006, 11:00 am #9

I do not believe that God has anything against a Christian naturist community. There are so few Christian naturists compared to all of the naturists that I stay mostly by myself since I have nothing in common with most other naturists. It would be great to live in a community where I can actually talk about the Bible and not hear the name of God and Jesus Christ as cuss words as I do here. Even those who are willing to talk about God and the Bible can't seem to refrain from using profanity.

It's a language that I consider very immature and something that only people with weak minds and limited vocabulary need. I quit using profanity when I was 16 and outgrew it mentally and emotionally.

My belief is that God has a place for you where you won't have the opposition. It will happen if it's His will as I believe it is. Of course, that could just be wishful thinking. Just because Natura failed here and in Belton doesn't mean God isn't in it. It just possibly means that He has something else planned. Patience and pray are in order.
Thats the attitude we need here!
We need to ask God how HE wants it done!

I am asking the Board that we remove the "Natura" name out of the project since it does belong to Bill and we need to fully disassociate ourselves from that project.

Natura is still in Florida and now that he is not scattering his efforts accross the country, maybe he will get the Florida effort under way after all. I sure hope God blesses him and gives him what he needs in life to complete his dream.


Boyd Allen
"May the Lord protect our nudity from the sight of those who will not benefit, and may he allow us to be seen by those who will."

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: July 19th, 2004, 1:25 am

October 29th, 2006, 1:22 pm #10

I do not believe that God has anything against a Christian naturist community. There are so few Christian naturists compared to all of the naturists that I stay mostly by myself since I have nothing in common with most other naturists. It would be great to live in a community where I can actually talk about the Bible and not hear the name of God and Jesus Christ as cuss words as I do here. Even those who are willing to talk about God and the Bible can't seem to refrain from using profanity.

It's a language that I consider very immature and something that only people with weak minds and limited vocabulary need. I quit using profanity when I was 16 and outgrew it mentally and emotionally.

My belief is that God has a place for you where you won't have the opposition. It will happen if it's His will as I believe it is. Of course, that could just be wishful thinking. Just because Natura failed here and in Belton doesn't mean God isn't in it. It just possibly means that He has something else planned. Patience and pray are in order.
Jon-Marc: "It just possibly means that He has something else planned. Patience and pray are in order.

Boyd Allen: "Thats the attitude we need here! We need to ask God how HE wants it done!"

To me, we've all said the same thing. Although I went about it the long way, going through the entire thought process, I concluded with the same point...that when our efforts don't seem to work out one way, maybe the Lord is pointing us in another direction (not away from naturism altogether, but just to do it a different way).


Greg C
http://www.geocities.com/greg_pc/
Quote
Like
Share