Let's talk Kenpo!

Let's talk Kenpo!

Joined: March 10th, 2008, 4:57 am

June 25th, 2009, 7:25 pm #1

Ok, I am not usually one to start a thread on here but tire of some of the stuff that we seem to spend too much time on as I am sure others do also. So let me ask a question that may help someone somewhere in their journey.

With all of the principles and concepts that exist in the kenpo system or the Arts for that matter, and all of the information there is to draw on, what in your opinion and experience would be the three most likely candidates (principle or concept) for importance to the laymen for self-defense in a combat situation?

Let me elaborate, let's say you have three weeks to work with a guy and off he goes never to be seen again. you want him/her to be able to defend him/herself effectively. What three main (master keys) if you want to call them that, would you teach this person?

I look forward to the interaction. if this has been on before let me know and I will delete the post.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
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Joined: October 21st, 2006, 9:13 pm

June 25th, 2009, 10:14 pm #2

prior to them leaving that is.

1) Toe Heel line EVERY TIME THEY STEP BACK. NB's being glorified hoarse stances, the toe heel line creates the mobility and the ability to use all weapons and also gives the primary stance variations of FB, RB and their variants, WK, CK, Concave and Diamond. If the guy goes away ands can hit the neutral he can pick up the rest of the stuff with someone else. This is accomplished with an understanding of weight transfer and knowing when you should have one Heel up, and one Heel down. Also known as "Heel toe forward, Toe heel backwards. When the guy steps back to a NB is he turning his hips and sweeping his foot back or is he stepping back normally and then settling into his NB.

2) Upward block. It's got two punches and two elbow strikes in it. I wouldn't recommend that the upward block (the way I understand it to work) be used against a punch grab or strike to the face/head area, but it does an important thing for the beginner. First, it brings the blocking arms elbow into the centerline of the body. Second, it teaches the arm to form a corkscrew punch, granted on a diagonally upward path, but never the less, it still is a punch. The reverse motion of the upward block brings some wicked marriage of gravity to both the inward overhead elbow and that back elbow that is also in BS1.

3) Blocking Set 1 (BS1). Point of Origin is coming from this set. It takes the guess work out of where your arms should and could be during a confrontation. Learn to do it reverse and all ten of the yellow belt techniques can be done at some point of the set.

Clark
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Joined: October 25th, 2007, 1:41 pm

June 25th, 2009, 11:34 pm #3

Ok, I am not usually one to start a thread on here but tire of some of the stuff that we seem to spend too much time on as I am sure others do also. So let me ask a question that may help someone somewhere in their journey.

With all of the principles and concepts that exist in the kenpo system or the Arts for that matter, and all of the information there is to draw on, what in your opinion and experience would be the three most likely candidates (principle or concept) for importance to the laymen for self-defense in a combat situation?

Let me elaborate, let's say you have three weeks to work with a guy and off he goes never to be seen again. you want him/her to be able to defend him/herself effectively. What three main (master keys) if you want to call them that, would you teach this person?

I look forward to the interaction. if this has been on before let me know and I will delete the post.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
Funny, I had 2 people ask for just about that scenario in the last week. I told them I didnt know how to show them skills that would do that.
I'd go meta in answering that, rather than just 3 specific skills:
1)situational awareness
2) control HWD zones (method of execution would be for them to continue to work on)
3) keep a good base

If I could only do 3 basic level things it would be 1)kick to the center line 2) head butt 3) crossing talon
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Joined: March 10th, 2008, 4:57 am

June 26th, 2009, 12:12 am #4

prior to them leaving that is.

1) Toe Heel line EVERY TIME THEY STEP BACK. NB's being glorified hoarse stances, the toe heel line creates the mobility and the ability to use all weapons and also gives the primary stance variations of FB, RB and their variants, WK, CK, Concave and Diamond. If the guy goes away ands can hit the neutral he can pick up the rest of the stuff with someone else. This is accomplished with an understanding of weight transfer and knowing when you should have one Heel up, and one Heel down. Also known as "Heel toe forward, Toe heel backwards. When the guy steps back to a NB is he turning his hips and sweeping his foot back or is he stepping back normally and then settling into his NB.

2) Upward block. It's got two punches and two elbow strikes in it. I wouldn't recommend that the upward block (the way I understand it to work) be used against a punch grab or strike to the face/head area, but it does an important thing for the beginner. First, it brings the blocking arms elbow into the centerline of the body. Second, it teaches the arm to form a corkscrew punch, granted on a diagonally upward path, but never the less, it still is a punch. The reverse motion of the upward block brings some wicked marriage of gravity to both the inward overhead elbow and that back elbow that is also in BS1.

3) Blocking Set 1 (BS1). Point of Origin is coming from this set. It takes the guess work out of where your arms should and could be during a confrontation. Learn to do it reverse and all ten of the yellow belt techniques can be done at some point of the set.

Clark
So, in the question it was asked "principle or concepts", in your second lesson you want to teach an upward block, with all that fancy stuff attached.

Why not give them the idea/concept of forward and reverse as it applies to motion and let that be a tool with which they may grow themselves after they have left your tutelage?

Remember this is all in fun for the sake of understanding???

great stuff so far.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
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Joined: February 5th, 2004, 6:37 pm

June 26th, 2009, 2:04 am #5

Ok, I am not usually one to start a thread on here but tire of some of the stuff that we seem to spend too much time on as I am sure others do also. So let me ask a question that may help someone somewhere in their journey.

