Extensions are Mandatory

Extensions are Mandatory

Joined: July 14th, 2007, 5:07 pm

May 14th, 2011, 11:21 pm #1

The reasons:
The extensions teach the optimal sequential set of moves from the end of the base technique; they are the most logical response if the base moves need "extending" if an attacker simply will not stop. There are invaluable and indispensible mandatory information in the extensions, such as the inclusion of the opposite side use of a weapon (such as a rising back kick from the ground; case in point: the extension to Blue Belt level Snaking Talon using the rising back kick from the ground with the RIGHT foot while base technique part of Encounter with Danger from Green uses the rising back kick from the ground with the LEFT foot. Thus, completing the introduction of the rising back kick from both sides. I believe Mr. Parker brilliantly with his genious set it up that way. Without the extensions, you may never get to officially complete every possible strike or kick with the left and right side. I believe that all the techniques all had extensions originally (except the browns, which have no extensions) but were left out for later introduction after the base techniques are learned by the student during their colored belt phase. Case in point for that assertion is Dance of Death an Orange Belt technique. Without the extension, which is introduced in the First Degree Brown level, only then are you doing a dance on the attacker by destroying his spine, side ribs, back of the head, with the Dance of Death. The base technique which is in Orange belt does no such Dance. So the Dance of Death name has no meaning when you first learn it in Orange - only does it have meaning when you learn Dance of Death plus the extension in First Degree Brown. (And as an aside, please let me mention that of course you can make a student do a left side kick, then a right side kick to the complete the category of side kicks, however, a student of kenpo gets to learn these kicks in the context of a case study of motion...the optimal application of a side kick, for example...that is the brilliance of the Ed Parker system.) Of course, you can make up an extension that is very cool, but I think you are missing out on one of the most amazing aspects of Ed Parker's kenpo: the ability to have even more insight into the optimal way, in Ed Parker's mind, to dismantle a crazed attacker's human body. This viewpoint is only my opinion after having trained in Ed Parker's kenpo for close to two decades now. Also, all the jiu-jitsu in the extensions are absolutely amazing. I have black belts from three first generation black belts who are in the Journey written by Mr. Hyams. That info is just for those who doubt my lineage. I respect all of those with differing opinions and wish you the very best on your journey through the Arts. I believe that Mr. Parker left us a grand novel that is the equal of War and Peace except that the words are the language of motion. And like with all great novels, it is good to re-read them. Each time I "read" the kenpo 24 techniques per belt novel that Mr. Parker left us, including the techniques and extensions, I feel that he teaches me something each time. Thank you Mr. Parker from the bottom of my heart. Your techniques/extensions/forms/sets never cease to amaze me, even to this day. Best wishes to you and all you read this, on your journey in kenpo.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog
Last edited by kenpo_dog on May 15th, 2011, 2:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: June 1st, 2005, 5:34 am

May 14th, 2011, 11:36 pm #2

You can say whatever you want, but when you try saying you have all this legitimate lineage behind you, then refuse to state your real name, then you pretty much fail.
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Joined: July 14th, 2007, 5:07 pm

May 15th, 2011, 12:03 am #3

Your response was particularly powerful and insightful. Thank you.
Last edited by kenpo_dog on May 15th, 2011, 3:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: June 1st, 2005, 5:34 am

May 15th, 2011, 12:57 am #4

But seriously what did you say.... let me shorten what you said.

"Extensions are mandatory!
Ed Parker was a genious and they are the best answer for an attack
I have three black belts from three different Journey Honorees so you have to believe me.
signed...
anonymous."
ummmm ok

I have seen so many versions of extensions from several different First Generation Black Belts under Ed Parker(however I do not have a black belt from any of them) and have talked about them with several others who never did the extensions, or who did but chose not to teach them.
There are some who claim the extensions was just more "stuff" added for monetary reasons. Filler if you will to extend the study time of practitioners.
As a matter of fact I don't think I have ever gotten the same answer from two different students of Ed Parker in regards to the extensions. Apparantly opinions vary drastically

I can appreciate that you are Gung Ho for them, I have found most versions I have seen to be some cool stuff, but I have also personally felt that it was a small percentage of what is important in the system. I have seen some cool movement that was unique to the extensions, but not so sure I would agree that it is the most logical end all be all of what to do when the action continues. All that said I will continue to watch, learn, and play with different versions of the extensions, mostly because its a hell of alot of fun.

let me ask you a few questions, since you are obviously very excited about the extensions.
What is the most important lesson learned in the extensions that is not in the rest of the system?
What do the extensions reinforce in new ways that is introduced in the techniques before the extensions?
Do you think that there is only one vaid version of each extension?
I am sure there is a ton of very intereslting conversations to be had from the extensions... besides... DO THEM!!!
Just in case you wanted to add some particularly powerful and insightful response....
Last edited by LuckyKBoxer on May 15th, 2011, 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: July 14th, 2007, 5:07 pm

