23' Inboard Lancer 427 project boat

23' Inboard Lancer 427 project boat

Paul
Paul

August 30th, 2010, 12:04 am #1

Well I got a little time aboard the Lancer today, it sure is a great way to put your mind in neutral and just coast for a while.


Here's the original condition of the strut support and mufflers. The strut support has some sort of a heavy duty steel plate with aluminum spacers, which bring up immediate concerns about dissimilar metals and corrosion. The mufflers are fed by a larger diameter pipe but they are reduced at the outlet side into the original copper pipes. Of course, with a 427 going into this rig the exhaust pipes are going to be a lot bigger.




I pulled out the old mufflers which still look pretty good, but looking inside I see the copper pipe was stuffed so far inside the muffler that it was up against one of the baffles, which is not such a nice thing for performance and efficiency. These mufflers are being set aside as I doubt if they are usable with the 427 concept.



Once I got the mufflers and pipes out of the way I went to work on whatever the heck it was down there holding the strut in place. The nuts came off and I was surprised to see they were silicon bronze, as were the bolts. The aluminum blocks had suffered from corrosion, but the raw steel was really deteriorated badly, and it flaked off.


Here's a close up, bolt looks okay actually, but see all that aluminum oxide, it was once aluminum! And that rust colored stuff was once steel.


Well after a little tapping and the use of a large visegrip, these aluminum blocks actually came free. Thankfully whatever they used in the way of sealant allowed this to break loose, or maybe all the corrosion just let it break. Obviously all of this will be redone in a first class manner. I put two nuts back on one of the bolts, placed the aluminum block on top, and struck it lightly with a hammer, it pushed down nicely so they'll come out.

New helm seats are on the way now, they should be here in Nashville in a day or two. They're Todd seats, and they look very much like the original seats installed in some of the Lancer models. I thought I may as well not put in cheap seats, since this particular boat will probably remain in the family for the duration. Other issues, the 72C Velvet drive has been located for a good price, I just need to get it on the road UPS, stay tuned. That 427 has the same side to side bolt pattern as a small block, amazing!

Regards, later,

Paul














































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Tom Slayton
Tom Slayton

August 30th, 2010, 8:45 pm #2

Looking at those bronze bolts, I can see why they used the spacers, the threads don't go all the way down and a spacer was required. The steel plate has me puzzled, it makes little sense to do that unless you are just too lazy to cut it to size. That is most likely the case, as they appeared to be too lazy to paint it too.

I am curious about the exhaust diameter. You said it was a 3" exhaust pipe going into the muffler but smaller coming out the other side? I can see in the photo they look quite small by comparison, what size is the stock outlet for the small block? Also I am curious what diameter exhaust are you going to be using for the big block?

I saw the notes you posted about the transmissions and I think your choice of going with a Borg Warner is a good one. They make a very good product and that model (72C) is as rugged as any you will find in that power range. In case you have not already seen it, there is a good reference manual available on line here http://www.marinepartsexpress.com/bw_sch_fs.html for these transmissions.

I'm looking forward to seeing your progress with this boat. Better get moving, springtime is only a few months away.

Tom

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Paul
Paul

August 30th, 2010, 9:09 pm #3

Great reference, but quite honestly after seeing the inside of a P-car transaxle, I have no desire to see the inside of any other transmission as long as I live. It costs me way too much money to look.

As for the exhaust, I believe the stock exhaust for the lancer is 2" and my big block setup will have 4" tips from a 3-1/2" pipe from each manifold. Since this will require a reducer I may just run 4" all the way depending on the cost of the reducer and the cost of the larger pipe. That decision is down the road a bit, since I have a variety of mundane issues to solve first, and one heck of a lot of sanding to do fixing nicks and gouges of the past. Oh did I mention the windshield, ha. I'll probably order the transmission next month and once it arrives, then the setup for the motor will really start taking shape. The boat is structurally sound, except for a few pieces of wood here and there of insignificance.

Regards,

Paul
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Paul
Paul

September 5th, 2010, 5:14 pm #4

Well I got a little time aboard the Lancer today, it sure is a great way to put your mind in neutral and just coast for a while.


