Cold weekend in Ohio!

Cold weekend in Ohio!

Bob
Bob

April 22nd, 2012, 4:37 pm #1

Yes, I'm spoiled, but we were having such nice weather here right up until Friday evening. After work on Friday, I was out working in the yard and it was in the 70's and sunny. Then, as the weather forecast predicted, about 8 PM the rain started and the temps dropped down into the 40's overnight. Yesterday and today, overcast, windy and high's in the 50's . . brrrr! It feels like we should be approaching Thanksgiving here instead of May.

I went grocery shopping yesterday. In the produce dept. there was a lady dressed in an Ohio State hoodie and short black shorts! I asked her, "Aren't you cold? I would be freezing if I had shorts on today." She responded, "No, I've been digging in my yard for three hours and I've been hot all day . . and you aren't going through menopause, so don't say another thing!" I took it as the truth-based humor it was intended and nodded agreement (pretty good-looking 50-ish woman . . loved her hazel eyes . . but if she is crabby from being menopausal, it might still be better not to have that in my life!)
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

April 23rd, 2012, 2:10 pm #2

Wow, a post! It's been so quiet here lately I thought all the good people had departed this troubled planet.

Yes, it's going to be about ten degrees cooler here too- but for us thats like from 80s to 70s, not too bad.
But you've done been spoiled by this mild winter now.

As for Meno-lady- you're lucky she didn't whop you for looking at her legs! But it appears groceries aren't the only thing you're checking out!


. . . . .
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Bob
Bob

April 23rd, 2012, 2:37 pm #3

to post, even if it is just the weather.

Admittedly, I am a flirt. I especially do it at the the deli counter, which tends to be busy. I figure that if the women customers aren't very friendly (I think less so than the men, on average), the least I can do is try to brighten the day for the ladies behind the counter with a little harmless flirtation. If I think they might not be so receptive (e,g., the young girls don't want an older guy flirting with them), I either don't do it or do something fairly safe. You can usually tell a woman that her hair looks nice without her being offended (whereas if you comment on her clothes she can assume you are talking about what is underneath the clothes). Complimenting a mother's children is also safe . . such as, "Your children are so well-behaved". They may reply, "Well you should see how they act most of the time!", but I still think they like hearing it.

When I go to shop for women's clothing, I always flirt with the women staff. Women love men's admission of ignorance -- "I need to get something for my female supervisor that she can wear to work but still be comfortable. I have no idea what that would be." The lady will ask me how my boss usually dresses, what colors she likes, etc. Then (if she is good), she will show me various combinations that she likes and see what I think. Complimenting a woman selections (rather than saying, "I like what you have on", which again can be too strong) is always good. Even if you don't like, don't say "no, not that" or "nah". I like to take my time anyway, but taking the time to make a good decision like this shows any woman that you do care and are thoughtful. And I NEVER speak critically about ANY women to the sales lady . . . saying, "Well she wants to look feminine, but she is big so forget about that." would get you dirty looks, even if the sales lady is slim. I always say things like, "I want to give her something that will make her feel pretty" . . women love hearing guys say stuff like that. After the purchase, I always thank the women profusely for all their time and help and say something like, "I know she will love it. Thank you so much." Some might call this common courtesy rather than flirting, but I never say stuff like this to male sales staff, who don't really go out of their way for male customers and don't want men being too emotional around them. If they help me, so what? . . that's what they're there for!

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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

April 23rd, 2012, 3:38 pm #4

Ah Bob, you are a skilled practitioner in the art of sexual politics. I must admit I'm not.
I'm very wimpy in fact and avoid saying anything that anyone could conceivably find offensive when dealing with women.


But this reminds me of a joke I heard many years ago....
A man commenting on his friend's bold flirtations with women....

"You must get slapped a lot"
"Yeah, I do... but I also get a lot of pussy."


. . . . .
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Bob
Bob

April 24th, 2012, 1:00 pm #5

Regardless what anyone wants to say about "men should be more sensitive" and "men need to be backed down by women sometimes", I think the reality is that most women expect men to make the approach and risk the rejection. Everyone talks about "male ego", but I think women also have an insecure vanity that says implicitly, "I am the woman. I have the goods. You are supposed to want what I have, so you make the move or just forget it. I don't have to approach men . . I field the offers and decide what to accept or reject." That just seems to be the way.