May 15th, 2011, 1:30 am #5

You misused the form of your. You should have used you're welcome, not your welcome. Since you are such an amazing authority, I thought you should know that your credibility could be increased even further by correcting your grammar. Hey, I'm just looking out for you.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog
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Joined: June 1st, 2005, 5:34 am

May 15th, 2011, 1:37 am #6

yep I used poor grammar, happens often.. I am glad I am not an english teacher.
But I never said I was an authority. I simply shared what I have been told by people who were there.
You are the one who said they are mandatory, I assume since they are mandatory that those questions would be fairly easy for you to answer.
I have not made any claims other then I enjoy some of the different versions I have seen.
I guess you were only interested in making a statement anonymously rather then discussing the extensions.
sad.
Last edited by LuckyKBoxer on May 15th, 2011, 1:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: August 23rd, 2010, 6:36 pm

May 15th, 2011, 2:08 am #7

The reasons:
The extensions teach the optimal sequential set of moves from the end of the base technique; they are the most logical response if the base moves need "extending" if an attacker simply will not stop. There are invaluable and indispensible mandatory information in the extensions, such as the inclusion of the opposite side use of a weapon (such as a rising back kick from the ground; case in point: the extension to Blue Belt level Snaking Talon using the rising back kick from the ground with the RIGHT foot while base technique part of Encounter with Danger from Green uses the rising back kick from the ground with the LEFT foot. Thus, completing the introduction of the rising back kick from both sides. I believe Mr. Parker brilliantly with his genious set it up that way. Without the extensions, you may never get to officially complete every possible strike or kick with the left and right side. I believe that all the techniques all had extensions originally (except the browns, which have no extensions) but were left out for later introduction after the base techniques are learned by the student during their colored belt phase. Case in point for that assertion is Dance of Death an Orange Belt technique. Without the extension, which is introduced in the First Degree Brown level, only then are you doing a dance on the attacker by destroying his spine, side ribs, back of the head, with the Dance of Death. The base technique which is in Orange belt does no such Dance. So the Dance of Death name has no meaning when you first learn it in Orange - only does it have meaning when you learn Dance of Death plus the extension in First Degree Brown. (And as an aside, please let me mention that of course you can make a student do a left side kick, then a right side kick to the complete the category of side kicks, however, a student of kenpo gets to learn these kicks in the context of a case study of motion...the optimal application of a side kick, for example...that is the brilliance of the Ed Parker system.) Of course, you can make up an extension that is very cool, but I think you are missing out on one of the most amazing aspects of Ed Parker's kenpo: the ability to have even more insight into the optimal way, in Ed Parker's mind, to dismantle a crazed attacker's human body. This viewpoint is only my opinion after having trained in Ed Parker's kenpo for close to two decades now. Also, all the jiu-jitsu in the extensions are absolutely amazing. I have black belts from three first generation black belts who are in the Journey written by Mr. Hyams. That info is just for those who doubt my lineage. I respect all of those with differing opinions and wish you the very best on your journey through the Arts. I believe that Mr. Parker left us a grand novel that is the equal of War and Peace except that the words are the language of motion. And like with all great novels, it is good to re-read them. Each time I "read" the kenpo 24 techniques per belt novel that Mr. Parker left us, including the techniques and extensions, I feel that he teaches me something each time. Thank you Mr. Parker from the bottom of my heart. Your techniques/extensions/forms/sets never cease to amaze me, even to this day. Best wishes to you and all you read this, on your journey in kenpo.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog
Those red squiggly lines are telling you something Dog. Spell check or, grammar check, are two very useful tools. Or as I am fond of repeating, "Man who slings mud, loses real estate."

"The reasons:
The extensions teach the optimal sequential set of moves from the end of the base technique; they are the most logical response if the base moves need "extending" of an attacker simply will not stop."

Does logic dictate that within a confrontation that the entire technique is, a) viable to anyone once the caca hits the fan, b) your superman cape is at the dry cleaners when said defecation hits the rotary oscillator?


"There are invaluable and indispensable mandatory information in the extensions, such as the inclusion of the opposite side use of a weapon (such as a rising back kick from the ground; case in point: the extensiomn to Blue Belt level Snaking Talon using the rising back kick from the ground with the RIGHT foot while base technique part of Encounter with Danger from Green uses the rising back kick from the ground with the LEFT foot."

Invaluable-Indispensable-Mandatory, there are some extensions that I agree (as to the totality of the motions) with because, the lesson within the new-ish material is cogent to the Base Ideal. Once you get to blue and green however, there are some real odd and structurally unsound motions there.

you wrote, rising back kick from the ground, category completion is (IMO) not a teaching method, it is an observational tool. Its kind of like teaching the test. Everyone passes. Cat Com is not a method I use to actually teach the lessons within the techniques.

"Thus, completing the introduction of the rising back kick from both sides. I believe Mr. Parker brilliantly with his genious set it up that way. Without the extensions, you may never get to officially complete every possible strike or kick with the left and right side."

