Phenotypes of Hunters and Farmers

12:45 PM - May 13, 2014 #1 2014-05-13T12:45

Here's what we know from anthropology and genetics:

Hunters had broad faces, dark skin, light eyes and were intermediate between Western and Eastern Eurasians. So I chose a Uralic Norwegian Lapp that I darkened and gave blue eyes.

Farmers had narrow faces, light skin, dark eyes and were Western Eurasian, closest to modern Sardinians. So I chose an untanned, long-faced Mediterranean soccer player from Sardinia.

Mixing between these two types in different proportions in both ancient and recent times, as well as further depigmentation in some places, created the phenotypic variation we see in Europe today.

jalu · 1:10 PM - May 13, 2014 #2 2014-05-13T13:10

Good hypothesis. The noses seem to look extreme. Hunter nose seems too flat. The farmer nose is too sharp and looks mountain type, where I doubt farming originated.

Peachmelba · 1:13 PM - May 13, 2014 #3 2014-05-13T13:13

What is mountain type? just ask

Maeve · 1:18 PM - May 13, 2014 #4 2014-05-13T13:18

The Easter Eurasian are racially mixed.

They look quite different .

There are strange racial mixtures there

Faravid · 1:28 PM - May 13, 2014 #5 2014-05-13T13:28

They are very similar to the ones I've always imagined.

AnthroCurious · 3:26 PM - May 13, 2014 #6 2014-05-13T15:26

Genetically, in terms of the present day East-West affinities, the La Brana / Loschbour HG people, how intermediate they were, we can use projected samples from current world PCA to estimate this:

- from the supplement of the newest Lazaridis paper

- from Davidski's Eurogenes Project (https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9o3EY ... sp=sharing for a zoomble version)

- from an early draft from a paper reported by Dienekes in 2012.

There's some differences, but it seems like they are in line with having a bit more Asian affinity than Finns, about the same as Balochis or Kalash or Brahui people, and are closer to the Finns in their level of East Asian affinity than they are for'ex, Uighurs.

Based on this genetic distance, I expect their phenotype difference from the farmers of the time was on a similar level to the present day Balochi-Sardinian difference, in its size, and a bit more than the present day difference from Sardinians-Finns. Could've been more though.

Reconstructions from Mesolithic Europe generally don't look as extreme as RR's hunter image, although he is definitely right about the wider faces (not sure that Mesolithics had wider noses). But there is a degree of interpretation in them that might bias the reconstructers towards current phenotypes.

3:31 PM - May 13, 2014 #7 2014-05-13T15:31

The La Brana reconstruction drawing was dumb, looked like a generic homeless bum , even somehow modeled on Gerard Butler oddly enough. La Brana's Y chromosome and mtDNA are strange as well, noticed some authors attempting to tie them into Basque but the markers and placement are un-Basque and way outside of modern Europe.

catman savastano · 6:03 PM - May 13, 2014 #8 2014-05-13T18:03

what were la brana's y chromosome haplotype and mtDNA ?

7:09 PM - May 13, 2014 #9 2014-05-13T19:09

http://dienekes.blogspot.com/2012/06/me ... ntero.html

catman savastano · 7:23 PM - May 13, 2014 #10 2014-05-13T19:23

http://forwhattheywereweare.blogspot.co ... y-dna.html

he was U5b2c1, and Y chromo C6...very rare in modern europe

The Baron · 7:39 PM - May 13, 2014 #11 2014-05-13T19:39

Weren't Uralics originally brown-eyed too?

TiManel · 8:02 PM - May 13, 2014 #12 2014-05-13T20:02

Was that La Brana reconstruction based on the actual skull of La Brana and following scientific accepted methods?

It´s surely interesting and exciting, to have many details about a Mesolithic hunter, but maybe we
shouldn´t take many conclusions based on only one specimen, either phenotypically or genetically.

During the Epipaleolithic, it were identified (at least) 3 different mtDNA haplogroups, only in Portugal.

And in other area of Iberia (Muge), during the same period (Mesolithic), the hunter-gatherers skeletal assemblage indicated the presence of coarse-med/protomediterranean/cromagnoid people.

Sena Alesailendra · 9:37 PM - May 13, 2014 #13 2014-05-13T21:37

The Baron wrote:Weren't Uralics originally brown-eyed too?

I heard 99% of people in Estonia have blue eyes and light hair

Nosebiter · 1:34 AM - May 14, 2014 #14 2014-05-14T01:34

Id expect the hunter phenotype to be paler than it is, and would a population from the Caucasus be a more accurate example for what the farmer looked like. Europe was peopled by more than 2 group. There were 3 main groups including EEF, WHG and ANE, where would the WHG fit in when it came to those 2 phenotypes

Duskfall · 1:41 AM - May 14, 2014 #15 2014-05-14T01:41

Nosebiter wrote:Id expect the hunter phenotype to be paler than it is, and would a population from the Caucasus be a more accurate example for what the farmer looked like. Europe was peopled by more than 2 group. There were 3 main groups including EEF, WHG and ANE, where would the WHG fit in when it came to those 2 phenotypes

Old Cro-Magnon man