Here's the original condition of the strut support and mufflers. The strut support has some sort of a heavy duty steel plate with aluminum spacers, which bring up immediate concerns about dissimilar metals and corrosion. The mufflers are fed by a larger diameter pipe but they are reduced at the outlet side into the original copper pipes. Of course, with a 427 going into this rig the exhaust pipes are going to be a lot bigger.




I pulled out the old mufflers which still look pretty good, but looking inside I see the copper pipe was stuffed so far inside the muffler that it was up against one of the baffles, which is not such a nice thing for performance and efficiency. These mufflers are being set aside as I doubt if they are usable with the 427 concept.



Once I got the mufflers and pipes out of the way I went to work on whatever the heck it was down there holding the strut in place. The nuts came off and I was surprised to see they were silicon bronze, as were the bolts. The aluminum blocks had suffered from corrosion, but the raw steel was really deteriorated badly, and it flaked off.


Here's a close up, bolt looks okay actually, but see all that aluminum oxide, it was once aluminum! And that rust colored stuff was once steel.


Well after a little tapping and the use of a large visegrip, these aluminum blocks actually came free. Thankfully whatever they used in the way of sealant allowed this to break loose, or maybe all the corrosion just let it break. Obviously all of this will be redone in a first class manner. I put two nuts back on one of the bolts, placed the aluminum block on top, and struck it lightly with a hammer, it pushed down nicely so they'll come out.

New helm seats are on the way now, they should be here in Nashville in a day or two. They're Todd seats, and they look very much like the original seats installed in some of the Lancer models. I thought I may as well not put in cheap seats, since this particular boat will probably remain in the family for the duration. Other issues, the 72C Velvet drive has been located for a good price, I just need to get it on the road UPS, stay tuned. That 427 has the same side to side bolt pattern as a small block, amazing!

Regards, later,

Paul













































Well I've gotten a little more work done on the 23, only being able to work in short runs but it's fun work. I got a nice pair of Todd Glouster captains chairs delivered, found them at a price that looked pretty good, in relative terms, so I just put them aside for later knowing I'll eventually have to contend with seats. I'll use the vinyl and style off those seats to do the rear seat and engine box cover.

The port side passenger front seat was bolted down like a bank vault. Strange that someone would go to all that trouble and then not install it straight. Hmmmm, the architect mentality, that would be a punchlist item.




I had to use a crowbar supported with a wood block in order to get this plate off. The smell was the unmistakable oder of LifeCaulk polysulfide thankfully, because if 3M 5200 had been used I would not have been able to slowly break the bond, and it would have destroyed the fiberglass getting that metal plate off.

The fiberglass floor shell makes this boat a three piece hull. Normally it would be the bottom piece and the top, but this piece is structural, it is bonded to the sides and it is also foamed to avoid drumming and give a little rigidity. Here I am pointing to the foam, which appears to be an open cell stiff type, used way above the water zone. I did find some foam rubber stuffed into some places that looks like it was done by a former owner and not CC.



Here's a plate I found in the glove box, could not read it at the time, and these photos are by cell phone, so they're not the best but upon blowing them up on the computer screen I actually could read everything.


Maximum persons capacity, pounds 1,800.
Maximum weight capacity, persons and gear pounds, 2075.
Engine and fuel not to exceed 1855 pounds.

So I think the fuel tank is 30 gal, and if a gal is conveniently marked as 10 pounds then we have 300 pounds there.

The motor and transmission for a standard 427 is 1143 pounds with all the iron manifolds, intake, and transmission.

I'm using an aluminum intake at 27 pounds, so that saves 50 pounds right there. In addition I'm using aluminum exhaust manifolds and risers, and I would expect that to save another 50 pounds per side, so the weight of this motor will be around 950 pounds, assuming the Velvet Drive transmission is the same weight as the direct drive Paragon.

Here's going to be some fun, dashboard restoration and re-wiring with new instrumentation.






