Pearls swine, dogs holy

Pearls swine, dogs holy

Joined: May 4th, 2005, 1:31 pm

July 27th, 2010, 2:55 pm #1

Below the verse was quoted regarding not giving what is holy to dogs nor pearls to swine.

Now we can take that literally. Which doesn't make much sense, or allegorically. But if allegorically how do you reconcile spreading the gospel, with that verse?

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: July 1st, 2008, 11:52 pm

July 27th, 2010, 2:58 pm #2

I give what is holy (spiritual things) to dogs (carnal minds) and pearls (Israel) to pigs (desires for earthly things-wallowing in the mud):

but I also know there are others here, those who are seeking and looking for the truth and perhaps these will hear something to stimulate a deeper desire than the carnal ones we all have to overcome as our only reality:

every day is a new day to die to the old and live to the newness of life
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: May 4th, 2005, 1:31 pm

July 27th, 2010, 3:03 pm #3

The command is to NOT do that.

That's what I was trying to understand. How to reconcile that command with the command to spread the word. They seem to be contradictory ..

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: July 1st, 2008, 11:52 pm

July 27th, 2010, 3:43 pm #4

it is a warning of what will happen if we do this, but Jesus was talking to everyone and knew only those who had spiritual organs would hear him:



since he is within those he speaks to, the others who read the Bible only do not necessarily have him within and will not hear what he says to us in the Spirit; if we speak of it, we are opening ourselves up to ridicule and persecution; Jesus said if they hated me they will hate you, so how can we bring the GOSPEL (good news that this happened to us) and not bring it at the same time?

it is also a way to overcome your own weaknesses, learn how to judge with righteous judgment when you speak to those who can't hear you along with those who may be able to hear you:

till we understand that God is no respector of persons and that we didn't deserve God anymore than another person does or doesnt deserve him, we will feel others as persecuters


only when we are ready to love those who hate us, can we rejoice because we have found the HIGHEST LEVEL we can go to: So its all good:



Mat 7:1 ¶ Judge not, that ye be not judged.


Mat 7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.


Mat 7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?


Mat 7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam [is] in thine own eye?


Mat 7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.


Mat 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.


ME: notice that the order came with a warning of what happens if you do this, thats all:

Jesus continues...

Mat 7:7 ¶ Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:


Mat 7:8 For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.


Mat 7:9 Or what man is there of you, whom if his son ask bread, will he give him a stone?


Mat 7:10 Or if he ask a fish, will he give him a serpent?


Mat 7:11 If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children, how much more shall your Father which is in heaven give good things to them that ask him?


Mat 7:12 Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets.


Mat 7:13 ¶ Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide [is] the gate, and broad [is] the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:


ME: the strait gate is the one made of ONE PEARL and these one is the pearl of great price that the "lesser pearls" (ISRAEL) gave up to become one with...since the 12 gates into the holy city are made of ONE PEARL divided into 12 parts...




Mat 7:14 Because strait [is] the gate, and narrow [is] the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


Mat 7:15 ¶ Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.


ME: Saul was a false prophet a wolf in sheeps clothing till he had an encounter with Jesus, and he changed him from head to toe, even his name from Saul to Paul:

a wolf seeks for sheep and sheep are desires for God; so they want to want to know God but the best they can do is eat the sheep (desires for God) which are in others:





Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?


Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.


Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither [can] a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.


Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.


Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.


Mat 7:21 ¶ Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.


ME: what is the "will of his father"??

Jesus explains it is the will of the one that sent him that WORKS in him....


Jhn 5:30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

ME: those who do the same thing are his mother, brother and sister...

Mat 12:50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.


Mar 3:35 For whosoever shall do the will of God, the same is my brother, and my sister, and mother.


so what is the WILL OF GOD?



Hbr 10:5 ¶ Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:


Hbr 10:6 In burnt offerings and [sacrifices] for sin thou hast had no pleasure.


Hbr 10:7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) (((to do thy will, O God)))).


Hbr 10:8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and [offering] for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure [therein]; which are offered by the law;


Hbr 10:9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.


Hbr 10:10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once [for all].


Hbr 10:11 ¶ And every priest standeth daily ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins:


Hbr 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;


Hbr 10:13 From henceforth expecting till his enemies be made his footstool.


Hbr 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.


Hbr 10:15 [Whereof] the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,


Hbr 10:16 This [is] the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;


Hbr 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.


Hbr 10:18 Now where remission of these [is, there is] no more offering for sin.


Hbr 10:19 ¶ Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus,


ME: so the will of God is to accept this NEW COVENANT WITH GOD which is accepting the LAW to be written within the heart and mind.......to receive a new heart and a new mind...

back to Mathew 7.....and being his mother, brother and sister because of doing the will of the father....which is to receive the NEW COVENANT....


Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?


Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


Mat 7:24 ¶ Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:


ME: so doing the will of the FAther includes not just hearing but DOING...letting the WORD be engrafted into the heart...in order to have a NEW FOUNDATION, have a LAWFUL (law fulfilled) heart and mind:

Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.


Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:


Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.


Mat 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:


Mat 7:29 For he taught them as [one] having authority, and not as the scribes.

every day is a new day to die to the old and live to the newness of life
Quote
Like
Share

JB
JB

July 27th, 2010, 8:38 pm #5

Below the verse was quoted regarding not giving what is holy to dogs nor pearls to swine.

Now we can take that literally. Which doesn't make much sense, or allegorically. But if allegorically how do you reconcile spreading the gospel, with that verse?
and we are currently seeing a 'pack mentality' here. Spirituality is a personal thing but gang mentality says don't think think for yourself just think and do like us. Those who move on in God will often go through trails and tribulations - these are the things that shape the heart so that it can help fellow sojourners on the same path. The new heart is like a pearl it has been formed often through suffering. That being the case why would you want to open your heart to those who can only grunt? JB
Quote
Share

Joined: December 8th, 2003, 1:16 am

July 27th, 2010, 8:49 pm #6

Below the verse was quoted regarding not giving what is holy to dogs nor pearls to swine.

Now we can take that literally. Which doesn't make much sense, or allegorically. But if allegorically how do you reconcile spreading the gospel, with that verse?
Because THAT spreading of the gospel, spoken of in the NTestament was exoteric. It was understood that the inner mysteries -which were not supposed to be shared publicly- were to be reserved for the inner enlightened group. If those inner mysteries were shared publicly, it was equivalent to throwing pearls before swine.

You could even argue that Paul's letters to the churches were never intended to be shared with the world at large. They were specifically addressed to the churches.

-Vince
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: May 4th, 2005, 1:31 pm

July 27th, 2010, 8:53 pm #7

Yea.

Spreading the Gospel -- that's the outer mysteries, the "hook". That's for all.

Spreading the Pearls - the inner mysteries. Only for the initiates. Not for dogs or swine.

That certainly reconciles the two "commands".

Quote
Like
Share

Joined: December 8th, 2003, 1:16 am

July 27th, 2010, 8:54 pm #8

and we are currently seeing a 'pack mentality' here. Spirituality is a personal thing but gang mentality says don't think think for yourself just think and do like us. Those who move on in God will often go through trails and tribulations - these are the things that shape the heart so that it can help fellow sojourners on the same path. The new heart is like a pearl it has been formed often through suffering. That being the case why would you want to open your heart to those who can only grunt? JB
As long as you don't blame the "dogs" or hold them in contempt for not comprehending your own special "wisdom." After all, you don't believe they CAN understand so ....... if you get mad about their behavior .... you're only admitting a weakness or "breach" in your own fortification. In other words, there's something wrong with you or your beliefs if you can't explain yourself satisfactorily and then get mad about it.

-Vince
Quote
Like
Share

Joined: May 4th, 2005, 1:31 pm

July 27th, 2010, 8:56 pm #9

And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.

~Matthew 15:27

In context:

Matthew 15

1Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,

2Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

3But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

4For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

5But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

6And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

7Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

8This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

9But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

10And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:

11Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

12Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

13But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

14Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

15Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

16And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

17Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

18But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

19For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

20These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

21Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.

22And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil.

23But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us.

24But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

25Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me.

26But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs.

27And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table.

28Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

29And Jesus departed from thence, and came nigh unto the sea of Galilee; and went up into a mountain, and sat down there.

30And great multitudes came unto him, having with them those that were lame, blind, dumb, maimed, and many others, and cast them down at Jesus' feet; and he healed them:

31Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see: and they glorified the God of Israel.

32Then Jesus called his disciples unto him, and said, I have compassion on the multitude, because they continue with me now three days, and have nothing to eat: and I will not send them away fasting, lest they faint in the way.

33And his disciples say unto him, Whence should we have so much bread in the wilderness, as to fill so great a multitude?

34And Jesus saith unto them, How many loaves have ye? And they said, Seven, and a few little fishes.

35And he commanded the multitude to sit down on the ground.

36And he took the seven loaves and the fishes, and gave thanks, and brake them, and gave to his disciples, and the disciples to the multitude.

37And they did all eat, and were filled: and they took up of the broken meat that was left seven baskets full.

38And they that did eat were four thousand men, beside women and children.

39And he sent away the multitude, and took ship, and came into the coasts of Magdala.
Quote
Like
Share

JB
JB

July 27th, 2010, 9:01 pm #10

As long as you don't blame the "dogs" or hold them in contempt for not comprehending your own special "wisdom." After all, you don't believe they CAN understand so ....... if you get mad about their behavior .... you're only admitting a weakness or "breach" in your own fortification. In other words, there's something wrong with you or your beliefs if you can't explain yourself satisfactorily and then get mad about it.

-Vince
If God does not spoonfeed you then you toss the bib. JB
Quote
Share