My somatic structure is not symmetrical. My thumbs are not a matching pair and one of my feet is longer than the other. I stretch and lift weights, the development of the musculature is not the same for both sides. So why would I try to force the issue by making my basics symmetrical? Not my method for achieving efficient movement.

"I believe that all the techniques all had extensions originally (except the browns, which have no extensions) but were left out for later introduction after the base technique are learned by the student during their colored belt phase. Case in point for that assertion is Dance of Death an Orange Belt technique. Without the extension, which is introduced in the First Degree Brown level, only then are you doing a dance on the attacker by destroying his spine, side ribs, back of the head, with the Dance of Death. The base technique which is in Orange belt does no such Dance. So the Dance of Death name has no meaning when you first learn it in Orange - only does it have meaning when you learn Dance of Death plus the extension in First Degree Brown."

Which foot does your attacker have forward in the Ideal Attack? If the attack is a step through then your foot adjustments (in-place switch) looks like a dance to me. Shuffling the feet, knowing how to pivot on the balls of the feet, as well as coordinating the upper/lower quadrant looks a heck of a lot like dancing to me. If the attack is a right cross with the right foot back, freeze the action at the ridge hand strike and examine your relative position to the attacker. Raise your right arm to wrap it around the attackers left kidney and guess what? Your dancing with the attacker. Only Sith believe in absolutes.

"(And as aside, please let me mention that of course you can make a student do a left side kick, then a right side kick to the complete the category of side kicks, however, a student of kenpo gets to learn these kicks in the context of a case study of motion...the optimal application of a side kick, for example...that is the brilliance of the Ed Parker system.) Of course, you can make up an extension that is very cool, but I think you are missing out on one of the most amazing aspects of Ed Parker's kenpo: the ability to have even more insight into the optimal way, in Ed Parker's mind, to dismantle a crazed attacker's human body."

dismantle a crazed attackers body. Where did I put my cape?


"This is only my opinion after having trained in Ed Parker's kenpo for close to two decades now. Also, all the jiu-jitsu in the extensions are absolutely amazing. I have black belt from three first generation black belts that are in the Journey written by Mr. Hyams. That info is just for those who doubt my lineage. I respect all of those with differing opinions and wish you the very best on your journey through the Arts. I believe that Mr. Parker left us a grand novel that is the equal of War and Peace except that the words are the language of motion. And like with all great novels, it is good to re-read them. Each time I "read" the kenpo 24 technique novel that Mr. Parker left us, including the techniques and extensions, I feel that he teaches me something each time. Thank you Mr. Parker from the bottom of my heart. Your techniques/extensions/forms/sets never cease to amaze me, even to this day. Best wishes to you and all you read this, on your journey in kenpo.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog"

My God, its full of stars.

Clark
WE ARE THE BORGASSIMILATING ONE COLLECTIVE AT A TIME
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Joined: July 14th, 2007, 5:07 pm

May 15th, 2011, 2:09 am #8

yep I used poor grammar, happens often.. I am glad I am not an english teacher.
But I never said I was an authority. I simply shared what I have been told by people who were there.
You are the one who said they are mandatory, I assume since they are mandatory that those questions would be fairly easy for you to answer.
I have not made any claims other then I enjoy some of the different versions I have seen.
I guess you were only interested in making a statement anonymously rather then discussing the extensions.
sad.
I said that it was just my opinion. Last I checked, this is a free country and we can state our opinions. You're the one that came out both guns slinging using the word fail about my post and about me - using a personal attack as a response with no mention of the topic at hand and even questioning my lineage. Great. That's fine and a great way to initiate/welcome me who is posting a fresh post/topic on this forum. Let me tell you, not all kenpo practitioners out there who have earned black belts from Mr. Parker's first generation students post here regularly. Now, I am glad I was anonymous. You proved my decision was a very good one. Well, I've met all kinds and it doesn't bother me at all. However, I will always defend myself aggressively with my words when attacked verbally. I simply responded to your personal attack. Regardless, yes, you did set yourself up as an authority and if that is how you view yourself, be my guest. I already answered most of your questions in my initial post. Additionally, it is very intimidating talking to you who is such an awesome encyclopedia of knowledge in kenpo who is so absolutely amazing. But after all is said and done, I wish you well.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog
Last edited by kenpo_dog on May 15th, 2011, 12:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Joined: June 1st, 2005, 5:34 am

May 15th, 2011, 2:40 am #9

sorry I hurt your feelings there.
I am constantly surprised at the frail egos so many so called Kenpoists have.
Here I was hoping to read some cool new perspective about the extensions from someone who came on so strong to start the thread... how disappointing.
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Joined: July 14th, 2007, 5:07 pm

May 15th, 2011, 2:47 am #10

Thank you for yet another awesome and genuine response. You are truly impressive and a towering giant in the world of kenpo. Wow, you're such a tough guy. Go get 'em.
Respectfully,
Kenpo Dog
Last edited by kenpo_dog on May 15th, 2011, 2:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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