Does anyone else notice (I know I've said this before here): The women who are more appealing and who get more approaches are tired of flirtations and are the quickest to reject them. The less market-worthy females don't get approached or flirted-with so much, so they tend to respond more positively to being approached or complimented (There is also the category of women who already have a brutish, more mascvuline appearance, and then they add to that by dressing "butch" . . maybe they are lesbian, or they had bad experiences with men from the get-go, but they are the really hostile ones. Fortunately for men, they are also the least likely to be approached by a man).

As I noted in my previous post, HOW you say something is really important to women. They have radar for anything even remotely construed as sexual. That is why referring to their clothing is usually a no-no. Anything not too closely associated (in their minds) with their body is usually safer (hair, jewelry, shoes, nails, etc.). You can compliment the job they did for you . . their expertise and helpfulness . . that goes over well. Again, women like male admissions of ignorance, so if you need help and the woman can be the authority, that also is smooth sailing.

But, I admit, I'm moody. Sometimes I tire of the game and the work of it. Sometimes I say stuff to elicit a negative reaction from women . . to be the "dog" most think men are. After my bitter divorce, a woman asked me what I was looking for in a women. I told her, "uncomplicated behind". Of course she grimaced and walked away, but at the time I wanted to be offensive. I like to push buttons sometimes, but this is mostly with women closer to my age and not with ladies 10+ years older than myself or young enough to be my daughter. I don't feel as aggressive with those age groups as much as I feel toward my own generation of women. I would guess that this is because women closer to my age are the ones who I count on but who also let me down. Whatever . . .

Nat, flirting can be fun. If you have any interest in it, I suggest doing something as simple as calling the store clerk/cashier by her name (usually she is wearing a name tag), smiling, asking about her day (this is easy, cause they may ask about yours), and relate a funny story (short story -- not like the books I write here). Next time, recognize and greet her if you see her again. You can sort-of make a buddy just by flirting, even if you only see her at the store. I am better at this kind of flirting than the bar-scene flirting . . . how do you not feel stupid saying a pick-up line? How do you not feel foolish standing there, attempting a pass, and getting shot down in front of her friends and nearby patrons? I'm chicken -- I don't do much of that.

Maybe Jenn could give us a female perspective?
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

April 24th, 2012, 3:04 pm #6

Well its very hard to know what to do in these post-feminists days. What one women considers friendly flirtation another would charge "sexual harassment". Companies routinely lecture employees about such matters.

And men's lot is getting very precarious and uncertain these days, it's not like is use to be when men and women's roles were clearly defined. Men were the bread-winner- women the housekeeper. Now many women make more than their husbands and more women are graduating college than men now. We men seem to have lost our way. And women are as confused about it as we are. No doubt it is why there are so many failed-marriages- and non-marriages these days. I read the percentage of adults who are married is now the lowest in recorded history.
. . . . .
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Marseil
Marseil

April 25th, 2012, 6:18 am #7

Regardless what anyone wants to say about "men should be more sensitive" and "men need to be backed down by women sometimes", I think the reality is that most women expect men to make the approach and risk the rejection. Everyone talks about "male ego", but I think women also have an insecure vanity that says implicitly, "I am the woman. I have the goods. You are supposed to want what I have, so you make the move or just forget it. I don't have to approach men . . I field the offers and decide what to accept or reject." That just seems to be the way.

Does anyone else notice (I know I've said this before here): The women who are more appealing and who get more approaches are tired of flirtations and are the quickest to reject them. The less market-worthy females don't get approached or flirted-with so much, so they tend to respond more positively to being approached or complimented (There is also the category of women who already have a brutish, more mascvuline appearance, and then they add to that by dressing "butch" . . maybe they are lesbian, or they had bad experiences with men from the get-go, but they are the really hostile ones. Fortunately for men, they are also the least likely to be approached by a man).

As I noted in my previous post, HOW you say something is really important to women. They have radar for anything even remotely construed as sexual. That is why referring to their clothing is usually a no-no. Anything not too closely associated (in their minds) with their body is usually safer (hair, jewelry, shoes, nails, etc.). You can compliment the job they did for you . . their expertise and helpfulness . . that goes over well. Again, women like male admissions of ignorance, so if you need help and the woman can be the authority, that also is smooth sailing.

But, I admit, I'm moody. Sometimes I tire of the game and the work of it. Sometimes I say stuff to elicit a negative reaction from women . . to be the "dog" most think men are. After my bitter divorce, a woman asked me what I was looking for in a women. I told her, "uncomplicated behind". Of course she grimaced and walked away, but at the time I wanted to be offensive. I like to push buttons sometimes, but this is mostly with women closer to my age and not with ladies 10+ years older than myself or young enough to be my daughter. I don't feel as aggressive with those age groups as much as I feel toward my own generation of women. I would guess that this is because women closer to my age are the ones who I count on but who also let me down. Whatever . . .

