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Joined: December 16th, 2009, 1:00 am

January 8th, 2010, 7:19 am #1

I think everyone here should RE-read Creed's original message. Nowhere does he call anyone a Manson worshiper. He only states that Manson has fans, as do many convicted killers.

Wagner is not a convicted killer but his wife died an ugly death, a mystery death, and Wagner has lied so much that there's ample reason to have this case reopened, but some people still make excuses for every questionable action and word this man IS guilty of!

Point is, the light bulb that went off in Creed's head was not presented as an insult, but rather as an insight as he obviously realized it's pointless to argue with opinionated ramblings.
Opinions don't matter when a death is involved, facts matter. Most of us try to stick to facts only to be bombarded with opinions.
I don't want opinions. I don't care if Davern smoked 30,000 joints the night Natalie died and pissed in the galley sink. It doesn't matter if people "think" he was drunk or "think" he doesn't have a memory. Fact is, he does have recall. He was there and saw what led up to Natalie's death. I don't blame the messenger.

Most of us here want justice for Natalie. We discuss facts, and every time we do, Wagner fans refute with factless information. Sunn has not presented one fact here, just opinion. Gray just keeps asking "What evidence?" Well, how about the evidence of an eyewitness?
Hartbeat, well, sorry, but Hartbeat is chasing rainbows, and not because she has different opinions but because she defends with ludicrous statements the likes of it's perfectly acceptable for Wagner to lie because he was "schooled" to lie. It's utterly senseless to argue that kind of logic. Wagner lied at the horrible death scene of his wife. No one has any legitimate reason to call Davern a liar. He's defintiely my go-to guy in this entire cast. He's the one of three who took a polygraph for ALL of us. He put himself out there to PROVE he's not lying.

Wagner didn't try to save Natalie because he needed time to decide what to tell people when they showed up so that he could protect his image. He has told us this. Davern has told us this. Some people will not accept this for every reason Creed has explained. If Creed's message offended anyone, maybe it's because the shoe fit? Basically, some people aren't willing to give up adoring the suave Jonathan Hart. Now, that's some simple logic.

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Joined: December 16th, 2009, 1:00 am

January 8th, 2010, 7:21 am #2

posted this, too, in original thread
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Joined: December 11th, 2009, 5:35 pm

January 8th, 2010, 12:19 pm #3

I think everyone here should RE-read Creed's original message. Nowhere does he call anyone a Manson worshiper. He only states that Manson has fans, as do many convicted killers.

Wagner is not a convicted killer but his wife died an ugly death, a mystery death, and Wagner has lied so much that there's ample reason to have this case reopened, but some people still make excuses for every questionable action and word this man IS guilty of!

Point is, the light bulb that went off in Creed's head was not presented as an insult, but rather as an insight as he obviously realized it's pointless to argue with opinionated ramblings.
Opinions don't matter when a death is involved, facts matter. Most of us try to stick to facts only to be bombarded with opinions.
I don't want opinions. I don't care if Davern smoked 30,000 joints the night Natalie died and pissed in the galley sink. It doesn't matter if people "think" he was drunk or "think" he doesn't have a memory. Fact is, he does have recall. He was there and saw what led up to Natalie's death. I don't blame the messenger.

Most of us here want justice for Natalie. We discuss facts, and every time we do, Wagner fans refute with factless information. Sunn has not presented one fact here, just opinion. Gray just keeps asking "What evidence?" Well, how about the evidence of an eyewitness?
Hartbeat, well, sorry, but Hartbeat is chasing rainbows, and not because she has different opinions but because she defends with ludicrous statements the likes of it's perfectly acceptable for Wagner to lie because he was "schooled" to lie. It's utterly senseless to argue that kind of logic. Wagner lied at the horrible death scene of his wife. No one has any legitimate reason to call Davern a liar. He's defintiely my go-to guy in this entire cast. He's the one of three who took a polygraph for ALL of us. He put himself out there to PROVE he's not lying.

Wagner didn't try to save Natalie because he needed time to decide what to tell people when they showed up so that he could protect his image. He has told us this. Davern has told us this. Some people will not accept this for every reason Creed has explained. If Creed's message offended anyone, maybe it's because the shoe fit? Basically, some people aren't willing to give up adoring the suave Jonathan Hart. Now, that's some simple logic.
"eyewitness" so if a murder took place which it did not, Drunkvern eyewitnessed Natalie being killed, you should think before you speak jaywalkerdill. Once again show us the evidence, innocent until proven guilty, it has not been proved, words are cheap, yours, Drunkverns, Rulli's. You can blah blah blah till your blue in the face, no one cares not even the media GNGS is dead it's history and a bad example of it.
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Joined: December 16th, 2009, 1:00 am

January 8th, 2010, 3:41 pm #4

What Davern saw and heard (and polygraphed) seems to really bother you doesn't it Gray? It's what plucks most at your nerves, obviously. If the shoe fits...

You wish his book were dead. You wish.
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