With all of the principles and concepts that exist in the kenpo system or the Arts for that matter, and all of the information there is to draw on, what in your opinion and experience would be the three most likely candidates (principle or concept) for importance to the laymen for self-defense in a combat situation?

Let me elaborate, let's say you have three weeks to work with a guy and off he goes never to be seen again. you want him/her to be able to defend him/herself effectively. What three main (master keys) if you want to call them that, would you teach this person?

I look forward to the interaction. if this has been on before let me know and I will delete the post.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
1. Attack
2. Attack
3. Attack


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Joined: October 21st, 2006, 9:13 pm

June 26th, 2009, 2:48 am #6

So, in the question it was asked "principle or concepts", in your second lesson you want to teach an upward block, with all that fancy stuff attached.

Why not give them the idea/concept of forward and reverse as it applies to motion and let that be a tool with which they may grow themselves after they have left your tutelage?

Remember this is all in fun for the sake of understanding???

great stuff so far.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
Principle - an accepted or professed rule of action or conduct: a person of good moral principles.

Concept - 1. general notion or idea; conception.
2. an idea of something formed by mentally combining all its
characteristics or particulars; a construct.

I'm gonna stay away from discussing your response to my response, this is where the original post is lost in the wilderness.

Clark
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Joined: October 21st, 2006, 9:13 pm

June 26th, 2009, 2:51 am #7

Ok, I am not usually one to start a thread on here but tire of some of the stuff that we seem to spend too much time on as I am sure others do also. So let me ask a question that may help someone somewhere in their journey.

With all of the principles and concepts that exist in the kenpo system or the Arts for that matter, and all of the information there is to draw on, what in your opinion and experience would be the three most likely candidates (principle or concept) for importance to the laymen for self-defense in a combat situation?

Let me elaborate, let's say you have three weeks to work with a guy and off he goes never to be seen again. you want him/her to be able to defend him/herself effectively. What three main (master keys) if you want to call them that, would you teach this person?

I look forward to the interaction. if this has been on before let me know and I will delete the post.

Good Journey,
Todd Durgan
what to give to someone to practice on a bus mans holiday at your studio/dojo/garage/rec center.......

Shouldn't every student get that in the first three weeks whether they stay or leave? I think so. You get the best of me whether you stay or leave.

Clark
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Joined: August 27th, 2004, 8:34 am

June 26th, 2009, 3:00 am #8

1. Attack
2. Attack
3. Attack

I agree. In three weeks, you can not teach one a decent defense that will be of any real help in the real world.

Teaching them aggressive attacks that can smother possible threats would be the way to go. Keeping it simple, you drill the hell out of it in that three weeks. Possibly using high stress training to simulate adrenaline dumps and fear one would experience in a real confrontation.

Principle and concepts are for life long martial artists. Not for a 3 week self defense course.

Zoran Sevic
http://www.martial-links.com
http://www.martialartsindustry.net
http://www.kenpothoughts.com
http://www.myspace.com/zoransevic
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Joined: October 14th, 2005, 5:16 am

June 26th, 2009, 3:07 am #9

1. Attack
2. Attack
3. Attack

Not sure if you are serious, but I'll say hogwash!

Self defense is tricky, attack is not something to do, unless they have really commited and then it has to be more of a self defense, rather than an attack...

Of course you might strike to protect oneself, but the idea of tora, tora, tora...Is not cutting it.

The one thing that I believe is important is mobility and fluidity...Not something taught it seems..Stuck stance is only going to get the 3 weeker in problems IMHO...Most of what I see is they are getting hit by the instructor, not my idea of learning basic's...Being hit for others entertainment sucks...

Basics, learning the blocks and foot movement to avoid.

Then, you have to instruct to evade it the best way possible, if needed, be a victim for a second...

I have to tell you that many just don't really teach right imho of course.

Basics is it, but the basics in EPAK are sort of skewed...

Why my Grandson is taking boxing now, rather then his MA, he said not enough real striking (bags etc in Kenpo the fist art) The folks in the gym laugh at MA, it seems the TKD and Kenpo type anyway... Just a thought...

Regards
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Joined: February 5th, 2004, 6:37 pm

June 26th, 2009, 3:39 am #10

The best defense is always a good offense. If you sit back and wait for someone to try and hit you, they will. You can move and avoid all you want, but in the end, you will still get hit. However, if you put pressure on the attacker, you make him defend, which I'm sure he was not prepared to do, and you keep the pressure on until he can no longer hurt you. Aside from running away (which is always the best option, but not always possible), hurting your attacker is the best way to protect yourself.

To key to winning a physical confrontation is to become more violent than your opponent. If tries to grab you, you strike him. If he tries to punch you, you strike repeatedly and overwhelmingly. If he brings a knife, you bring a gun. Violence is the key to victory. Most people will back down once they know you are fighting back, because they weren't expecting it. You disrupted their plan and got the upper hand. Why do you think we train with so many strikes in our techniques? If one doesn't do the job, the next one will, and if that doesn't work, then the next one will, and so on until your attacker gives up, or he can't continue. That is the physical aspect of self-defense.

The only thing you can teach someone in a couple of weeks is to keep their hands up and elbows in to protect themselves, and that will usually go out the window after the first punch is thrown. Anything else you try teaching them will just clutter their mind and reduce their reaction time. What they really need to know is that they can take a hit and keep fighting. This is probably the most important lessen I ever learned.

After reading your post, I will now give up kenpo, because the guys at the gym laugh at it. I'm sure the guys at the gym are experts. If you haven't figured it out yet, it's not the system, it's the practitioner that makes the system work.

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