Nat, flirting can be fun. If you have any interest in it, I suggest doing something as simple as calling the store clerk/cashier by her name (usually she is wearing a name tag), smiling, asking about her day (this is easy, cause they may ask about yours), and relate a funny story (short story -- not like the books I write here). Next time, recognize and greet her if you see her again. You can sort-of make a buddy just by flirting, even if you only see her at the store. I am better at this kind of flirting than the bar-scene flirting . . . how do you not feel stupid saying a pick-up line? How do you not feel foolish standing there, attempting a pass, and getting shot down in front of her friends and nearby patrons? I'm chicken -- I don't do much of that.

Maybe Jenn could give us a female perspective?
Bob, As you've been writing about this before, we all know that dealing with women is a central concern for you. Unfortunately I can't help much about flirtatious approach of women. However, I strongly believe American women behave in a totally different manner form European or Asian women....

Marseil.
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Bob
Bob

April 25th, 2012, 7:26 pm #8

Granted, I haven't had much face-to-face experience with European or Asian women, but if internet interactions are in any respect true-to-life (not sure they are), it does seem like women from cultures other than U.S. do appear to think differently than your typical American woman. If I were to briefly state the difference, it is that women from other cultures tend to seem less critical and distrustful of men in general. They seem more sincere. There seems to be less conscious head/game-playing with them than occurs with American women.

If so, could the actions of American men be part of the reason for this difference . . and that the men in other cultures behave in a way that their women don't need to learn games, or manipulations, or distrust and how to protect themselves? Maybe U.S. is just a more socially-predatory culture than in many other ciuntries?

Yet, I also realize that things seem very different on the net, as interactions become intimate much faster (in my experience) than in-person. So, it could be that part of the difference that appears between women (or people) of various cultures is an artifact of communicating via internet. Certainly, you would know the truth better than I.
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Nat
Joined: January 1st, 1970, 12:00 am

April 26th, 2012, 3:49 am #9

Bob, As you've been writing about this before, we all know that dealing with women is a central concern for you. Unfortunately I can't help much about flirtatious approach of women. However, I strongly believe American women behave in a totally different manner form European or Asian women....

Marseil.
It's imprudent to generalize about all women in any area because people vary so much from one individual to another but I would be interested in your general view of American women vs French women.
. . . . .
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Jenn
Jenn

April 26th, 2012, 11:14 am #10

to post, even if it is just the weather.

Admittedly, I am a flirt. I especially do it at the the deli counter, which tends to be busy. I figure that if the women customers aren't very friendly (I think less so than the men, on average), the least I can do is try to brighten the day for the ladies behind the counter with a little harmless flirtation. If I think they might not be so receptive (e,g., the young girls don't want an older guy flirting with them), I either don't do it or do something fairly safe. You can usually tell a woman that her hair looks nice without her being offended (whereas if you comment on her clothes she can assume you are talking about what is underneath the clothes). Complimenting a mother's children is also safe . . such as, "Your children are so well-behaved". They may reply, "Well you should see how they act most of the time!", but I still think they like hearing it.

When I go to shop for women's clothing, I always flirt with the women staff. Women love men's admission of ignorance -- "I need to get something for my female supervisor that she can wear to work but still be comfortable. I have no idea what that would be." The lady will ask me how my boss usually dresses, what colors she likes, etc. Then (if she is good), she will show me various combinations that she likes and see what I think. Complimenting a woman selections (rather than saying, "I like what you have on", which again can be too strong) is always good. Even if you don't like, don't say "no, not that" or "nah". I like to take my time anyway, but taking the time to make a good decision like this shows any woman that you do care and are thoughtful. And I NEVER speak critically about ANY women to the sales lady . . . saying, "Well she wants to look feminine, but she is big so forget about that." would get you dirty looks, even if the sales lady is slim. I always say things like, "I want to give her something that will make her feel pretty" . . women love hearing guys say stuff like that. After the purchase, I always thank the women profusely for all their time and help and say something like, "I know she will love it. Thank you so much." Some might call this common courtesy rather than flirting, but I never say stuff like this to male sales staff, who don't really go out of their way for male customers and don't want men being too emotional around them. If they help me, so what? . . that's what they're there for!
I'm going to give this some serious thought and get back to you. My gut reaction is "oh no." But I have to at least consider that other women may think and behave differently. Maybe im just to much of a romantic.
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