Upcoming activity will include getting the Velvet Drive transmission shipped to Nashville and the side trim reinforcing pieces cut out (those consist of pieces of marine plywood glassed in behind the vinyl trim boards to serve as a method of holding them in place. They're all rotted out, so I'm going to cut what is left out, and use a little leg of the remaining glass to serve as a starting point for replacement.

I'll be removing the entire nose rail too, as it could provide more service but looks ratty and things like this help make the entire boat look better. Not sure just what will go back, as there are some pretty stock looking pieces available. Also I found the windshield was made by Taylor, and I am hoping they have some of the pieces (extrusions) I need. All said and done, this is fun (but not as much fun as Bill Basler had!!)

Photo below was taken out at our lake house, the day after Jerry Namken brought it from Maryland !



Regards,

Paul



Last edited by FEfinaticP on September 5th, 2010, 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Paul A. Mathias
Paul A. Mathias

September 6th, 2010, 4:49 pm #5

Paul,

I would think that the tank in your lancer is the same as my 1973 lancer that is a 60 gallon tank not 30 gallon. You should see the tank tag when you lift out the well in the rear hatch.

Paul A.
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Paul
Paul

September 7th, 2010, 12:02 am #6

Hi Paul,

Thanks for the note.....

Here is my tank, camera phone photo.



Here is an inboard Lancer now in Sweden, owned by Rickard, showing his original condition fuel tank. It looks the same as mine.





I looked at my tank and could find no tags of any kind. Does this look original to you, same as yours? I may well have underestimated the fuel capacity, and I would be thrilled if it really was a 60 oh yeah!

Regards,

Paul






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Glenn
Glenn

September 7th, 2010, 12:47 am #7

Paul,

That sure is a pretty S.S. tank you have. Did you put that in?

Glenn
FDA-36-039
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Paul
Paul

September 7th, 2010, 12:51 am #8

Hi Glenn,

I guess I could give it the scratch test to see if it is soft like aluminum. The tank looks stock although you can't tell when someone builds an exact clone, so I don't know if this is original or if someone replaced it with a clone. Looking at the file photos we have here in the archives, it looks pretty much lilke the one Rickard has, coloration in these photos is misleading so we can't really rely on that. The tank has absolutely no proof numbers or text of any kind, and it would appear a manufactured tank by CC would have some sort of ID number or something. This one has nothing. What do you think?

Paul A., this one look like yours?

Regards,

Paul
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Kevin
Kevin

September 7th, 2010, 1:58 am #9

Great reference, but quite honestly after seeing the inside of a P-car transaxle, I have no desire to see the inside of any other transmission as long as I live. It costs me way too much money to look.

As for the exhaust, I believe the stock exhaust for the lancer is 2" and my big block setup will have 4" tips from a 3-1/2" pipe from each manifold. Since this will require a reducer I may just run 4" all the way depending on the cost of the reducer and the cost of the larger pipe. That decision is down the road a bit, since I have a variety of mundane issues to solve first, and one heck of a lot of sanding to do fixing nicks and gouges of the past. Oh did I mention the windshield, ha. I'll probably order the transmission next month and once it arrives, then the setup for the motor will really start taking shape. The boat is structurally sound, except for a few pieces of wood here and there of insignificance.

Regards,

Paul
As you know Paul, it is all about air. An engine is an air pump. Go with the max on air all the way around, can't hurt

Kevin
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Paul A Mathias
Paul A Mathias

September 7th, 2010, 3:16 am #10

Hi Glenn,

I guess I could give it the scratch test to see if it is soft like aluminum. The tank looks stock although you can't tell when someone builds an exact clone, so I don't know if this is original or if someone replaced it with a clone. Looking at the file photos we have here in the archives, it looks pretty much lilke the one Rickard has, coloration in these photos is misleading so we can't really rely on that. The tank has absolutely no proof numbers or text of any kind, and it would appear a manufactured tank by CC would have some sort of ID number or something. This one has nothing. What do you think?

Paul A., this one look like yours?

Regards,

Paul
Paul,
In the 1st lancer I had the tank was monel. My current ORB-23 the tank is galvanized. That one looks like it could be monel.

Paul A.
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