Three Stooges

Three Stooges

Bob
Bob

March 16th, 2009, 1:42 am #1

For Real!

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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

March 16th, 2009, 5:31 am #2

Oh now Bob, you've been hanging out at those right-wing blogs again!
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Bob
Bob

March 16th, 2009, 5:17 pm #3



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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

March 16th, 2009, 6:36 pm #4

Hmmm, seems to me the economy tanked before Obama was even elected.
It took Bush 8 years to crash the economy, it's going to take a while to fix it.
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Bob
Bob

March 17th, 2009, 1:57 pm #5

participate in the deception, Nat? The deception that any President, Bush or otherwise, is responsible for what happens in the country? The fact is that the Democrats have had majorities in both hoouses of Congress for years now, and they are the ones who propose legislation and approve budgets. Also (as noted here previously), Democrats like Barney Frank (Chairman of the House Finance Committee) worked hard to relax lending standards that allowed foolish loans to be approved -- yet, somehow Bush keeps getting all the "credit" for the sub-prime lending crisis. (Note too that while you and I agree that unfair trade relations have really hurt U.S., only Bush and Republicans get blamed for that. But, treaties like NAFTA occurred under the Clinton Administration, with conservatives like Rush Limbaugh championing it. So, there is plenty of blame to go around on both sides.)

Yesterday, someone was trying to make the point that new Presidents enjoy or suffer the good/bad decisions of the previous President. They noted that "W" inherited the "good" economy of Clinton, while Obama inherited the horrible economy of Bush. Aside from my comments above that show the President isn't mostly responsible, I note the recession of 2001-2002 that, using the person's reasoning, was the "fault" of Bill Clinton's Administration. Funny how people mis-remember things to fit their desired scenario).
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

March 17th, 2009, 5:35 pm #6

Bob, the bullshit on those right-wing websites are really getting to you now. Bush inherited a balanced budget in 2001, then made huge tax cuts for the rich- cutting government revenue- then started two wars- one entirely unnecessary and extremely wasteful complete with no-bid contracts to Cheney's Haliburton, and financed it with bonds sold to China which we must now pay interest on. The deficit grew bigger every year Bush was in office! As for Congress, The Republicans had control for SIX of those eight years!- the Democrats only took control in 2006 when the deficit was already way out of control!
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Bob
Bob

March 17th, 2009, 5:58 pm #7

we could have turned the country away from the precipice had the Democrats acted differently? I think it could have made a huge difference.

As for the Iraq war, that has cost -- what? -- a trillion dollars. Not that this is an insignificant amount, but that is almost the amount just approved for the stimulus package (that will be gone in a few months with little to show for it).

Nat, I don't listen to or watch the conservative talk programs. I just keep my eyes and ears, and mind, open. What has done-in U.S. was -- first -- years of unfair trade that not only built-up the national debt but gutted American industry by sending a lot of our manufacturing capacity and jobs overseas. Second, the foolish and greedy business practices of investment, insurance and banking entities that fudged balance sheets to inflate the value of companies and stocks, and encouraged the over-valuation of real estate and the granting of loans to people who had no business getting those loans. Third, the over-spending of too many Americans, living above their means by abusing credit and taking equity out of their homes. It became, over years, a house of cards that only needed the housing bubble to collapse to send the whole thing tubbling down.

If you think one political party, let alone one politician, is responsible for all that . . . you are drinking the Kool-Aid, Nat!
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

March 17th, 2009, 8:09 pm #8

Oh I never said the Democrats were blameless, Bob, there is blame for everyone- but the unarguable fact is we had a very good economy during the 1990s before Bush took office and a very bad one when he left eight years later. And you blame the Democrats who were out of power 3/4 of that time!

I suspect the actual cost of the Iraq war will be well over a $trillion since much of it was financed "off-budget"- so no one even knows the true cost- Bush worked hard to see to that. And every dime of that money is just gone- wasted- down a rat-hole in Iraq while the stimulus money is being spend here at home where it should benefit us.

As for "foolish and greedy business practices"- Republicans are well know for being in bed with big-business- all this deregulation began during the Reagan years. Right now Obama is raising hell about the big AIG bonuses and doing all he can to stop them. Bush sure didn't do that when the first billions went to them during his term.

And yes, a lot of blame lies with the American public for tying to live beyond their means (on credit) while their income was going south as big business shipped good paying job overseas and Bush did nothing to stop illegal immigration from undercutting their wages.
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Bob
Bob

March 18th, 2009, 5:21 pm #9

Assigning blame does nothing to address problems. Fact is that the Dems and Repubs are MUCH more alike than different . . . think about it. Funny how you'll make excuses now for the Democrats, Nat, when they aren't doing anything differently than the Republicans had been doing.

Your response reminds me of the Dems in Congress: When they only had both Houses of Congress and not the White House . . . partisanship! Then, they get the White House too . . "End of partisanship!" . . . . then they still complain and blame everything on Repub opposition (though they did the exact same when Bush was in office), criticizing "those members from the other side of the aisle" . . what happened to the "non-partisanism" under Obama they kept talking about? Seems to me that the more things change, the more the parties change sides but keep doing the same things as always.
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

March 18th, 2009, 9:23 pm #10

Obama went out of his way to involve the Republicans in the recovery effort and was met with zero cooperation. All the Republicans have done is criticize while offering no plan of their own. Their clear strategy (even voiced by Limbaugh) is to hope Obama fails so they can make political gains in the next election. In other words, they are putting their party ahead of the good of the country.
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